Winseer:
The dodgy bit - would be if you do another job that doesn’t involve driving with a digicard - or driving at ALL, come to that.Another “Grey Area” would be if a part-timer were to do unpaid voluntary work on a regular, scheduled, basis.
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Not really grey tbh. In both of them scenarios you’d be classed as a non mobile worker and would therefore not be required to keep records at all.
Noremac:
From what I understand the three methods that were officially acceptable before were the digi-card, the analogue chart and printout paper from the digital tachograph. Therefore, this means NO CHANGE.Also, if you record days you work and your start and finish times by implication days with no shifts are time off. No need to produce a piece of paper for each day off. Entirely stupid and pointless record-keeping.
If the DVSA was making a change to enforcement and penalties and the way they deal with lack of records or incorrectly held records they would announce it.
So essentially no change from before, a diary will probably be okay and I suspect that a DVSA officer would probably find a diary more readable than being handed a wod of tachograph paper to sift through.
The enforcement is the whole point why this subject is on the forums. The needs fir the full 28 days to be able to be produced at the roadside, either in the card, on a printout or a tacho chart.
Letterheads from the office, diaries, timesheets, whatever are not acceptable.
Acorn:
Noremac:
From what I understand the three methods that were officially acceptable before were the digi-card, the analogue chart and printout paper from the digital tachograph. Therefore, this means NO CHANGE.Also, if you record days you work and your start and finish times by implication days with no shifts are time off. No need to produce a piece of paper for each day off. Entirely stupid and pointless record-keeping.
If the DVSA was making a change to enforcement and penalties and the way they deal with lack of records or incorrectly held records they would announce it.
So essentially no change from before, a diary will probably be okay and I suspect that a DVSA officer would probably find a diary more readable than being handed a wod of tachograph paper to sift through.
The enforcement is the whole point why this subject is on the forums. The needs fir the full 28 days to be able to be produced at the roadside, either in the card, on a printout or a tacho chart.
Letterheads from the office, diaries, timesheets, whatever are not acceptable.
If I’ve got right you can just tell a digi tacho to put even 28 days previous holiday on the card when you start.
Not so easy in the case of log books or paper tacho charts.That would mean manually filling out 28 days worth of log book entries or charts as rest.
Acorn:
Noremac:
From what I understand the three methods that were officially acceptable before were the digi-card, the analogue chart and printout paper from the digital tachograph. Therefore, this means NO CHANGE.Also, if you record days you work and your start and finish times by implication days with no shifts are time off. No need to produce a piece of paper for each day off. Entirely stupid and pointless record-keeping.
If the DVSA was making a change to enforcement and penalties and the way they deal with lack of records or incorrectly held records they would announce it.
So essentially no change from before, a diary will probably be okay and I suspect that a DVSA officer would probably find a diary more readable than being handed a wod of tachograph paper to sift through.
The enforcement is the whole point why this subject is on the forums. The needs fir the full 28 days to be able to be produced at the roadside, either in the card, on a printout or a tacho chart.
Letterheads from the office, diaries, timesheets, whatever are not acceptable.
There is a list of amendments made to the DVSA sanctions policy that is publicly available. I haven’t seen any evidence that the DVSA has changed its approach apart from what the lawyer James Backhouse has claimed. If no link to where this information has come from is given, what the lawyer says is simply hearsay.
When the article says there must be nearly 100% non-compliance with the rules, I think Mr Backhouse needs to get real. At any company where drivers are doing manual entries and entering rest for all the time between shifts, these drivers are entirely compliant because the required records are entirely on the digi-card.
Always winds me up when as a truck driver I have to account for every minute of my time with manual entries, yet the majority of road users ie car drivers can pretty much do as they like, same with speed limiters, if it were really down to road safety and emissions then ALL vehicles would be fitted with them, governments only ever like to bully the minority rather than the majority.
If I’m off work for a long time, when I get back, I just do a manual entry and use the ? symbol, then crack on and forget about it. A TM once told me to do that. I’ve done it ever since at several companies, and never been pulled up on it.
For those who think 28 days worth of records are a pain…
Record Keeping for 56 Days
From the 31st December 2024, drivers must carry proof of driver hours worked (working, driving, on-call and rest times) for the day and the last 56 days. This is to improve the control and quality of weekly rest periods.
That’s from freightlink.co.uk/knowledge … -know-2022
I haven’t yet found this same info on gov.uk but it has been regularly discussed in TM groups
For Part time drivers who have another non driving job and drive just once a fortnight on agency, it will mean doing a manual entries for each day worked elsewhere as “Other Work” and “Rest” for the previous two weeks. It will mean those who currently/used to work 5 days in the office then the whole weekend driving (it happens) won’t be able to do that anymore, and if they work Mon-Fri at another place, they now can only do driving work one day every other weekend to stick within the rules. Same with others who do 4 on 4 off in one job, and then a driving job on their 4 off to top up their income will have to take on less work to stick within the rules.
It is those types I have mentioned that they are cracking down on, especially with cost of living going up and and working every hour possible to just pay the bills and put food onto the table.
I currently work Monday - Friday and drive on Sundays now and again, in keeping with the rules. I currently have a diary in which I record all my work, and use the “?” mode between driving shifts.
Will I now have to record all non-driving work onto my digi card using manual entries?
Goff118:
I currently work Monday - Friday and drive on Sundays now and again, in keeping with the rules. I currently have a diary in which I record all my work, and use the “?” mode between driving shifts.Will I now have to record all non-driving work onto my digi card using manual entries?
Either manual entries, by writing on the back of printouts or on analogue tacho charts
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If my card isn’t in the head I’m on a weekly rest period . What I do in that time is my business and I don’t give a flying F*%K who comes asking . If I’m not being paid they can whistle dixie . About time a few people grew a backbone and started telling these clowns to do one .
richiem1987:
For Part time drivers who have another non driving job and drive just once a fortnight on agency, it will mean doing a manual entries for each day worked elsewhere as “Other Work” and “Rest” for the previous two weeks. It will mean those who currently/used to work 5 days in the office then the whole weekend driving (it happens) won’t be able to do that anymore, and if they work Mon-Fri at another place, they now can only do driving work one day every other weekend to stick within the rules. Same with others who do 4 on 4 off in one job, and then a driving job on their 4 off to top up their income will have to take on less work to stick within the rules.It is those types I have mentioned that they are cracking down on, especially with cost of living going up and and working every hour possible to just pay the bills and put food onto the table.
Unless he finishes his office job at 5pm on Friday and only starts work on hgv at 2pm on sunday and does a 2 til 10 every sunday thats 45 hours rest every week, am I right in thinking this is legal?
edit, office job is 8 hours a day add this to the sunday 8 hours = 48 hours work
shullbit:
richiem1987:
For Part time drivers who have another non driving job and drive just once a fortnight on agency, it will mean doing a manual entries for each day worked elsewhere as “Other Work” and “Rest” for the previous two weeks. It will mean those who currently/used to work 5 days in the office then the whole weekend driving (it happens) won’t be able to do that anymore, and if they work Mon-Fri at another place, they now can only do driving work one day every other weekend to stick within the rules. Same with others who do 4 on 4 off in one job, and then a driving job on their 4 off to top up their income will have to take on less work to stick within the rules.It is those types I have mentioned that they are cracking down on, especially with cost of living going up and and working every hour possible to just pay the bills and put food onto the table.
Unless he finishes his office job at 5pm on Friday and only starts work on hgv at 2pm on sunday and does a 2 til 10 every sunday thats 45 hours rest every week, am I right in thinking this is legal?
edit, office job is 8 hours a day add this to the sunday 8 hours = 48 hours work
Would just about be legal, but no room for manover if delayed and could result in a late start on a Monday to stick within the rules.
Terry Cooksey:
Goff118:
I currently work Monday - Friday and drive on Sundays now and again, in keeping with the rules. I currently have a diary in which I record all my work, and use the “?” mode between driving shifts.Will I now have to record all non-driving work onto my digi card using manual entries?
Either manual entries, by writing on the back of printouts or on analogue tacho charts
Sent from my SM-F711B using Tapatalk
So if I write down my “?” time on the back of each printout for the fortnight before I don’t need to keep a diary? That’d be easier than what I’m currently doing.
Goff118:
Terry Cooksey:
Goff118:
I currently work Monday - Friday and drive on Sundays now and again, in keeping with the rules. I currently have a diary in which I record all my work, and use the “?” mode between driving shifts.Will I now have to record all non-driving work onto my digi card using manual entries?
Either manual entries, by writing on the back of printouts or on analogue tacho charts
Sent from my SM-F711B using Tapatalk
So if I write down my “?” time on the back of each printout for the fortnight before I don’t need to keep a diary? That’d be easier than what I’m currently doing.
No because you’re not accounting for all your other non driving work. The ? is defined as an unknown but is (or used to be anyway) presumed as rest.
To use the back of a printout you’d have to do one for each day on the back drawing tedious little lines between to signify when you were working, when you had breaks and also showing daily rests too. Same with a paper (round disc) chart.
If the hours in your other job are fixed, such as 9am-5pm, it woukdnt take a lot to get really good and really quick at inputting a weeks worth when you drive on a Sunday.
00:00 - 09:00 Rest
09:00 - 12:30 Other work
12:30 - 13:30 Break
13-30 - 17:00 Other work
17:00 - 00:00 Rest
Assuming your other job is fairly steady and whatever you put is an accurate record etc etc.
I bet most moaning on here are full-time drivers or only do EU driving work, it’s nothing to get stressed about or think you’re being victimised.
The only change is you now must use the bed symbol to record non working time as opposed the ?
You can do this by pressing yes to rest till now on a stoneridge tacho, or by doing a manual entry on a VDO, I know there’s still some who haven’t worked out how to do 1 in the last 16 or so years, but it takes seconds, it is no hardship and no one isn’t smart enough to claim it is.
If you’re off work for 2 weeks or even 2 years, it’s 1 manual entry, that still only takes a few seconds.
The people who it’s gonna be a hassle for are the people that are just driving under EU regulations for their work, but this is nothing new, they should have been recording their other work anyway by the exact same methods, nothing has changed there. It’s just now you need to also record the rest periods were in the passed the gaps between work were accepted as rest so long as there were no evidence to the contrary.
Diarys have never been an official way to record anything, for at least the 20 odd years I’ve been driving, but often they have been accepted.
Logbooks are an official way only if you’ve used a logbook to record your hours when operating under GB domestic, nothing has changed there.
Jesus h Christ! The amount of pedantic navel gazing in this thread amazes me! When did working guys actually lose their back bones! VOSA or DVSA or whatever their called don’t actually own your asses just because you have a driver card!Whether you want to spend your “freely disposed rest” say growing tomatoes or snorting coke off the bellies of hookers is absolutely nothing to do with them. Unless you ‘fess up like some kind of melt IF you are actually stopped then I wouldn’t even worry about it. Christ, the shifts I’ve done over the years to put food on the table and keep a roof over the kids heads,in the grand scheme of things this bull wouldn’t even register on my radar
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GOG47:
Jesus h Christ! The amount of pedantic navel gazing in this thread amazes me! When did working guys actually lose their back bones! VOSA or DVSA or whatever their called don’t actually own your asses just because you have a driver card!Whether you want to spend your “freely disposed rest” say growing tomatoes or snorting coke off the bellies of hookers is absolutely nothing to do with them. Unless you ‘fess up like some kind of melt IF you are actually stopped then I wouldn’t even worry about it. Christ, the shifts I’ve done over the years to put food on the table and keep a roof over the kids heads,in the grand scheme of things this bull wouldn’t even register on my radarSent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yeh ok 
For those of you who predominantly do a non-driving job and do driving under EU regulations occasionally, see attached about changes to record keeping for non-driving hours:
Now this is a right pain in the proverbial for me as I work Mon-Fri in the office and then often every other weekend I’ll do a day of driving…so now according to this, I have to do a written manual tachograph entry for each day in the office, whereas previously I’ve just carried round extract of electronic timesheet from my main job. 
fnv:
For those of you who predominantly do a non-driving job and do driving under EU regulations occasionally, see attached about changes to record keeping for non-driving hours:More onerous tacho EU requirements on drivers! - Backhouse Jones
Now this is a right pain in the proverbial for me as I work Mon-Fri in the office and then often every other weekend I’ll do a day of driving…so now according to this, I have to do a written manual tachograph entry for each day in the office, whereas previously I’ve just carried round extract of electronic timesheet from my main job.
There’s no evidence that the requirements for record keeping have changed, you’re quoting a company that wants to sell a service.
As far as I can see that whole thread is based on a myth that was started to scare people into buying a service.
Out of interest, why start a new thread when the other one on the same subject is still running, it just causes confusion 
trucknetuk.com/phpBB/viewto … cdbb2de4d6
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