I have only been in this industry outside a large company (UPS) for just over a year and I have noticed something that I find very strange.
Is it the norm for employers, I’m not talking about agency workers here, not to pay sick pay?
I am not talking about the £18 SSP we can all claim per day but, as I call it, proper sick pay…employers sick pay.
For example when I worked at UPS if I was off sick I received my £18 SSP + 85% of my daily wage for each day I was off sick…where has this gone or has it never been available due to drivers taking the ■■■■?
I’d love to hear your opinions on this and what precautions is everyone taking.
Are there like sickness covers that pay you if you are off work straight away, I know there are long term sickness plans that kick in after 30 days sickness but are there any for say 2-3 days off work?
Kynszon:
I have only been in this industry outside a large company (UPS) for just over a year and I have noticed something that I find very strange.
Is it the norm for employers, I’m not talking about agency workers here, not to pay sick pay?
I am not talking about the £18 SSP we can all claim per day but, as I call it, proper sick pay…employers sick pay.
For example when I worked at UPS if I was off sick I received my £18 SSP + 85% of my daily wage for each day I was off sick…where has this gone or has it never been available due to drivers taking the ■■■■?
I’d love to hear your opinions on this and what precautions is everyone taking.
Are there like sickness covers that pay you if you are off work straight away, I know there are long term sickness plans that kick in after 30 days sickness but are there any for say 2-3 days off work?
Probably depends on whether or not you work for a firm that has a Union presence, to look after the workforce.
If so usually better t.s and c.s go with that territory.
(Maybe an uncomfortable truth for the Anti Union crew on here btw.)
Or if you work for a firm who values their workforce.
Neither of those examples apply to the firm I work for, so it’s SSP for me personally in the unlikely event of me being off.
Yup, it’s usually those with proper unions who get such t’s and c’s, sadly on too many of those the blinkered selfish half wits who can see no further than the end of their nose took the ■■■■ and ruined the jobs anyway, pork cannot be educated.
The irony being in a lot of cases it was those who refused to join the union at all (and never stopped ■■■■■■■■ about how poor the latest pay rise was) who took the ■■■■ the most out of the superior terms on unionised jobs, irony not computing there
A sort of corollary of ‘no taxation without representation’, i wonder how much crying would ensue if the union members gained better terms just for themselves, which the non members were prevented from trousering
I’m salaried so get payed the same every month regardless of whether I’m at work, holiday or off sick. I’ve not had a single day off though in the 2.5 years I’ve been here but it’s comforting to know I’ll still get payed if I am off.
Yes it’s normal because the problem with proper sick pay schemes is people take the ■■■■ with them. Days off for a little sniffle because they know they are getting paid. Days off for hangovers because they know they are getting paid. And then the ones who book a week away in Benidorm once a year but don’t book it as holiday, they just take a week off on the sick for it. Like with everything it’s spoiled by the few who are dishonest.
SSP is all your employers is obliged to pay you after the first qualifying days,not many small outfits have schemes that pay more,its away of making sure you get to work even if your only fit to drop
I think you will find a great deal of Insurance Companies will only pay out after the first month,if any body knows different I stand corrected
We pretty much ticked the good employer box in every regard but sick pay, we only paid SSP. As an employee I’d seen too many people abuse it, so didnt go down that line.
If you were I injured abroad then we had an insurance scheme which paid the company, but we gave it to the drivers which IIRC covered around 80% of wages.
When I was working I had a sick pay policy that paid from day 1 with Cirencester Friendly Soc. Dont know it it’s still available.
Kynszon:
I have only been in this industry outside a large company (UPS) for just over a year and I have noticed something that I find very strange.
Is it the norm for employers, I’m not talking about agency workers here, not to pay sick pay?
I am not talking about the £18 SSP we can all claim per day but, as I call it, proper sick pay…employers sick pay.
For example when I worked at UPS if I was off sick I received my £18 SSP + 85% of my daily wage for each day I was off sick…where has this gone or has it never been available due to drivers taking the ■■■■?
I’d love to hear your opinions on this and what precautions is everyone taking.
Are there like sickness covers that pay you if you are off work straight away, I know there are long term sickness plans that kick in after 30 days sickness but are there any for say 2-3 days off work?
Big sick pay benefits are a double edged sword that just gives employers even more incentive to sack longer term sick workers sooner.Bearing in mind that most people have savings which will cover a few days off.
Private Income Protection insurance is absolutely essential and can’t understand why people are more fixated on short term sickness when it’s the longer term type which will bankrupt them.
Juddian:
Yup, it’s usually those with proper unions who get such t’s and c’s,
It’s a bit ( lot ) more complicated than that.
No, it isn’t, in our industry almost the only employers offering full sick pay are companies with collective, via a union, agreements.
That and the few own account operations left tend to have decent terms even if a union isn’t involved, though it usually is.
Juddian:
Yup, it’s usually those with proper unions who get such t’s and c’s,
It’s a bit ( lot ) more complicated than that.
No it aint.
Firms with strong union representation have better t.s & c.s, fact.
Ask some of the lads on here who get time + half over 40 hours, while I am on the same paltry rate right through.
The same lads who are on double time on a Sunday, and the same plus 1 lieu day, for Bank hols …while I am on 12 bloody quid on the same days.
The lads who are on maximum night out money while I am on 23 quid.
(Alternatively, as I said before, the same can be said for those firms who look after and cherish their drivers…as scarce as they may be.)
So Carryfast me old mate, this will maybe difficult for you to accept, what, with you being an authority on,…well everything , …but for once you are…wait for it.
WRONG !
Cheers.
too many people kicking the arse out of it. Every industry will be going to the same way if its any consolation.
My place pay full sick for up to 2 years but they’re itching to get rid of it as its costing them £500k+ a day!!! they’ve even brought in a scheme to try and get the idiots in where if the site attendance doesn’t drop below 97% for 3 months anyone with 100% attendance is put into a draw to win a car
maga:
too many people kicking the arse out of it. Every industry will be going to the same way if its any consolation.
My place pay full sick for up to 2 years but they’re itching to get rid of it as its costing them £500k+ a day!!! they’ve even brought in a scheme to try and get the idiots in where if the site attendance doesn’t drop below 97% for 3 months anyone with 100% attendance is put into a draw to win a car
If those that abuse this and spoil it for everyone else want to take time off on the sick, it should be on condition that they get a Doctor’s verification note,… say after the third time in a year they are off, or some other similar disincentive.
maga:
too many people kicking the arse out of it. Every industry will be going to the same way if its any consolation.
My place pay full sick for up to 2 years but they’re itching to get rid of it as its costing them £500k+ a day!!! they’ve even brought in a scheme to try and get the idiots in where if the site attendance doesn’t drop below 97% for 3 months anyone with 100% attendance is put into a draw to win a car
If those that abuse this and spoil it for everyone else want to take time off on the sick, it should be on condition that they get a Doctor’s verification note,… say after the third time in a year they are off, or some other similar disincentive.
They’re all signed off by the doc as it is, it’s amazing how many “stressed” people I seem to work with so the companies hands are tied really.
Pay deal talks are taking place this month (should have been november!) and we all know what’s going to get a hammering this time round and I doubt the union will be able to argue as its so bad!
it’s a shame some of my fellow brummies’ don’t realise a good thing when they’ve got it. just take a look at what happened to Longbridge. plus crap cars didn’t help. just some with the attitude of gimme, gimme, mine ,mine…
Juddian:
Yup, it’s usually those with proper unions who get such t’s and c’s,
It’s a bit ( lot ) more complicated than that.
No, it isn’t, in our industry almost the only employers offering full sick pay are companies with collective, via a union, agreements.
That and the few own account operations left tend to have decent terms even if a union isn’t involved, though it usually is.
I work at one of these dinosaur sites with a strong union presence and a few months ago went over in a pothole damaging my ankle and a wrist. As it was an injury sustained at work I got paid sick pay from day one as opposed to illness which pays on day four. The amount? Same as my holiday pay actually; £180 per day.
Juddian:
Yup, it’s usually those with proper unions who get such t’s and c’s, sadly on too many of those the blinkered selfish half wits who can see no further than the end of their nose took the ■■■■ and ruined the jobs anyway, pork cannot be educated.
The irony being in a lot of cases it was those who refused to join the union at all (and never stopped ■■■■■■■■ about how poor the latest pay rise was) who took the ■■■■ the most out of the superior terms on unionised jobs, irony not computing there
A sort of corollary of ‘no taxation without representation’, i wonder how much crying would ensue if the union members gained better terms just for themselves, which the non members were prevented from trousering
You’ve beaten me to it. It seems the “Employer that pays full sick pay” - is like a magnet for the slothsome leech that are only there for the “benefits” the job has to offer, rather than seeing it as a career.
The Care “Industry”, Orderly Work, and even Auxillary Nursing work. Tax Credit fodder where it is normal to see a good percentage of staff out on “long term sick” at any point. You’d think “working for a hospital” one would be able to get that “bad back” fixed Pronto - but no.
Once workers realize that the good old days of “Full Sick Pay” are long gone - they’ll realize that they are better off being paid by the hour on agency, rather than forced to work a set of “any 5 from 7” on a contract that doesn’t even pay “Death in Service Benefit” to one’s bereved family - without a legal fight in the courts to get that payout, thanks to the company playing the “causality” and “pre-existing conditions” game.
I’ve even heard of people being FIRED for going into hospital long-term sick for “cancer treatment” - because they didn’t declare “cancer in the family” when they applied for the job years earlier… NOT the kind of stress you want when applying for that “critical illness payout” either, eh? Insurances and In-Work Benefits - are only as good as the “NO QUIBBLE GUARANTEE” that all-too-often are NOT forthcoming with these “costless perks” offered by employers on a increasingly-looking fraudulent basis…
Juddian:
Yup, it’s usually those with proper unions who get such t’s and c’s, sadly on too many of those the blinkered selfish half wits who can see no further than the end of their nose took the ■■■■ and ruined the jobs anyway, pork cannot be educated.
The irony being in a lot of cases it was those who refused to join the union at all (and never stopped ■■■■■■■■ about how poor the latest pay rise was) who took the ■■■■ the most out of the superior terms on unionised jobs, irony not computing there
A sort of corollary of ‘no taxation without representation’, i wonder how much crying would ensue if the union members gained better terms just for themselves, which the non members were prevented from trousering
You’ve beaten me to it. It seems the “Employer that pays full sick pay” - is like a magnet for the slothsome leech that are only there for the “benefits” the job has to offer, rather than seeing it as a career.
The Care “Industry”, Orderly Work, and even Auxillary Nursing work. Tax Credit fodder where it is normal to see a good percentage of staff out on “long term sick” at any point. You’d think “working for a hospital” one would be able to get that “bad back” fixed Pronto - but no.
Once workers realize that the good old days of “Full Sick Pay” are long gone - they’ll realize that they are better off being paid by the hour on agency, rather than forced to work a set of “any 5 from 7” on a contract that doesn’t even pay “Death in Service Benefit” to one’s bereved family - without a legal fight in the courts to get that payout, thanks to the company playing the “causality” and “pre-existing conditions” game.
I’ve even heard of people being FIRED for going into hospital long-term sick for “cancer treatment” - because they didn’t declare “cancer in the family” when they applied for the job years earlier… NOT the kind of stress you want when applying for that “critical illness payout” either, eh? Insurances and In-Work Benefits - are only as good as the “NO QUIBBLE GUARANTEE” that all-too-often are NOT forthcoming with these “costless perks” offered by employers on a increasingly-looking fraudulent basis…
We have them at my place, the worst part is when they have what we call a “support plan” when they return can’t do this can’t do that, can’t do weekends can’t do double deckers cant do more than one drop totally pathetic we hand one clown who wouldn’t drop off three cages to a store he was passing because of his “plan” but was quite happy to post on faceache pictures of him towing a caravan to Croatia.
Nothing wrong with him apart from being bone idle, they’re the ones that f*** me right off.
Like the OP i also work for the big brown machine. However the company is split into different sections and each has their own contract with differing t’s & c’s.
Now I’m salaried and am entitled to full sick pay up to 6 months then half pay for a period after that. It all depends on management discretion thoigh based on using the Bradford Factor scoring system, basically if you score over a set amount of points you ain’t getting paid. It stops the mickey takers and lead swingers. I’m not fussed as i haven’t had a sick day in a couple of years.
Juddian:
Yup, it’s usually those with proper unions who get such t’s and c’s,
It’s a bit ( lot ) more complicated than that.
No, it isn’t, in our industry almost the only employers offering full sick pay are companies with collective, via a union, agreements.
That and the few own account operations left tend to have decent terms even if a union isn’t involved, though it usually is.
Not if a union agreement puts trunk drivers to work hand balling loads to make up their hours in a hub system.Then if/when their back breaks employment law says that the employee can be sacked on medical grounds no need to pay sick pay.Trust me sick pay ( or unions ) ain’t much use in that situation as opposed to private income protection insurance being everything.
