In am English and really could not care less which way the vote goes, I personally think that if Scotland gets independence and it all goes belly up in a few years where will they go for help? The won’t be allowed to join the EU an an independent nation automatically so they will only turn to the tossers in London who will without doubt make the penalties of any loans or help so severe and so aggressive that Scotland will feel it for many many years to come. I don’t hope for that to happen but Salmond is very clever and as we will all see like the rest of politicians he is in it for himself. I just hope the Scottish people don’t end up on the ■■■■■■ end of the stick.
I’ve just heard that Gordon Brown has been giving an address for the ‘Better Together’ campaign.
That’s decided it…Salmond’s won!
GasGas:
The Scots would actually have less control of their future as an independent nation.Salmond wants to keep the £ and the Queen. He wants to stay in NATO and the EU.
Effectively then his economy and constitution would still be controlled from Westminster, but there would be no Scottish MPs in Westminster.
Your outcome seems a bit disengenuous. Salmond wants an Independant Scotland. If it goes his way, no matter what he thinks or his own policies are, fact is Scottish people would be able to vote for, elect people/parties that either do or don’t want to keep the £, Queen, NATO, EU. Thats up for Scotland to decide if it becomes Independant, and is not an automatic conclusion of a “yes” for Independance vote.
GasGas:
At the moment there are more Scottish MPs per 10,000 head of population than there are English ones. Scottish MPs get to vote on matters such as law and education which concern England and wales only, but English and Welsh MPs do not get to vote on matters that concern Scotland only. Our current PM and his predecessor are both of Scottish descent. King James of Scotland traveled South to become King James I of England after the death of Elizabeth I. I’ve always struggled to work out whether England ruled Scotland or was it the other way around?
Thats a lengthy version of "the West Lothian Question " !! 
GasGas:
An independent Scotland would thus have less power over itself and less say internationally than it does now.
…thus? You say that as a fact, how? Its already able to make its own independant descisions in lots of key areas. If it gets full say, it’ll have less power, how that work ?
GasGas:
The only people I know who favour Scottish independence are arty and political types; working people and business people from Scotland regard it with horror. Whatever its attractions from an emotional point of view, it would be a practical disaster.
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Odd isn’t it, because everyone i know is sick and fed up of being dictated to by unelected beuracrats, but you’re saying the people you know think its ok? Well, apart from these political arty ■■■■■ types?
Working class in England love paying Uni fees for their kids, whilst Scotlands don’t have to pay.
If Scotland votes to stay in the UK then Holyrood needs pulling down, or build us an English equivalent of it,just like Wales and NI, have.
Slackbladder:
I’ve always considered myself English, never British, and have yet to meet a Scottish person that has had anything good or decent to say about the English, England or even Gt Britain. I would love to see them vote yes, just so that they would have nobody to blame but themselves should it all go pear shaped. However, as I consider them thick but not stupid, they will vote no. This will mean we can keep on carrying them for years to come.
I am English just as they are Scottish or Welsh, I just wish all the bloody council paperwork would carry the term instead of me writing - Other - minority - English.
I do not wish for the Scottish people to fail but from down here it looks like it will and no doubt it will all be the fault of the English. All the same good luck to them.
merc0447:
London thats who will be going independent! Do us all a favour get the eton nancy boys to [zb] and get some real men in to run the country.
Now if London independence was an option everyone outside London would insist on a vote! 
Salmond thinks he can keep the £ and join the EU but omitts to acknowledge that any new applicants to the EU have to adopt the Euro,oh! and there is the little matter of getting a 100% vote from the other members to allow a new country to join the EU,and Spain for one country would never vote for this to happen otherwise they would have their Catalan region of northern Spain clamouring for the same deal as Scotland.As I’m English,and proud of it, I couldn’t care less if the Scots vote to follow Salmond down the toilet,a spin off and plus factor as far as I’m concerned would be the loss of all the Scottish Labour MP’s at Westminster which in turn would prevent Red Ed and his men ever regaining power in England,fact.Having been a Conservative voter all my life I have finally had to accept that Cameron is just another Blair so I will now vote UKIP,Nigel may not be perfect but at least his spiel makes sense not to mention that if UKIP does well in the up-coming elections it will give the political establishment one hell of an earthquake shock,and not before time IMO.Cheers Bewick.
To get an idea of the tone of the debate search the hashtag #indyref on twitter lots of fact lots of myths but a lot of lively debate.
I wish the Scots the best of luck in their desire to control their own destiny, I’ll be voting UKIP for the exact same reason at the forthcoming elections, same as everybody else. 
Stanley Knife:
merc0447:
London thats who will be going independent! Do us all a favour get the eton nancy boys to [zb] and get some real men in to run the country.Now if London independence was an option everyone outside London would insist on a vote!
If the toffee nosed twits in London declared independence, we could just refuse to deliver inside the M25 'cos we ain’t got a passport, and let 'em all starve! 
Imagine the liability of taking a wagon around W8 and stacking up one of them brightly coloured lambourghinis? 
If they do vote to go their own way then let it be the whole hog, no British industry anymore, pull out everything and leave them to fend for themselves, they can’t join the EU and they won’t be part of the UK, take away the pound and all financial backing and let that arrogant Salmond twonk sort his mess out.
I can’t for the life of me figure out the sense in leaving the UK and asking for self rule(which they mostly have anyway) to want to be ruled by the Germans or French ?
Harry Monk:
I wish the Scots the best of luck in their desire to control their own destiny, I’ll be voting UKIP for the exact same reason at the forthcoming elections, same as everybody else.
+1
The idea of an independent Scotland that wants to remain a state within the EU federation makes no sense though.
Winseer:
Stanley Knife:
merc0447:
London thats who will be going independent! Do us all a favour get the eton nancy boys to [zb] and get some real men in to run the country.Now if London independence was an option everyone outside London would insist on a vote!
If the toffee nosed twits in London declared independence, we could just refuse to deliver inside the M25 'cos we ain’t got a passport, and let 'em all starve!
The idea of thinking that the M25 forms the boundary between London and the surrounding counties which are unlucky enough to have the place as a neighbour is like saying that the river Thames forms the border between France and Germany.IE there’s no connection at least so far and hopefully that’s how it will stay.
Harry Monk:
I wish the Scots the best of luck in their desire to control their own destiny, I’ll be voting UKIP for the exact same reason at the forthcoming elections, same as everybody else.
+1
And on the subject, the Scots should be independent if they desire. They can sort their own economy out and be free of Londoniniom and Nick and Dave and Ed and all the other Westminster ‘career’ scroungers!
Who says they won’t cope? If they are independent they can choose what they deem to be important for themselves and how to achieve it and not be told what is good for them by those based in London. If their economy can be prosperous by competing properly in world markets without gross profit being king then so be it. Why not run the country for the benefit of all instead of the few priviliged blood suckers in the capitalist Capitals of the world?
It amazes me that (for example) the utilities in the UK are such a money spinner that they need to be in private hands rather than making a profit for the nation and resulting in lower costs for the consumer. Or is profit only good for the private sector? Just think how much it would cost you to turn a light on if England Plc owned the company. 
And of course the ‘English’ vote in Parliament will not include the Scots to influence it!
Just my own ‘independent’ opinion by the way! 
What’s strange about all this is how any issue that involves an almost 50/50 split in the vote is put to some kind of referendum - even when there’s obviously not going to be a clear vote one way or the other (eg. 2:1 majority)
…But something that over 80% of us are in favour of, like “getting out of Europe” or “Re-instating capital punishment” or “taxing the biggest shoulders the most” - never gets a look-in. Ever. 
We never get asked on issues where the government knows what the public want, but just won’t do it.
So much for “democracy”. “You decide your own fate, as long as the answer is middle-of-the-road, and we don’t get called to account for it”
I don’t remember getting a vote on “getting involved in foreign wars” or “cutting jobs from the bottom up” or “spending our cash on bailing out banks” either. 
Winseer:
I don’t remember getting a vote on “getting involved in foreign wars”
The eastward expansion of the EU and NATO onto what was the old Soviet Union and Warsaw Pact turf is a war in the making.Luckily we do get a vote concerning the situation in that Farage has made his policy clear in regard to the issue.
As for Scotland there was never any benefit to the English in invading and then forcing Scotland into a union with us which they didn’t want.The only question is how did that situation turn into such a large proportion of Scots supporting such a union over the years. 
We’ve had to remove some posts for personal attacks and petty name-calling.
It ends right now, otherwise the topic will be removed/locked.
Just so you can’t say you weren’t warned.
I would urge every Scottish person to vote yes.
I see sinister comparisons with Kenneth Branagh`s Arliss Loveless (wild wild west). He was looking to grab the northern plains (lovelessland) as a “tiny piece for me to retire on”. Be wary - you could just find your beloved country being renamed Salmondland. 
I wish I was Scottish and I had the option of voting the braying, self-serving, moral free ■■■■■■■■ out of my life forever. I would vote yes without question.
As a footnote, if they do gain independence, will I still be able to read The Broons?
Carryfast:
Winseer:
I don’t remember getting a vote on “getting involved in foreign wars”The eastward expansion of the EU and NATO onto what was the old Soviet Union and Warsaw Pact turf is a war in the making.Luckily we do get a vote concerning the situation in that Farage has made his policy clear in regard to the issue.
As for Scotland there was never any benefit to the English in invading and then forcing Scotland into a union with us which they didn’t want.The only question is how did that situation turn into such a large proportion of Scots supporting such a union over the years.
I count the Union as beginning when Elizabeth I handed over the English throne to a Scot being both James I of England now, and James VI of Scotland at the same time. We went on to be ruled by the Stuarts for over a century, losing the absolute Monarch, and re-gaining a constitutional one in the process.
Longshanks doesn’t have much to do with it. The Conquest of Scotland is quite a different thing than the two-way street that is ‘Union with Scotland’.
The worst possible result in the upcoming referendum is a near 50/50 split. An independent Scotland on a 51/49% vote would be very tenuous, and every time anything remotely goes wrong, reference will be made to the “tiny majority that voted for it.”. If it’s 49/51 the other way, then accusations of “Fiddle!” may well be made, especially if ‘some ballot boxes go missing’, in particular those of serving Scottish regiments…