This has come under debate on TruckNet two or three times before and there has been no definitive answer so I’ve written to VOSA for guidance. Here’s the letter.
Dear Sir or Madam,
I am writing to seek clarification on a point of law.
REGULATION (EC) No 561/2006 OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL of 15 March 2006 on the harmonisation of certain social legislation relating to road transport and amending Council Regulations (EEC) No 3821/85 and (EC) No 2135, states the following.
Where a driver chooses to do this, daily rest periods and
reduced weekly rest periods away from base may be taken in a
vehicle, as long as it has suitable sleeping facilities for each
driver and the vehicle is stationary.
Section 8 states that reduced weekly rest periods away from base may be taken in a vehicle and by omission I interpret this as meaning that full 45 hour weekly rest periods cannot be taken in a vehicle. You will notice that there is no distinction between full and reduced daily rest periods being taken in a vehicle and so it seems that the legislators purposely framed the wording of the legislation to prohibit non-reduced weekly rest periods being taken away from base.
Could I please have VOSA’s interpretation of this legislation, since I may soon be undertaking a promotional roadshow which would require the driver to spend several weeks away from base.
Harry Monk:
This has come under debate on TruckNet two or three times before and there has been no definitive answer so I’ve written to VOSA for guidance. Here’s the letter.
Dear Sir or Madam,
I am writing to seek clarification on a point of law.
REGULATION (EC) No 561/2006 OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL of 15 March 2006 on the harmonisation of certain social legislation relating to road transport and amending Council Regulations (EEC) No 3821/85 and (EC) No 2135, states the following.
Where a driver chooses to do this, daily rest periods and
reduced weekly rest periods away from base may be taken in a
vehicle, as long as it has suitable sleeping facilities for each
driver and the vehicle is stationary.
Section 8 states that reduced weekly rest periods away from base may be taken in a vehicle and by omission I interpret this as meaning that full 45 hour weekly rest periods cannot be taken in a vehicle. You will notice that there is no distinction between full and reduced daily rest periods being taken in a vehicle and so it seems that the legislators purposely framed the wording of the legislation to prohibit non-reduced weekly rest periods being taken away from base.
Could I please have VOSA’s interpretation of this legislation, since I may soon be undertaking a promotional roadshow which would require the driver to spend several weeks away from base.
Yours Faithfully,
Harry Monk.
I’ll update this thread when I get a reply.
That’ll mean a lot of international drivers are shagged then
nick2008:
That’ll mean a lot of international drivers are shagged then
Yes, if VOSA enforced the legislation it might mildly inconvenience me in that I would have to book a hotel every other week but it would cause far more problems for Boris and Stanislav who spend weeks at a time here stealing our work and taking their illegal rests in lay-bys.
nick2008:
That’ll mean a lot of international drivers are shagged then
Yes, if VOSA enforced the legislation it might mildly inconvenience me in that I would have to book a hotel every other week but it would cause far more problems for Boris and Stanislav who spend weeks at a time here stealing our work and taking their illegal rests in lay-bys.
It’ll be alright in the summer Harry … Pop up tent on the grass verge will do
nick2008:
That’ll mean a lot of international drivers are shagged then
Yes, if VOSA enforced the legislation it might mildly inconvenience me in that I would have to book a hotel every other week but it would cause far more problems for Boris and Stanislav who spend weeks at a time here stealing our work and taking their illegal rests in lay-bys.
And put an end to the unscrupulous bosses of certain transport companies taking advantage of their drivers by not paying them the normal rate for each day they are on rest
Harry Monk:
This has come under debate on TruckNet two or three times before and there has been no definitive answer so I’ve written to VOSA for guidance. Here’s the letter.
Dear Sir or Madam,
I am writing to seek clarification on a point of law.
REGULATION (EC) No 561/2006 OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL of 15 March 2006 on the harmonisation of certain social legislation relating to road transport and amending Council Regulations (EEC) No 3821/85 and (EC) No 2135, states the following.
Where a driver chooses to do this, daily rest periods and
reduced weekly rest periods away from base may be taken in a
vehicle, as long as it has suitable sleeping facilities for each
driver and the vehicle is stationary.
Section 8 states that reduced weekly rest periods away from base may be taken in a vehicle and by omission I interpret this as meaning that full 45 hour weekly rest periods cannot be taken in a vehicle. You will notice that there is no distinction between full and reduced daily rest periods being taken in a vehicle and so it seems that the legislators purposely framed the wording of the legislation to prohibit non-reduced weekly rest periods being taken away from base.
Could I please have VOSA’s interpretation of this legislation, since I may soon be undertaking a promotional roadshow which would require the driver to spend several weeks away from base.
How pedantic can one owner operator. And a new one at that, be.
I can see a traffic officer sat at their desk having a right good giggle to themselves at such a stupid letter.
Vincent, you’re a long way from achieving such a goal, if you actually do survive that long. By what I have read you’ll be lucky to still be running this time next year.
Stop wasting your time with such trivial pursuits and start making your 1 vehicle, 1 man band, if not profitable at least break even.
All this pseudo-intellect is not doing you any favours, all it is doing is making you look silly.
Get on with making your venture a success and stop trying to make yourself look better than you are on here.
Okey-Didley-Dokely:
How pedantic can one owner operator. And a new one at that, be.
I can see a traffic officer sat at their desk having a right good giggle to themselves at such a stupid letter.
Vincent, you’re a long way from achieving such a goal, if you actually do survive that long. By what I have read you’ll be lucky to still be running this time next year.
Stop wasting your time with such trivial pursuits and start making your 1 vehicle, 1 man band, if not profitable at least break even.
All this pseudo-intellect is not doing you any favours, all it is doing is making you look silly.
Get on with making your venture a success and stop trying to make yourself look better than you are on here.
Why do so many people on this forum have a blinkered, One sided view of everything?
I find the letter quite interesting, The repy (if any) will be either constructive or at least amusing.
His letter shows why our legal system is forever busy. Laws are introduced that can be interpreted in several ways.
It may be interesting to write the same letter to several different traffic areas, The outcome may be several different legal definitions.
It will be interesting to see VOSA’s interpretation of the regulations, it has caused some pretty heated discussions on here.
Of course it’s still only their interpretation of the regulations and can be challenged in Court.
As has been said if they like of VOSA, BAG etc decided to interpret this the way many here think it’s supposed to be and then enforce it. It could mean a major shake-up of how many international hauliers operate.
Personally if Harry wants to send letters to VOSA in the quiet time between Christmas and New Year that’s up to him. I can’t see that the time spent on it will make any difference to if his business succeeds or fails. I personally hope he succeeds, as I do for anybody who’s in his position.
That was not a blinkered view, it was a view from someone with 30 years experience in transport. How can a driver who goes away for 3 months at a time be expected to take a 45 or more hour break be expected to go home for his break. Since the EU started expanding eastwards and more manufacturing is taking place in the old eastern block countries, we need transportation from these countries.
It is more cost effective for manufacturers.
Pop in to asda or Tesco and look at the packaging of processed chilled foods and look at the country of origin!
Most of it is now made in the east, it then has to be transported here, supermarkets aren’t going to send a truck from the uk to pick it up, costs too much. So the EU put money in to a development fund so Eastern Europeans could buy trucks and then made the law more flexible for these drivers to stay away from home for linger periods.
So yes, it is a silly question, anyone with an ounce of coming sense who hasn’t got their head so far up their own arse would actually know the answer without writing pointless letters to VOSA to try and look clever.
Okey-Didley-Dokely:
That was not a blinkered view, it was a view from someone with 30 years experience in transport. How can a driver who goes away for 3 months at a time be expected to take a 45 or more hour break be expected to go home for his break. Since the EU started expanding eastwards and more manufacturing is taking place in the old eastern block countries, we need transportation from these countries.
It is more cost effective for manufacturers.
Pop in to asda or Tesco and look at the packaging of processed chilled foods and look at the country of origin!
Most of it is now made in the east, it then has to be transported here, supermarkets aren’t going to send a truck from the uk to pick it up, costs too much. So the EU put money in to a development fund so Eastern Europeans could buy trucks and then made the law more flexible for these drivers to stay away from home for linger periods.
So yes, it is a silly question, anyone with an ounce of coming sense who hasn’t got their head so far up their own arse would actually know the answer without writing pointless letters to VOSA to try and look clever.
You attack a guy for trying to clarify the law ? And attack him again for putting it on here. It’s the whole point of the forum isn’t it ? If you don’t like it, move on to the next thread.
As with tipping on rest, running on the wire it’s up to VOSA to prove your guilt, not for you to prove your innocence. So short off interrupting someones rest VOSA can never check if they’re on daily, reduced weekly or 45 rest. At a checkpoint you won’t need hotel receipts, simply telling them you spent the weekend at a prossies house would be sufficient.
Personally I think you’ve shot yourself in the foot if VOSA tell you it’s illegal. You’ll now be the only operator in Europe to have written confirmation it’s illegal so have no excuse. The rest of us can hide behind our ignorance, which has got me out of more scrapes with VOSA than I care to mention.
Also I think you’ll find it’s only the Brits worried about following the law to the exact letter, regardless of how minor. A point clearly demonstrated by your letter to VOSA. You’ll be telling us next you’re worried about the WTD.
Okey-Didley-Dokely:
By what I have read you’ll be lucky to still be running this time next year.
Stop wasting your time with such trivial pursuits and start making your 1 vehicle, 1 man band, if not profitable at least break even.
As others have stated this has come up for discussion many times but as far as I’m aware nobody has been able to obtain any official viewpoint, so I’m seeking to do that. If that isn’t of interest to you then I would respectfully suggest that you just don’t re-visit the thread, there are plenty more which might interest you.
From my understanding of the regs it seems that its only taking a full weekly rest in a vehicle that is the issue so taking it in a motel etc is legal
If that is the case then who is responsible for that motel cost plus food etc - the driver or the employer ?
Okey-Didley-Dokely:
By what I have read you’ll be lucky to still be running this time next year.
Stop wasting your time with such trivial pursuits and start making your 1 vehicle, 1 man band, if not profitable at least break even.
As others have stated this has come up for discussion many times but as far as I’m aware nobody has been able to obtain any official viewpoint, so I’m seeking to do that. If that isn’t of interest to you then I would respectfully suggest that you just don’t re-visit the thread, there are plenty more which might interest you.
It’s what I’m reading on here not any Facebook page that made me comment.
And this thread does interest me, how a one man band subbing on general haulage needs to know such things as I guess you will be at your home base every weekend.
I can answer your question for you, like a lot of long time trampers who spend weeks away and have to take a 45 hour break away from home, no you will not have to book in to a hotel because no VOSA, BAG or gendarme will bother their arse whether or not you are in the truck.
Okey-Didley-Dokely:
And this thread does interest me, how a one man band subbing on general haulage needs to know such things as I guess you will be at your home base every weekend.
Well, firstly I may well be doing a tour next year but secondly and perhaps more importantly I’d be interested in VOSAs opinion in whether the vast majority of eastern European operators who spend every weekend away from their bases are breaking the law. Because if they were, and they certainly do appear to be doing so, and VOSA did decide that this was something they should look at, then this would be a good thing for domestic hauliers, no?
mickyblue:
I can sense this thread getting out of hand with bitterness
I guess that how other members choose to contribute is up to them.
Okey-Didley-Dokely:
And this thread does interest me, how a one man band subbing on general haulage needs to know such things as I guess you will be at your home base every weekend.
Well, firstly I may well be doing a tour next year but secondly and perhaps more importantly I’d be interested in VOSAs opinion in whether the vast majority of eastern European operators who spend every weekend away from their bases are breaking the law. Because if they were, and they certainly do appear to be doing so, and VOSA did decide that this was something they should look at, then this would be a good thing for domestic hauliers, no?
mickyblue:
I can sense this thread getting out of hand with bitterness
I guess that how other members choose to contribute is up to them.
Because of the contribution to the economy that the supermarkets provide and the fact that most European hauliers are actually servicing supermarkets, it won’t make a difference to UK hauliers one iota.
Please get a grip on reality, the EU aren’t going to make changes for any west European haulage industry when they can get road transport from east Europe at reduced rate.
As for your venture next year, good luck, I really hope you succeed.
