The Sarge:
The Sarge:
OK, how about -
How many people have paid you either £30, £25 or £5? Not existing membership (because apparently that figure is a state secret)
How much do you still have outstanding on the cash that you have laid out?
Do you have a separate bank account for PDU-UK’s income and expenditure (not necessarily a business account)?Are you going to answer? Or are you ignoring me for asking questions you don’t want to answer? The answer to these two questions should speak volumes.
Barrie Tozer:
The-Snowman:
If you only have 30-40p left from the £5 membership fee, why the need for the initial £25 fee? What was the other £20.20 going to be used for?Not avoiding this and will answer tomorrow
Still no answer to this?
To follow up to the above, your own posts have shown that you have been asking for membership across the past financial year. Where can the accounts be seen?
You have admitted that uptake has been very low, so how many members are paid up to the PDU-UK?
How many members paid up the previous £30 and £25 per annum amounts? How many people didnt receive their “refunds”?
You say the PDU-UK is fully accountable so therefore this should be easy to answer.
Now you proclaim to be against the dCPC so therefore…
Why did you organise a protest of the dCPC in 2012 some three years AFTER it came into force? Numerous years after it was ever thought up off?
Oh and just how much were your dCPC training modules again?
How long is “lifetime” in the eyes of the PDU-UK?
Who gets to decide who is in what role of your Union? When can we see the results?I assume from your earlier comment, regarding using the name “Truckersworld”, to open doors etc that you haven’t been using this recently?
After all on the last point, you have updated YOUR posts to state that truckersworld has attended meetings not PDU-UK?
Herongate:
Barrie Tozer:
Herongate:
Herongate:
I managed to read to page 7/8 before starting to lose track of which questions were being asked and answered, and therefore losing interest!!!You state you have had various meetings with bodies, MSA Directors, RDC owners etc - could you please post copies of the formal minutes of these meetings or a link to where they can be read. This would allow potential & existing members to see what discussions have taken place, the quality of those discussions, the next steps / actions to be taken & by whom.
Many of these meetings go back a long way so It would take a long time to produce all that it entailed, lets just say achievements were obtained for Drivers, like £3m spent on new showers at Welcome Break Services, Some MSAs changing the priority for truckes on exits due to blind spots, Tesco opening up their waiting rooms from a little slot in a window. The past achievements are not important. We now need to work on changing future improvements and it takes time from opening the door to presenting a good proposal.
Plus even though you have stated this is a non-profit organisation, could you post or provide a link too a set of audited accounts. This would show potential & existing members where their money has been spent, what surplus is currently available for future development & reinvestment. It maybe non-profit, but you still need to justify & evidence the financial side of your organisation.
Accounts are in place,but a with any organisation nothing is available for audit until after its first year
Thank you
Hi, third time now of asking these two questions this morning - would appreciate a response. If you expect drivers to join you, you need to be open & transparent so informed decisions can be made.
PS, 10 or more are posting questions and I am answering as fast as I can
Thank you for responding - although strange I had to ask 3 times, when others were answered much quicker.
Despite what you say, past performance & achievements are important as they show if your organisation is capable of actually getting results or not. How many of the improvements you list are 100% down to your actions? How many of them where down to others? Shower refurb - companies don’t just spend £3m without planning and budgeting, so could have been in planning stages along time before you came along. Exit road layouts are agreed with Highways / Government, and not down to the individual MSA. Therefore documented minutes would show what you have actually achieved and what you are working towards with various different departments / organisations you are meeting with.
It would take a book to account all I have done in the past, so for argument sake lets just say I have done nothing
What the PDU might do in the future is more relevant and that can only come about with many more involved and hopefully some more with more scope of experience and intellect than just meAccounts - should be done monthly income v expenditure etc; therefore you should be able & willing to publish these.
Does the £5 go into your bank account or a PDU bank account?
If you do not believe me about money matters then that is your perogative, all I can say is that things are in order
The Sarge:
The Sarge:
The Sarge:
OK, how about -
How many people have paid you either £30, £25 or £5? Not existing membership (because apparently that figure is a state secret)
How much do you still have outstanding on the cash that you have laid out?
Do you have a separate bank account for PDU-UK’s income and expenditure (not necessarily a business account)?Are you going to answer? Or are you ignoring me for asking questions you don’t want to answer? The answer to these two questions should speak volumes.
All income received by the PDU goes into a seperate bank account which was set up before launching and is accountable
tonka236:
Barrie Tozer:
The-Snowman:
If you only have 30-40p left from the £5 membership fee, why the need for the initial £25 fee? What was the other £20.20 going to be used for?Not avoiding this and will answer tomorrow
Still no answer to this?
To follow up to the above, your own posts have shown that you have been asking for membership across the past financial year. Where can the accounts be seen?
You have admitted that uptake has been very low, so how many members are paid up to the PDU-UK?
How many members paid up the previous £30 and £25 per annum amounts? How many people didnt receive their “refunds”?
You say the PDU-UK is fully accountable so therefore this should be easy to answer.Now you proclaim to be against the dCPC so therefore…
Why did you organise a protest of the dCPC in 2012 some three years AFTER it came into force? Numerous years after it was ever thought up off?
Oh and just how much were your dCPC training modules again?
How long is “lifetime” in the eyes of the PDU-UK?
Who gets to decide who is in what role of your Union? When can we see the results?I assume from your earlier comment, regarding using the name “Truckersworld”, to open doors etc that you haven’t been using this recently?
After all on the last point, you have updated YOUR posts to state that truckersworld has attended meetings not PDU-UK?
As stated previously I will ignore your questions as you continually bring up events from years ago and of no relevance.
As such I will no longer even read your post
I am answering everyone else questions so please continue
Must go and do some other stuff as the Mrs is nattering
I hope now you respect I am trying to answer your questions and think I am keeping up
Talk more soon
thanks
Barrie Tozer:
The Sarge:
The Sarge:
The Sarge:
OK, how about -
How many people have paid you either £30, £25 or £5? Not existing membership (because apparently that figure is a state secret)
How much do you still have outstanding on the cash that you have laid out?
Do you have a separate bank account for PDU-UK’s income and expenditure (not necessarily a business account)?Are you going to answer? Or are you ignoring me for asking questions you don’t want to answer? The answer to these two questions should speak volumes.
All income received by the PDU goes into a seperate bank account which was set up before launching and is accountable
One down, two to go. Also, who is the account accountable to? And, who approached whom about this Q&A? Did Rikki approach you, or did you approach Rikki?
Your complete lack of openness & transparency has just cost you one potential member; you can’t answer simple questions honestly and to the satisfaction of the person asking and have no evidence to back up your claims. I didn’t say I didn’t believe you, I just asked where is the proof / evidence - which you are unable or unwilling to provide. How do you expect to be taken seriously by Government departments, multi national companies etc when you can’t even be honest & open with the people you are claiming to represent■■? I’m out.
Noting can be done overnight, no specifics can be answered, the PDU is just a way that we can bring it all together to allow good communication, work on the issues and then try to sort them out.
…
That is not the answer I expected. There is no strategy at the moment. I am shocked. Without causing offence I would have thought this would all have been well planned out in advance of the launch. A kind of manifesto of what you are intending to do how you are planning to do it with every detail explained.Who you will be holding discussions with over a period of time and how they can help. This should have been done and it looks like it is just that everything will be done on an ad hoc basis. Stunned I am.
I know nothing can happen overnight but it can only happen with planning and expertise.Without that nothing can be achieved. So the PDU at the moment is just looking for numbers before anything else an happen… Shocked again. People are being asked to sign up to a unity nothing more nothing less at the minute. It looks to me like this is just a feeler for unity and if you get enough members then it may move on to something else. For people to sign up to an unknown strategy is not a good idea.
Thanks for your honest answer anyway but I don’t think it is enough to accumulate a good membership. Nobody knows anything about the future strategy. There was no forward planning at all just get members first and then do something. That is not the way to do something like this.
Barrie Tozer:
tonka236:
Barrie Tozer:
The-Snowman:
If you only have 30-40p left from the £5 membership fee, why the need for the initial £25 fee? What was the other £20.20 going to be used for?Not avoiding this and will answer tomorrow
Still no answer to this?
To follow up to the above, your own posts have shown that you have been asking for membership across the past financial year. Where can the accounts be seen?
You have admitted that uptake has been very low, so how many members are paid up to the PDU-UK?
How many members paid up the previous £30 and £25 per annum amounts? How many people didnt receive their “refunds”?
You say the PDU-UK is fully accountable so therefore this should be easy to answer.Now you proclaim to be against the dCPC so therefore…
Why did you organise a protest of the dCPC in 2012 some three years AFTER it came into force? Numerous years after it was ever thought up off?
Oh and just how much were your dCPC training modules again?
How long is “lifetime” in the eyes of the PDU-UK?
Who gets to decide who is in what role of your Union? When can we see the results?I assume from your earlier comment, regarding using the name “Truckersworld”, to open doors etc that you haven’t been using this recently?
After all on the last point, you have updated YOUR posts to state that truckersworld has attended meetings not PDU-UK?
As stated previously I will ignore your questions as you continually bring up events from years ago and of no relevance.
As such I will no longer even read your postI am answering everyone else questions so please continue
Just of interest are you ignoring me for asking the question or because the question relates to money and legalities of the PDU?
The question will continue to be asked in the hope that the answer sheds light on numerous points.
You openly admit you have campaigned for numerous years. Some of those years have resulted in you asking for money. As you say the PDU is full accountable, therefore it shouldnt take long to show how many members have joined by the money taken in by the PDU.
The greatest claim to date, since 2002, is helping a driver get his money by writing a letter. But of course the PDU wont be getting involved in work based issues. So that nullifies the previous victory surely?
The questions also help to shed light on the £35000 plus wage your website seeks.
Oh and…
Sometimes those in positions of authority need to inform Truckers of new rule or regulation.
This can easily be achieved by signing up to their notifications and their blog. But here is the best thing… ITS FREE!
So remind me again why I would want to pay a £5 joining fee for an aspect you offer which can be achieved FOC 
volvo2:
Noting can be done overnight, no specifics can be answered, the PDU is just a way that we can bring it all together to allow good communication, work on the issues and then try to sort them out.
…
That is not the answer I expected. There is no strategy at the moment. I am shocked. Without causing offence I would have thought this would all have been well planned out in advance of the launch. A kind of manifesto of what you are intending to do how you are planning to do it with every detail explained.Who you will be holding discussions with over a period of time and how they can help. This should have been done and it looks like it is just that everything will be done on an ad hoc basis. Stunned I am.I know nothing can happen overnight but it can only happen with planning and expertise.Without that nothing can be achieved. So the PDU at the moment is just looking for numbers before anything else an happen… Shocked again. People are being asked to sign up to a unity nothing more nothing less at the minute. It looks to me like this is just a feeler for unity and if you get enough members then it may move on to something else. For people to sign up to an unknown strategy is not a good idea.
Thanks for your honest answer anyway but I don’t think it is enough to accumulate a good membership. Nobody knows anything about the future strategy. There was no forward planning at all just get members first and then do something. That is not the way to do something like this.
A fair post in some aspects
The point is though instead of criticism of no forward planning. 
The PDU wants others to be involved in the forward planning. 
The forward planning should rightly involve those that it involves.
Some criticise for being a one man band and then expect that same one man to have done all the forward planning.
Then get blamed for not asking others first.
In some peoples eyes whatever the PDU is trying to do will never be good enough to them, but instead of getting involved and make it good enough they can only criticise it.
Says a lot why we are so divided and never have any say within this Industry.
Many have said to me 
“Why do you bother to try and help drivers when they will not help themselves?”
Then
When someone actually tries to do something receives mostly criticism.
I could go back over this forum and find 1000s of quotes about complaints, moans and groans about many different things in the Industry, yet does anyone do anything?
Just maybe the unions stopped helping drivers because they gave up on them due to the attitude within.
Drivers have been treated like crap for years, a slow decline in decent provision and conditions, a slowdown in decent wages, and it will continue because there is no one in place to stop it happening.
Rikki
Thank you for allowing this open topic
I gave up a weekend to talk to others. 107 replies mostly to answering questions.
I am wasting my time and will go back to where those are offering involvement, help and support, maybe the PDU will or will not continue. Some prefer it closed just for their own justification.
I accept criticism, but some will never accept me admitting to mistakes and trying to improve.
If it closes, then how Drivers will ever get any improvements is a question some should ask.
Thank you to some on here for an interesting discussion and some for now joining the PDU
Regards and safe driving
Awww, Barrie - I’m dissappointed in you. I thought you would let this get to at least page 15 before throwing a hissy-fit 
Still, you did get around to answering two of the questions I put to you. That’s more than many posters got…
Herongate:
Your complete lack of openness & transparency has just cost you one potential member; you can’t answer simple questions honestly and to the satisfaction of the person asking and have no evidence to back up your claims. I didn’t say I didn’t believe you, I just asked where is the proof / evidence - which you are unable or unwilling to provide. How do you expect to be taken seriously by Government departments, multi national companies etc when you can’t even be honest & open with the people you are claiming to represent■■? I’m out.
herongate im with you mate off to the pub sunday dinner and a cpl pints of marstones
Let’s cut to the chase…this has just a massive PR exercise for you hasn’t it Barrie?
You had no intention of answering any questions of substance, and have just responded with insults and rhetoric, rather than facts and evidence.
How you can claim that this dubious setup is ‘accountable’ whilst refusing to divulge how many members you have, details of how the accountability is structured or even the reason why you are refusing to tell us how many members you have.
You say you have ‘good reason’ for not saying, but offer nothing to back this up, or even give the reader some confidence that you genuinely do have such a reason.
You evade simple questions, when people repeat them you accuse them of attacking you and wanting your scheme to fail…and yet you expect us to take you at face value for having a ‘good reason’?
You are either very naive, or more likely, very manipulative and very very wary of revealing too much of your poorly thought out scheme which judged by what you have posted in here seems to have the main aim of separating drivers from £5.
Back in 2005 you met with the Transport Director Alex Laffey, from Tesco. You were worried about the conditions that the drivers were forced to endure while delivering to their sites. Can you expand on how you improved the situation for drivers with Tesco RDC’s over the past ten years?
In August 2006, you met with the leaders of the Motorway service areas along with the then Transport Minister Stephen Ladyman, the Home Secretary John Reid and other Cabinet members. These are extremely high profile members and to get your cause in front of them was a good achievement in itself. Your issues were the poor state of facilities and lack of security for HGV drivers using MSA’s, can you provide any evidence of improvement resulting from your involvement within the past ten years? Reading the topics on Trucknet, this problem has not only continued, but alas has gotten worse. This followed on from a campaign in 2004 where you stated that there were 246,000 drivers and only six (6) had made representation of support with your complaints.
It is very clear that you have been a staunch campaigner to better the conditions for drivers over many years. You have had some success in getting your message across to the relevant people, however that success can only be measured by the long term improvements that you have called for. As we are still discussing the very same issues over ten years down the line can only suggest that the high profile meetings you attended were nothing short of a PR exercise for those involved. Now it may be that if you had the backing of a large membership of like minded folk, things could well have been different today. We will never know. What is clear however, you have not managed to gather any kind of support from the very people that you want to help.
Now I am not saying that what you are trying to do wrong, in fact I think you have some extremely valid points. But I feel that your past performance and results, your obvious lack of leadership qualities, your erratic mood swings and lack of openness and accountability have pushed many people to hold you in a position of suspicion. You are in a catch 22 situation, you need members to support you in your cause and you need to prove to members that your cause can work.
DonutUK:
Let’s cut to the chase…this has just a massive PR exercise for you hasn’t it Barrie?You had no intention of answering any questions of substance, and have just responded with insults and rhetoric, rather than facts and evidence.
How you can claim that this dubious setup is ‘accountable’ whilst refusing to divulge how many members you have, details of how the accountability is structured or even the reason why you are refusing to tell us how many members you have.
You say you have ‘good reason’ for not saying, but offer nothing to back this up, or even give the reader some confidence that you genuinely do have such a reason.
You evade simple questions, when people repeat them you accuse them of attacking you and wanting your scheme to fail…and yet you expect us to take you at face value for having a ‘good reason’?
You are either very naive, or more likely, very manipulative and very very wary of revealing too much of your poorly thought out scheme which judged by what you have posted in here seems to have the main aim of separating drivers from £5.
Cut to the chase or the truth?
Most have not bothered to even look for where the answers have been given 107 of them
I have given answers without rhetoric or insult, yet many have not offered the same in return.
So much easier to give criticism without foundation than to do anything constructive.
It is easy and just a few words on a keyboard to make anyone or anything look bad, but how many of those have ever done anything to try and help other drivers?
Some are good at talk and do nothing.
Others talk and try to do something.
Honked:
Back in 2005 you met with the Transport Director Alex Laffey, from Tesco. You were worried about the conditions that the drivers were forced to endure while delivering to their sites. Can you expand on how you improved the situation for drivers with Tesco RDC’s over the past ten years?In August 2006, you met with the leaders of the Motorway service areas along with the then Transport Minister Stephen Ladyman, the Home Secretary John Reid and other Cabinet members. These are extremely high profile members and to get your cause in front of them was a good achievement in itself. Your issues were the poor state of facilities and lack of security for HGV drivers using MSA’s, can you provide any evidence of improvement resulting from your involvement within the past ten years? Reading the topics on Trucknet, this problem has not only continued, but alas has gotten worse. This followed on from a campaign in 2004 where you stated that there were 246,000 drivers and only six (6) had made representation of support with your complaints.
It is very clear that you have been a staunch campaigner to better the conditions for drivers over many years. You have had some success in getting your message across to the relevant people, however that success can only be measured by the long term improvements that you have called for. As we are still discussing the very same issues over ten years down the line can only suggest that the high profile meetings you attended were nothing short of a PR exercise for those involved. Now it may be that if you had the backing of a large membership of like minded folk, things could well have been different today. We will never know. What is clear however, you have not managed to gather any kind of support from the very people that you want to help.
Now I am not saying that what you are trying to do wrong, in fact I think you have some extremely valid points. But I feel that your past performance and results, your obvious lack of leadership qualities, your erratic mood swings and lack of openness and accountability have pushed many people to hold you in a position of suspicion. You are in a catch 22 situation, you need members to support you in your cause and you need to prove to members that your cause can work.
In some aspects you have answered your own postings.
I managed to open the doors to these high profile meetings (and yes I did get some improvements)
What I lacked in to continue with these meetings to get those improvements was any support from Drivers who wanted them.
Am I to blame for failing or are Drivers for not helping?
But surely a Q and A session will throw up questions both good and bad, some easy to answer some that cant be answered just yet.
Even some old skeletons may rear their head such is the nature of a virtual environment.
What matters is staying power, more members can be won over by sticking with it, the easiest thing to do is just leave or cause a thread lock. Better to play the long game, learn from past misstakes and dont be put off by the tough questions.
Credit is definately due for giving up your time to come here but dont treat this thread as a race more a long haul, stop by from time to time as and when you see fit.
I for one am still on the fence but the 20% potential discount on a new sat nav is appealing, but then im a selfish bugger.
"OK, how about -
How many people have paid you either £30, £25 or £5? Not existing membership (because apparently that figure is a state secret)
How much do you still have outstanding on the cash that you have laid out?
Do you have a separate bank account for PDU-UK’s income and expenditure (not necessarily a business account)?
Are you going to answer? Or are you ignoring me for asking questions you don’t want to answer? The answer to these two questions should speak volumes.
All income received by the PDU goes into a seperate bank account which was set up before launching and is accountable
One down, two to go. Also, who is the account accountable to? And, who approached whom about this Q&A? Did Rikki approach you, or did you approach Rikki?"