orys:
bigr250:
The goods will be carried under ‘own account’ regs not ‘hire & reward’ therefore not under coabotage regulations.
Ross.Thanks!
As for unwashed blokes, they are washed when weekending in France, Germany or Poland… Propably it has something to do with lack of facilities for truckers in UK
Lol.
Still wrong. Most places charge a couple of euros so they still don’t bother.
Orys, you’re not related to Carryfast are you 
There is a British saying “There are none so blind, as those who will not see” it appears that it was made with you in mind 
As somebody who was actually involved with overseas transportation in the years leading up to the Eastern Invasion, I do have a few facts to back up my claims too 
It used to be that driving down the roads of Europe you would see lorries of all nationalities, there were the State Owned lorries from Eastern Europe and there were a fair number of them, they pretty much had the market cornered on the routes they travelled, if you did run through the Iron Curtain you did see the odd foreign lorry, but mostly you saw lorries from the home country (whichever country that was) In Western Europe the situation was a little different, mainly due to the trade situation between countries, but it was always a two way street, for every British lorry you saw in Belgium, France, Germany, Holland, Italy, Portugal, Spain etc you would see a Belgian, French, Dutch, Italian. Spanish or Portugese etc lorry on the road in Britain. It worked very well, even though it was cheaper to run a Portugese lorry than a British lorry, The Portugese never dominated the market and the British lorry could still make money doing the same job as the Portugese lorry.
Then that all changed, the market was suddenly flooded with two tracksuit wearing drivers in brand new lorries and trailers bearing Eastern European registrations, the rates dropped overnight, a coincedence 
I think not
You can argue until you’re blue in the face if you like, but the fact remains, international haulage rates now, for the most part are at a level that we used to get when running costs were a quarter of what they are today, they never dropped until the Eastern European Hauliers came in and carved the job up
It has taken a few years, but now that is coming back to bite them on the arse, they can make more money back in their home countries, yet there isn’t enough work there because they bought too many lorries so they could ■■■■ and pillage the European International Haulage scene, now they’re moaning that they ain’t making any money, but it’s a problem of their own making, your economics background will give you the answer, but just in case you have your Poland Blinkers on and will not see it is because of this…
All of a sudden a massive influx of foreign money came into your country, the new way of capitalism means that the laws of supply and demand dictate prices, lots of money about so everyone wants all the fancy stuff, the shops run low on fancy stuff, so the price goes up, all of a sudden the huge amount of cash in your pocket doesn’t buy as much as it used to and you’re back to where you started, the poor are once again poor 
Meanwhile the companies you’ve been hauling goods around for or working at for next to nothing are making a fortune from lower operating costs, so the rich get richer, it’s economics 101
turnip:
Lol.
Still wrong. Most places charge a couple of euros so they still don’t bother.
Off course, because they like to be dirty. They are subhumans, you know.
newmercman:
There is a British saying “There are none so blind, as those who will not see” it appears that it was made with you in mind
Oh, good one, can apply to a few guys in that thread 
As somebody who was actually involved with overseas transportation in the years leading up to the Eastern Invasion, I do have a few facts to back up my claims too
It used to be that driving down the roads of Europe you would see lorries of all nationalities, there were the State Owned lorries from Eastern Europe and there were a fair number of them, they pretty much had the market cornered on the routes they travelled, if you did run through the Iron Curtain you did see the odd foreign lorry, but mostly you saw lorries from the home country (whichever country that was) In Western Europe the situation was a little different, mainly due to the trade situation between countries, but it was always a two way street, for every British lorry you saw in Belgium, France, Germany, Holland, Italy, Portugal, Spain etc you would see a Belgian, French, Dutch, Italian. Spanish or Portugese etc lorry on the road in Britain. It worked very well, even though it was cheaper to run a Portugese lorry than a British lorry, The Portugese never dominated the market and the British lorry could still make money doing the same job as the Portugese lorry.
We do agree so far. It was because in Western Europe you had freedom to make business while in Eastern Europe everything had to be state regulated.
Then that all changed, the market was suddenly flooded with two tracksuit wearing drivers in brand new lorries and trailers bearing Eastern European registrations, the rates dropped overnight, a coincedence
Off course not. Everytime when there is a sudden input of supply into the market, the prices go down. And they were able to work at these prices, you weren’t.
You can argue until you’re blue in the face if you like, but the fact remains, international haulage rates now, for the most part are at a level that we used to get when running costs were a quarter of what they are today, they never dropped until the Eastern European Hauliers came in and carved the job up
Yes, but it is not only because of influx of Eastern Europeans. You can observe the same to some extend in your inland rates. Just to mention - when I first came to Scotland, Driver Hire was paying me 7.5 pound for each hour of work with nice overtime and everything and I was fresh driver. Now the agency rates are at least pound lower. This is due to general downturn in economics, credit crunch (maybe you heard, it was quite heard of), the biggest economical crisis since 1930s etc.
So altough you are right that influx of Eastern Europeans played a significant role, it was not the ONLY factor responsible… It was just that apart from struggling with the same problems as the whole world had to, British hauliers had this extra burden, which harmed them sighificantly.
It has taken a few years, but now that is coming back to bite them on the arse, they can make more money back in their home countries, yet there isn’t enough work there because they bought too many lorries so they could ■■■■ and pillage the European International Haulage scene, now they’re moaning that they ain’t making any money, but it’s a problem of their own making, your economics background will give you the answer, but just in case you have your Poland Blinkers on and will not see it is because of this…
They bought right amount of lorries to meet demand in 2008 or something. But now there is a crisis. Economy slows down, people buy less, so less is manufactured and less has to be transported.
Lot of Polish companies went bankrupt and more will go, and soon the playing field (at least for 2004 ten and the “old union”) will be level.
All of a sudden a massive influx of foreign money came into your country, the new way of capitalism means that the laws of supply and demand dictate prices, lots of money about so everyone wants all the fancy stuff, the shops run low on fancy stuff, so the price goes up, all of a sudden the huge amount of cash in your pocket doesn’t buy as much as it used to and you’re back to where you started, the poor are once again poor
You have some right in this, altough I would say it is a bit simplified, but I promised to do not write essays today, so lets leave it there that I agree with you partially on that
I just give you one hint: after we joined European Union, prices in Poland were leveled up to the Western prices much quicker than salaries were… Just to give you some example: my friends back in Poland earn now about 50% more of what they were earning some time ago, but their buying power is about 30% LOWER… We discussed it during my last visit there few weeks ago…
Meanwhile the companies you’ve been hauling goods around for or working at for next to nothing are making a fortune from lower operating costs, so the rich get richer, it’s economics 101
True. And most of these companies are great western brands, many located in Britain… So at the end of the day, its Britain who benefit from it
So after all, we do not disagree so much, see?
Ah, and one more thing. Your point of view is very Brito-centric. They were working for “next to nothing” for you. From Polish point of view, the rates here were very good, so they could grow their companies, buy new trucks etc etc etc, because back then they had lower costs.
Nowadays that changed, while at the same time the job market shrinked due to the economic downturn. So if you look at european market from Polish perspective, today there is less job, and you have to compare with Western Hauliers which you were able to completely ignore before because of your price advantages…
So in some manner of speaking there is an analogy of the situation of the Polish market to what you had in 2004, but, off course, the changes are not so sudden…
orys:
So after all, we do not disagree so much, see?
Only the FACT that before the ‘easterns’ came there were haulage rates available that a UK based International Transport company could make some money on, ie, in 1990 I could get £1,200 for a load of sheep pelts to Vic (Barcelona) & £1,050 to Salvetiera, now compare this to the rate I’ve quoted on this thread twice before & that’s 900 Euro’s Yorkshire to Valencia.
Compare the running costs between today & 22 years ago & tell me it’s not the Eastern Europeans that have ruined this job, then tell me that we could make some cost cutting measures and go out & take these export loads back from the ‘East’!! Dream on orys, while there are trucks available that will take on these 900 Euro UK-Valencia loads the rates will remain at this stupidly low level.
You stick to your studies, get some good qualifications & start a UK based international haulage company & with the benefit of your knowledge of cost cutting go forth & take on the Eastern European’s at 900 Euro’s for a 1,300 mile trip. I wish you all the luck in the world. (you’ll need it)
Ross.
orys:
today there is less job, and you have to compare with Western Hauliers which you were able to completely ignore before because of your price advantages…
Which advantage was that, our super cheap labour costs, NO!!, our super cheap diesel costs, er, NO!!
Please, enlighten us!!
bigr250:
You stick to your studies, get some good qualifications & start a UK based international haulage company & with the benefit of your knowledge of cost cutting go forth & take on the Eastern European’s at 900 Euro’s for a 1,300 mile trip. I wish you all the luck in the world. (you’ll need it)
Well, I know a small family run courier company that delivers parcels to Poland. Doors to doors. They do it much cheaper than we would do it or that it would cost you to send in DHL. They are based in Scotland, they use only British-registered vehicles, all their costs are British, the owners of the company have bought some time ago a nice house and now they refubrishing it. They are nice couple, they have two daughters, they go on holidays quite often (altough not as often and not for as long as my boss do).
The only factor is their nationality, all other costs they have are exactly the same as for British company - since they are de facto British company.
Obviously if they can do it, any Briton can do it as well?
orys:
today there is less job, and you have to compare with Western Hauliers which you were able to completely ignore before because of your price advantages…Which advantage was that, our super cheap labour costs, NO!!, our super cheap diesel costs, er, NO!!
Please, enlighten us!!
Well, wrong English on my side. This sentence apply to Polish hauliers. I was trying to say that 5 years ago Polish hauliers dont needed to take into consideration British competitors, as they would knock out every of them with the price they could offer. Nowadays the prices are similar, so they have to compete not only between themselves but also with other hauliers.
I’ve been to Czech Republic recently, I saw there lot of French trucks for example…
I wonder how many of those French trucks had French drivers.
hutpik:
I wonder how many of those French trucks had French drivers.
I’d hazard a guess based on the French registered trucks I’ve come across in the past 3 to 5 years outside of France and say…none of them?
limeyphil:
fly sheet:
Ive refrained from this post so far, the facts speak for themselves, your new capitalism ruined a great job orys, you lot made your bed so stfu & lie in it.i’ve yet to find an east european driving a lorry for peanuts, i’ve yet to find an east european operator doing the job for sod all.
i’ve heard about operators bringing in 1500 litres of latvian diesel, then running around the uk all week and undercutting the job.
do these people know how much fuel it takes to get here from latvia?
there are plenty of loads in and out of eastern europe, but the reason we arn’t doing them is because most of the work can’t be done by lazy screwdrivers. the rate out there is better than uk domestic work.
This post is a joke right or your sucking on a crack pipe.
I do think that a very high percentage of UK drivers wouldn’t be cut out to do the job that the Poles and Lithuanians do, ie go away for a few weeks at a time and use their own inniative to get the job done. Proper British continental drivers are a dying breed and have been replaced by whinging high vis wearing corporate clones who want to drive a truck but dont want to get their hands dirty, do a night out or work more hours than Tesco shop workers who they constantly compare their job to when complaining about long hours. Its irrelivent because British companies can’t compete on cost by a long margin, but even if they could and thousands of UK trucks could be sent abroad, who the hell would be driving them? Most of the old hands are over 60 now and most of the drivers who’ve come in to the industry in the past 10 years are the before mentioned types, not all mind, but we certainly dont have enough of a truck driving work force in this country with a willingness to work and get the job done like many other European countries do. The hard reality is that while the average British truck driver is sitting with his feet up having a 45 minute break after having spent 5 hours on a bay, doing sod all except sit in his cab and sleep, your average Pole is pressing on down the road getting the job done rather than behaving like a militant union type who thinks he’s hard done by for having to do more than 8 hours a day.
fly sheet:
limeyphil:
fly sheet:
Ive refrained from this post so far, the facts speak for themselves, your new capitalism ruined a great job orys, you lot made your bed so stfu & lie in it.i’ve yet to find an east european driving a lorry for peanuts, i’ve yet to find an east european operator doing the job for sod all.
i’ve heard about operators bringing in 1500 litres of latvian diesel, then running around the uk all week and undercutting the job.
do these people know how much fuel it takes to get here from latvia?
there are plenty of loads in and out of eastern europe, but the reason we arn’t doing them is because most of the work can’t be done by lazy screwdrivers. the rate out there is better than uk domestic work.This post is a joke right or your sucking on a crack pipe.
which bit?
the fact that you can’t fill in lithuania with 1500 litres, and still have the same amount of fuel when you arrive in the UK?
the fact that UK operators complain about poor rates, but can’t get drivers to run to and from lithuania at £2+ per mile?
the operators complain about poor rates, but don’t have the guts to put in a decent rate? they are the same ones that complain all the time, but ask them when the last time they quoted for a job. or do they just do second/third hand work?
^^^^^What a load of cobblers^^^^^
GBPub:
^^^^^What a load of cobblers^^^^^
really.
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=90151
GBPub:
^^^^^What a load of cobblers^^^^^
^ ^ ^ What a great bunch of well put arguments to prove that the previous poster is not right ^ ^ ^
robinhood_1984:
your average Pole is pressing on down the road getting the job done rather than behaving like a militant union type who thinks he’s hard done by for having to do more than 8 hours a day.
Correct!!!
On 300€ basic a month and an ilegel 0,07€ per kilometer trying to earn a living, against his lazy British counterparts who have got another life , after 60hrs in 5 days and having the guts to stand up and say “no thanks thats enough for this week”
orys:
GBPub:
^^^^^What a load of cobblers^^^^^^ ^ ^ What a great bunch of well put arguments to prove that the previous poster is not right ^ ^ ^
Orys when someone spouts bull as he did, what is the point of posting a lengthy reply?
gbtransp:
On 300€ basic a month
300 Euro a month is not even a minimum wage in Poland. And truck drivers earn much more than minimum wage. Also so far paying per mile is not illegal, even some British companies do it as far as I can know from this forum (not that I think is fair - I would never agree to be paid per mile).
GBPub:
Orys when someone spouts bull as he did, what is the point of posting a lengthy reply?
I was just joking as it made me smile, but seriously the answer is: so you don’t look like the kid from the sandbox, but as someone who knows that he is right and can prove it with factual data. That way your post is not just kiddish pushing around, but can prove some educational value for someone who dont knows much on the subject but wants to learn. This is why I keep answering all this ignorant posts like the one above yours last for example
robinhood_1984:
I do think that a very high percentage of UK drivers wouldn’t be cut out to do the job that the Poles and Lithuanians do, ie go away for a few weeks at a time and use their own inniative to get the job done. Proper British continental drivers are a dying breed and have been replaced by whinging high vis wearing corporate clones who want to drive a truck but dont want to get their hands dirty, do a night out or work more hours than Tesco shop workers who they constantly compare their job to when complaining about long hours. Its irrelivent because British companies can’t compete on cost by a long margin, but even if they could and thousands of UK trucks could be sent abroad, who the hell would be driving them? Most of the old hands are over 60 now and most of the drivers who’ve come in to the industry in the past 10 years are the before mentioned types, not all mind, but we certainly dont have enough of a truck driving work force in this country with a willingness to work and get the job done like many other European countries do. The hard reality is that while the average British truck driver is sitting with his feet up having a 45 minute break after having spent 5 hours on a bay, doing sod all except sit in his cab and sleep, your average Pole is pressing on down the road getting the job done rather than behaving like a militant union type who thinks he’s hard done by for having to do more than 8 hours a day.
As much as reading this post made me angry at first, I have to fully agree with just about all the points made.
Ross.
Angry Ross? It makes me sad, after years of competing on an uneven playing field against The Poles, who incidentally I worked with a few full time on Spedition Services & had a good relationship with all, im now reading this drivel written by an expat Pole from Scotland ffs.
As for the comments by this limey fella, I last quoted a job to Klaipeda about 9 monrhs back & got laughed off the phone, The Poles at the time where doing Uk Moscow for 1900 gbp the brainless fools.
Done & dusted with the jobm only dreamers left doing general to eastern europe now.
fly sheet:
As for the comments by this limey fella, I last quoted a job to Klaipeda about 9 monrhs back & got laughed off the phone, The Poles at the time where doing Uk Moscow for 1900 gbp the brainless fools.
Riga - Moscow for a 40ft container 2400 euros in 2008, now its about 1800-2000 euros.