The Army - the tories industrial boot boys!

UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUMS THE UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUM (INTERACTIVE)
81

damoq:

att:

bubsy06:

muckles:
I don’t really get those who criticise the tanker drivers for trying to maintain their term and conditions of employment, especialy when they then say that the tanker drivers are better off than them.

Surely the question isn’t “why should the tanker drivers get better terms and conditions than me, but why haven’t I got the terms and conditions of the tanker drivers?”

they are on 45k a year yet want more, comprende :wink:
Problem with the UK people always expect more :unamused:

The problem with Brits…They always show the green eyed monster and try and drag you down to their level :imp: Their own bloody worst enemy.

I’m not jealous of tanker drivers one bit. Good on them. Like most folk have been saying, they have fought for what they have today. But in these tough times, why can’t they just appreciate what they have right now and realise how lucky they are!!! :neutral_face:

If they sit back and appreciate what they have, they might not still have it in a years time and be on a race to minimum terms and conditions like the rest of general haulage.

82

muckles:

damoq:

att:

bubsy06:

muckles:
I don’t really get those who criticise the tanker drivers for trying to maintain their term and conditions of employment, especialy when they then say that the tanker drivers are better off than them.

Surely the question isn’t “why should the tanker drivers get better terms and conditions than me, but why haven’t I got the terms and conditions of the tanker drivers?”

they are on 45k a year yet want more, comprende :wink:
Problem with the UK people always expect more :unamused:

The problem with Brits…They always show the green eyed monster and try and drag you down to their level :imp: Their own bloody worst enemy.

I’m not jealous of tanker drivers one bit. Good on them. Like most folk have been saying, they have fought for what they have today. But in these tough times, why can’t they just appreciate what they have right now and realise how lucky they are!!! :neutral_face:

If they sit back and appreciate what they have, they might not still have it in a years time and be on a race to minimum terms and conditions like the rest of general haulage.

Like I said, times are tough and it isn’t going to get better any time soon. Alot of us have had to make sacrifices to pay and conditions to stay in work and survive. What makes tanker drivers different? We all know how oil/fuel dependent the place is and the tanker drivers know this too well and will take advantage of it! Fair play to them if they get what they want though. :cry:

83

they are on 45k a year yet want more, comprende
Problem with the UK people always expect more

once again busby, they ate NOT in dispute for more money…just trying to keep what they have got…comprende!

but if it makes you happy to peddle your ire…carry on trolling

84

del949:

they are on 45k a year yet want more, comprende
Problem with the UK people always expect more

once again busby, they ate NOT in dispute for more money…just trying to keep what they have got…comprende!

but if it makes you happy to peddle your ire…carry on trolling

So why are you striking■■? you get £45k a year do ■■■■ all hours

85

bubsy06:

muckles:
I don’t really get those who criticise the tanker drivers for trying to maintain their term and conditions of employment, especialy when they then say that the tanker drivers are better off than them.

Surely the question isn’t “why should the tanker drivers get better terms and conditions than me, but why haven’t I got the terms and conditions of the tanker drivers?”

they are on 45k a year yet want more, comprende :wink:
Problem with the UK people always expect more :unamused:

Not without a handy bit of O/T they’re not and if the gaffers get their way they’ll have even less for you to be jealous of…they only have what they have because in the past they fought for it unlike the yellow livered green eyed steering wheel attendants we’ve got on here. Keep taking it up the arse if you want but don’t deny a working man who is not willing to.

86

bubsy06:

del949:

they are on 45k a year yet want more, comprende
Problem with the UK people always expect more

once again busby, they ate NOT in dispute for more money…just trying to keep what they have got…comprende!

but if it makes you happy to peddle your ire…carry on trolling

So why are you striking■■? you get £45k a year do [zb] all hours

There’s that green eyed monster again…

87

44 Tonne Ton:

bubsy06:

del949:

they are on 45k a year yet want more, comprende
Problem with the UK people always expect more

once again busby, they ate NOT in dispute for more money…just trying to keep what they have got…comprende!

but if it makes you happy to peddle your ire…carry on trolling

So why are you striking■■? you get £45k a year do [zb] all hours

There’s that green eyed monster again…

Of course, some folks should appreciate what they have.
I dont have the luxury of striking for more £££, If I strike I lose my job. Its easier just to find a job you like and that pays you a rate you are happy with, dont take a job then start whining that you dont get paid enough :unamused:
I bet there are plenty of drivers on here that would snap at a chance of driving a tanker whatever the current or future conditions.
If anything they should get less, they do ■■■■ all work :unamused:

88

But in these tough times, why can’t they just appreciate what they have right now and realise how lucky they are!!! :neutral_face:
[/quote]
In all fairness they do appreciate what they have, they have very good jobs that’s not disputed, but once the terms and conditions start to be eroded it won’t stop. Companies like Stobart, Turners and the like are looking at getting a better foot hold in the industry and they pay a lot less and won’t honour the pensions. These guys only want to ensure they don’t loose the pensions they are paying into and don’t have any pay cuts.

These are terms and conditions that have been agreed over many years by both the drivers and management, but now the oil companies want the job done cheaper (ring any bells?) so the major players like Wincanton, DHL and Hoyer will have to start looking for savings so they can retain the contracts, but if TUPE and pensions are guaranteed any company coming into the industry would have to honour the terms & conditions, thus not being able to cut the job up, and the more reputable companies would be able to tender at a reasonable rate. Nobody wants a pay cut, everybody lives to their earnings, and a 20% pay cut would hurt anybody.

89

busby, do you have trouble understanding the previous posts?
They are not in dispute for more money, they are in dispute trying to keep their wages at there present level.
As you say, you are likely to get sacked if you strike…they are no different, they run the risk of being sacked also, unlike most however they appear to have the balls to take it on board.
and as far as your question…

So why are you striking■■? you get £45k a year do [zb] all hours

I’m not striking, I am retired and at peace with the world. God Bless

90

bubsy06:

44 Tonne Ton:

bubsy06:

del949:

they are on 45k a year yet want more, comprende
Problem with the UK people always expect more

once again busby, they ate NOT in dispute for more money…just trying to keep what they have got…comprende!

but if it makes you happy to peddle your ire…carry on trolling

So why are you striking■■? you get £45k a year do [zb] all hours

There’s that green eyed monster again…

Of course, some folks should appreciate what they have.
I dont have the luxury of striking for more £££, If I strike I lose my job. Its easier just to find a job you like and that pays you a rate you are happy with, dont take a job then start whining that you dont get paid enough :unamused:
I bet there are plenty of drivers on here that would snap at a chance of driving a tanker whatever the current or future conditions.
If anything they should get less, they do [zb] all work :unamused:

The tanker drivers did take a job they were happy with and they aren’t whining about not getting paid enough to do it.That’s also been the case in most of the industrial disputes through history.

However having said that the terms and conditions that they are now trying to defend have been the result of sticking together over the years to improve terms and conditions in small increments over a long period of time just as many other sectors of industry did.That was before Callaghan then chucked all those hard won living standards away by giving the place over to Thatcher.

If people don’t strive to improve living standards and then consolidate those improvements by keeping those gains in line with inflation it just zb’s the country’s general economic growth rate up which is exactly where we are now.

91

I wish carryfast would stop posting things that i agree with :smiley:

92

del949:
busby, do you have trouble understanding the previous posts?
They are not in dispute for more money, they are in dispute trying to keep their wages at there present level.
As you say, you are likely to get sacked if you strike…they are no different, they run the risk of being sacked also, unlike most however they appear to have the balls to take it on board.

Think that’s always been the case all through history del.Until the late 1960’s and early 1970’s when the combination of relatively high employment and the example of a union membership which was made up of many ex WW2 conscripts who knew what sticking together to win means put the fear of god into the employers which reduced that threat massively. :smiling_imp:

That was until all the bs propaganda about ‘excessive union power’ by the employers and the establishment all started and then many workers started to believe it themselves. :open_mouth: :unamused:

93

bubsy06:

44 Tonne Ton:

bubsy06:

del949:

they are on 45k a year yet want more, comprende
Problem with the UK people always expect more

once again busby, they ate NOT in dispute for more money…just trying to keep what they have got…comprende!

but if it makes you happy to peddle your ire…carry on trolling

So why are you striking■■? you get £45k a year do [zb] all hours

There’s that green eyed monster again…

Of course, some folks should appreciate what they have.
I dont have the luxury of striking for more £££, If I strike I lose my job. Its easier just to find a job you like and that pays you a rate you are happy with, dont take a job then start whining that you dont get paid enough :unamused:
I bet there are plenty of drivers on here that would snap at a chance of driving a tanker whatever the current or future conditions.
If anything they should get less, they do [zb] all work :unamused:

Bloody hell, no wonder we’re going ever further round the U bend.

I had a lovely shiny tank on this morning, the truck and trailer alloy wheels were glittering lovely in the sun.

I’ll return my exhorbitant salary when it turns up next month, i should really be paying them for the privelidge of driving the thing then.

Good lads stuck together as a union and fought for good pay and conditions, and some here would much rather we were all on minimum wage and ■■■■ away the ground that was hard won.

Part of the reason tanks and transporters are better paid is responsibility, bollox up with either and the results are expensive and can be catastrophic, they don’t employ just anyone and if you ain’t up to it you’ll soon come to the companies attention and goodbye.

They pay the good money because they can pick and choose staff.

I did many years on the car transporters, every now and again the company would employ a numpty or two, before many weeks were out the damage bills could be staggering, and quality customers do not put up with it.

We as drivers always took the view that it never did the company any harm to have the odd pillock every so often, they would get complacent and assume that any twerp with a licence could do it, £50k+ upwards in damage in a week soon revised that view.

Damage easily done on tanks, plus far more physical danger to life and limb for shoddy practice and incompetence.

Tanks and other specialist work are not an area to allow monkeys in so peanuts are not paid.

94

Juddian:

bubsy06:

44 Tonne Ton:

bubsy06:

del949:

they are on 45k a year yet want more, comprende
Problem with the UK people always expect more

once again busby, they ate NOT in dispute for more money…just trying to keep what they have got…comprende!

but if it makes you happy to peddle your ire…carry on trolling

So why are you striking■■? you get £45k a year do [zb] all hours

There’s that green eyed monster again…

Of course, some folks should appreciate what they have.
I dont have the luxury of striking for more £££, If I strike I lose my job. Its easier just to find a job you like and that pays you a rate you are happy with, dont take a job then start whining that you dont get paid enough :unamused:
I bet there are plenty of drivers on here that would snap at a chance of driving a tanker whatever the current or future conditions.
If anything they should get less, they do [zb] all work :unamused:

Bloody hell, no wonder we’re going ever further round the U bend.

I had a lovely shiny tank on this morning, the truck and trailer alloy wheels were glittering lovely in the sun.

I’ll return my exhorbitant salary when it turns up next month, i should really be paying them for the privelidge of driving the thing then.

Good lads stuck together as a union and fought for good pay and conditions, and some here would much rather we were all on minimum wage and ■■■■ away the ground that was hard won.

Part of the reason tanks and transporters are better paid is responsibility, bollox up with either and the results are expensive and can be catastrophic, they don’t employ just anyone and if you ain’t up to it you’ll soon come to the companies attention and goodbye.

They pay the good money because they can pick and choose staff.

I did many years on the car transporters, every now and again the company would employ a numpty or two, before many weeks were out the damage bills could be staggering, and quality customers do not put up with it.

We as drivers always took the view that it never did the company any harm to have the odd pillock every so often, they would get complacent and assume that any twerp with a licence could do it, £50k+ upwards in damage in a week soon revised that view.

Damage easily done on tanks, plus far more physical danger to life and limb for shoddy practice and incompetence.

Tanks and other specialist work are not an area to allow monkeys in so peanuts are not paid.

Monkeys still like steak though

95

bubsy06:

Juddian:

bubsy06:

44 Tonne Ton:

bubsy06:

del949:

they are on 45k a year yet want more, comprende
Problem with the UK people always expect more

once again busby, they ate NOT in dispute for more money…just trying to keep what they have got…comprende!

but if it makes you happy to peddle your ire…carry on trolling

So why are you striking■■? you get £45k a year do [zb] all hours

There’s that green eyed monster again…

Of course, some folks should appreciate what they have.
I dont have the luxury of striking for more £££, If I strike I lose my job. Its easier just to find a job you like and that pays you a rate you are happy with, dont take a job then start whining that you dont get paid enough :unamused:
I bet there are plenty of drivers on here that would snap at a chance of driving a tanker whatever the current or future conditions.
If anything they should get less, they do [zb] all work :unamused:

Bloody hell, no wonder we’re going ever further round the U bend.

I had a lovely shiny tank on this morning, the truck and trailer alloy wheels were glittering lovely in the sun.

I’ll return my exhorbitant salary when it turns up next month, i should really be paying them for the privelidge of driving the thing then.

Good lads stuck together as a union and fought for good pay and conditions, and some here would much rather we were all on minimum wage and ■■■■ away the ground that was hard won.

Part of the reason tanks and transporters are better paid is responsibility, bollox up with either and the results are expensive and can be catastrophic, they don’t employ just anyone and if you ain’t up to it you’ll soon come to the companies attention and goodbye.

They pay the good money because they can pick and choose staff.

I did many years on the car transporters, every now and again the company would employ a numpty or two, before many weeks were out the damage bills could be staggering, and quality customers do not put up with it.

We as drivers always took the view that it never did the company any harm to have the odd pillock every so often, they would get complacent and assume that any twerp with a licence could do it, £50k+ upwards in damage in a week soon revised that view.

Damage easily done on tanks, plus far more physical danger to life and limb for shoddy practice and incompetence.

Tanks and other specialist work are not an area to allow monkeys in so peanuts are not paid.

Monkeys still like steak though

And so they should, so they should take a leaf out the tanker drivers handbook, unionise themselves and stick together, use collective bargaining and gradually improve pay and conditions.

We’ve turned the clock back a good twenty years over the past 3 or 4 and it’s not over yet in my humble, so there is much lost ground to be made up.

96

Juddian:
Part of the reason tanks and transporters are better paid is responsibility, bollox up with either and the results are expensive and can be catastrophic, they don’t employ just anyone and if you ain’t up to it you’ll soon come to the companies attention and goodbye.

They pay the good money because they can pick and choose staff.

I did many years on the car transporters, every now and again the company would employ a numpty or two, before many weeks were out the damage bills could be staggering, and quality customers do not put up with it.

We as drivers always took the view that it never did the company any harm to have the odd pillock every so often, they would get complacent and assume that any twerp with a licence could do it, £50k+ upwards in damage in a week soon revised that view.

Damage easily done on tanks, plus far more physical danger to life and limb for shoddy practice and incompetence.

Tanks and other specialist work are not an area to allow monkeys in so peanuts are not paid.

I don’t think any reasonable man would dispute that it’s a highly responsible job and merits a decent wage. I still maintain though that they should be careful not to push things too far regarding pay and conditions; public opinion is a fickle thing and in an era of constant belt-tightening it could well be portrayed as downright selfishness by the media, with the knock-on effect of encouraging the public to be more anti-lorry in general if that were possible.

As I said earlier, drivers of LPG tankers don’t seem to be in a state of constant disagreement with their employers and I wouldn’t think their job is any less risky.

What peeves a lot of people (with a certain element of justification) is that those same unions who’ll do anything for fuel tanker drivers won’t get out of bed for blokes on general haulage, or shop floor workers in a biscuit factory; for the simple reason that they know that it carries no chance of making mischief for the government. It can hardly be a coincidence that the action is rumoured to be planned to start over Easter.

Footnote; as an ex-soldier myself , I would like to register my utter contempt for some of the disgraceful comments about serving soldiers on this thread.

97

If the army is used to drive tankers I trust the unions will at the very least be looking to see if they have a case to take the government to the European court of human rights, regardless if its toilet rolls or fuel, the government will still be guilty of interfering in a lawful industrial dispute. And if the government does decide to reduce the Army to scab labour the next time David Cameron criticises china, north Korea and other dictatorial countries about human rights I trust they will reply by pointing a finger at Cameron and simply say “Hypocrite”

98

Well said NG, and talking about public opinion, it backfired for the Firefighters on their last strike simply because the Union didn’t inform the public correctly as to the situation and allowed the media to paint a picture that had the public condemning them. I had a relative ask me if Firefighters were really worth the money they were asking for and this coming from a Teacher that was likely on 5 to 10 grand a year more. Many Firefighters were so despondant at how the strike was handled they said they would never come out again or vote Labour, time will tell on that. Lets hope it doesn’t come to strike action we will find out tomorrow no doubt.

99

gnasty gnome:

Juddian:
.

I don’t think any reasonable man would dispute that it’s a highly responsible job and merits a decent wage. I still maintain though that they should be careful not to push things too far regarding pay and conditions; public opinion is a fickle thing and in an era of constant belt-tightening it could well be portrayed as downright selfishness by the media, with the knock-on effect of encouraging the public to be more anti-lorry in general if that were possible.

As I said earlier, drivers of LPG tankers don’t seem to be in a state of constant disagreement with their employers and I wouldn’t think their job is any less risky.

What peeves a lot of people (with a certain element of justification) is that those same unions who’ll do anything for fuel tanker drivers won’t get out of bed for blokes on general haulage, or shop floor workers in a biscuit factory; for the simple reason that they know that it carries no chance of making mischief for the government. It can hardly be a coincidence that the action is rumoured to be planned to start over Easter.

The media will say whatever their owner (depending on which party he owns) tells them to say, not much we can do about that unfortunately, having not purchased a product loosely known as a newspaper for over 25 years i am free from that propaganda don’t watch the British Biased Corporations brainwashing episodes of news either…:wink:

The Calor lads used to be on a serious wedge, similarly the BOC lads, i assume thats still the case, if their agreements are good then industrial action won’t be called for, the company i work for don’t have agreement problems either…in all cases there is no logistics mob trying to cheapen the job though as far as i’m aware…could be wrong.

A workplace union is only as good as its members, and stewards have to be carefully chosen, bolshy and awkward enough to stand up to management, and principled enough to be unable to be bought.

A union can do nothing by itself, i’ve been a union member for years, without a doubt the job has been better for all because of this in my experience, all my unionised jobs have been streets ahead of the other type in pay and benefits…some practices will annoy and sometimes stewards will feather their own nests and via nepotism etc others too, your have to stand back and look at the big picture despite this, without fail the unionised drivers do better than the non unionised overall.

100

just a thought to throw out there. It has been reported ages ago now that fuel prices although going up and up and up the amount they sale have gone down!!! so just a point to ‘debate’ is are the same amount of profits there where sales figures have gone down is the profit still there to be able to afford to pay the high wages lmaoooo yes i know BP etc are making huge amount of money but this is a argument they will use