Fuel tanker strike

44 Tonne Ton:

interlog:

44 Tonne Ton:
Isn’t it wonderful how the working man turns on his own when there’s the slightest possibility of someone getting something they don’t have? Since 2009 this country has bailed out the banks to the tune of £325 billion but that’s not worth a word these days. But then lorry drivers don’t usually attend Eton/Westminster/Oxford/Cambridge do they? Jobs for the boys lads, jobs for the boys!

Indeed. How did one used to get into tanker driving? It was who you knew rather than what you knew. Dead mans shoes for a starter followed by knowing somebody before you were even considered driving for those good wages. One should look indeed after ones own.

I see. So you’re a happier bunny knowing that a working man is getting less for the job and that money now goes to the fat cats.

It isn’t about the money though isn’t it? Well that is the tune being played by the pay masters, Unite the Union.

interlog:

44 Tonne Ton:

interlog:

44 Tonne Ton:
Isn’t it wonderful how the working man turns on his own when there’s the slightest possibility of someone getting something they don’t have? Since 2009 this country has bailed out the banks to the tune of £325 billion but that’s not worth a word these days. But then lorry drivers don’t usually attend Eton/Westminster/Oxford/Cambridge do they? Jobs for the boys lads, jobs for the boys!

Indeed. How did one used to get into tanker driving? It was who you knew rather than what you knew. Dead mans shoes for a starter followed by knowing somebody before you were even considered driving for those good wages. One should look indeed after ones own.

I see. So you’re a happier bunny knowing that a working man is getting less for the job and that money now goes to the fat cats.

It isn’t about the money though isn’t it? Well that is the tune being played by the pay masters, Unite the Union.

It’s war and you know it. To the victor the spoils!!! Let’s hope it’s the working class celebrating a victory this time.

44 Tonne Ton:
It’s war and you know it. To the victor the spoils!!! Let’s hope it’s the working class celebrating a victory this time.

Just like the British Airways cabin crew strike then. Very comparable. A set of employees living in the past not willing to adopt.

Where did it get them? Me thinks absolutely nowhere other than losing wages for not working aka known as striking.

interlog:

44 Tonne Ton:
It’s war and you know it. To the victor the spoils!!! Let’s hope it’s the working class celebrating a victory this time.

Just like the British Airways cabin crew strike then. Very comparable. A set of employees living in the past not willing to adopt.

Where did it get them? Me thinks absolutely nowhere other than losing wages for not working aka known as striking.

What you lose in the short term you make up in the long term if you do it right Guv’nor. As no doubt you know. :wink:

44 Tonne Ton:
What you lose in the short term you make up in the long term if you do it right Guv’nor. As no doubt you know. :wink:

Do it right indeed. At least have the guts to say you don’t want to do a day’s honest graft but instead do as little as you possibly can, rather than make it out to be a H&S matter including clips of truck crashes and Bunsfield exploding as per the Youtube video.

It is really pathetic.

I would have more sympathy if the real agenda was revealed.

interlog:

44 Tonne Ton:
What you lose in the short term you make up in the long term if you do it right Guv’nor. As no doubt you know. :wink:

Do it right indeed. At least have the guts to say you don’t want to do a day’s honest graft but instead do as little as you possibly can, rather than make it out to be a H&S matter including clips of truck crashes and Bunsfield exploding as per the Youtube video.

It is really pathetic.

I would have more sympathy if the real agenda was revealed.

You mean like the Guv’nors do?

44 Tonne Ton:
What you lose in the short term you make up in the long term if you do it right Guv’nor. As no doubt you know. :wink:

Too right! Just look at the British car manufacturing industry in the 1970’s and the miners in the 1980’s. Both sterling examples of how going on strike had massive long term advantages.

Oh, hang on, neither of those industries exist in any meaningful way in this country any more. Hmmmmmm…

Paul

repton:

44 Tonne Ton:
What you lose in the short term you make up in the long term if you do it right Guv’nor. As no doubt you know. :wink:

Too right! Just look at the British car manufacturing industry in the 1970’s and the miners in the 1980’s. Both sterling examples of how going on strike had massive long term advantages.

Oh, hang on, neither of those industries exist in any meaningful way in this country any more. Hmmmmmm…

Paul

You right,but they need to make some changes,as they cant sell the fuel tankers to china

repton:

44 Tonne Ton:
What you lose in the short term you make up in the long term if you do it right Guv’nor. As no doubt you know. :wink:

Too right! Just look at the British car manufacturing industry in the 1970’s and the miners in the 1980’s. Both sterling examples of how going on strike had massive long term advantages.

Oh, hang on, neither of those industries exist in any meaningful way in this country any more. Hmmmmmm…

Paul

Excectly my thoughts, there hase been no strike in the last 20 years that has brought something substantial.
Fuel companies will (as many others) get rid of own vehicles and drivers and will spread the work over several hauliers.
They have done that already on several occasions and it’s the sound of the future.
Thiis will end up the same as many of the manufacturing industry in the UK, best paid labour in that kind of industry (Think Rover),…but no jobs.
BUT IT’S EASTER, THAT IDIOT OF A LEN MCCLUNSKY NOT TO SPOIL EASTER FOR EVERYBODY.
HE LOOKS TO ME THE KIND OF GUYS, WHO PULLS THE LEGS OF FROGS AND PUT A MOUSE IN THE MICROWAVE.
MIND TO PUT HIM THE RIGHT WAY UP, BECAUSE HIS FACE LOOKS NOW LIKE HIS ARSE AND HE SEEMS TO TALK OUT OF IT.
Probaly couldn’t this year get BA personal oir the luggage handlers lined up for strike (or is McClunsky going on holiday himself with his croonies■■?)
I really hope that all the strikers have a very rotten, missarable, and disatrous Easter, because I will have if the strikes go on.
Strange they never strike around the somer holiday.
And a dangerous job■■?
You choose it…there are plenty who will do it for that money without a moan.
Do something else if you think it’s to dangerous!!!

Perhaps those who oppose the strike will tell us all how they would improve pay & conditions in the transport industry, if drivers shouldn’t stick together?
Perhaps they would tell us all what proposals they have for keeping those conditions?
Since strikes are legal in the UK as long as procedures are followed, why is it that you always vilify any group of workers who abide by the rules and excercise their democratic right to withdraw their labour?

I’ve asked these question before on this site, up till now, no one has answered the question’s.
Alex

alexsaville:
Perhaps those who oppose the strike will tell us all how they would improve pay & conditions in the transport industry, if drivers shouldn’t stick together?
Perhaps they would tell us all what proposals they have for keeping those conditions?
Since strikes are legal in the UK as long as procedures are followed, why is it that you always vilify any group of workers who abide by the rules and excercise their democratic right to withdraw their labour?

I’ve asked these question before on this site, up till now, no one has answered the question’s.
Alex

Becausea strike should never do damage to any person not involved in the industrial dispute!!

UNite strikes are always aimed to do as much damage to general public as possible, can it be FAIR that peope work a whole year for their holidays lose out for somebody’s personal gain.

Than be as striker fair and reimbusrse all these companies and private people who get finacial damage of the strike.

Otherwise i will always see it as BIG Selfish action

There are more countries who never strike, or very seldom and have much better condistions for their workforce, lets say Holland and several Scandinavian countries.
so it can be done.
Strike is like opening the fridge with a termal lance.

As a Tanker Driver myself for the last 20 years, let me explain afew things. I have worked for the biggest oil company and now work for a major supermarket, delivering fuel to retail sites. This strike is about several things. WE are not asking for anymore money. I consider my self to be well paid (not the 45k as been broadcast). The problem is many years ago the drivers had the best training, decent pension and good T&Cs. Now this has all been taken away. Not to mention some contractors who now believe they can cut rates to gain a contract, paying the drivers less money to gain these contracts. Cutting back on training to gain these contracts. We all have kids etc and loved ones on the road, some of the guys i have saw TRYING to do this job with hardly any training is shocking. Some of which i have been banned from garages as the owner do not wish them back there as they are pretty much unsafe. Something needs to be done, we have been in talks for well over 2 years. The companys will not listen as profit is more important. We have moved with the times and have saw pay cuts and accepted them many years ago. I am not over paid, I give up alot of my social life and family time working all hours of the day and night including weekends and bank hols. I have saw many guys arrive to do this job and many fail, it takes a special type of guy to do this job, as it is so easy to mess up in some way or another, from loading to discharge. Company will not tolerate any so called balls up as it is always very costly. So in some cases 1 mess up and your out of a job.
We do not want to strike, we want to get back around the table and sort this out once and for all.

MADBAZ:
Safety concerns, my ARSE

If they were so concerned with safety the muppet in the Shell Rigid on the A15 today wouldn’t have overtaken me on double whites and cut it so fine with oncoming traffic, all because I was doing a nice SAFE & legal 40!!!.

i rest my case friend, this is the sort of muppet this industry is attracting

I give up alot of my social life and family time working all hours of the day and night including weekends and bank hols.

Same as potentially any lorry driver, no?

Perhaps those who oppose the strike will tell us all how they would improve pay & conditions in the transport industry

Start your own business and pay your drivers what you would have liked to have been paid when you were a driver, assuming you can afford to.
Realise you would probably rather keep that extra money for yourself to reflect the added risk of running your own business, rather than the driver who just has to show up, drive, go home, forget about it.

Perhaps they would tell us all what proposals they have for keeping those conditions?
Since strikes are legal in the UK as long as procedures are followed, why is it that you always vilify any group of workers who abide by the rules and excercise their democratic right to withdraw their labour?

I’ve asked these question before on this site, up till now, no one has answered the question’s.

Maybe drivers should realise that they have little to no power to influence those things. Quite simply if you want to control your own earnings then you leave your job to find a better one or find some way to work for yourself. Self employed is the only way to go in that respect. Unfortunately, we all know how difficult that is to do in transport in the 21st century, plenty of stories on here.

I’ve worked jobs with rubbish pay and conditions and in the end the only way to change it (for myself) was to leave. No doubt they found someone else to do the job on the same money.

None of them could not be replaced by someone who is prepared to do it cheaper, whether that is morally or ethically correct doesn’t change the fact that it is true. That person who steps in might be taking a large step UP in wages in order to do it. So the tanker drivers are on to a loser from the start. They should have made hay while the sun has been shining, as its clouding up a bit right now.

As evidenced by history, strikes don’t really achieve anything for the long term, and just ■■■■ everyone off in the short term.

The people at the top of Unions are generally only there for one reason, and that is the same reason that these oil companies are cutting the rates, money.

Are any of these tanker drivers on the breadline? No, not a one. That is why my sympathy is lacking. It’s a job any of us could do with the correct training of a few days, and the chance to gain some experience doing it.

If I was earning 45k a year, I could put away 55% of my earnings per year into savings. It wouldn’t take very many years of that to be able to retire with a house paid for. Then casually work a few days a week as needed.

We are on the brink of battle with greedy oil companies and employers who thought that the campaign fuel tanker drivers began four years ago had gone away. Initially our fight was difficult and seemed to be going nowhere - some felt let down by the union, and many believed it was the right fight but simply at the wrong time.

But now we’ve reinvigorated and rebranded our campaign. Called ‘Enough is Enough’, the campaign has four main points:

Terms and conditions

We are demanding minimum standards for all tanker drivers. A draft agreement has been drawn up by the union with the help of the oil trades sub-committee, and this is our starting point for negotiations. The agreement takes into account the anti-social working hours of tanker drivers, and demands additional premiums for working nights, early starts, or five days over seven.

Training

We want a standard of training that is at the highest quality across the board regardless of who we work for. We are demanding a passport system whereby all drivers must meet a minimum standard to get their ‘passport’ to drive a tanker, ensuring no individual without the appropriate training and necessary competence may carry out any operation within the industry. For example, if a driver has not been trained for petroleum spirit deliveries then they would not be allowed to deliver petroleum spirit; if they’re not trained on cargo pumps then they can’t perform pump work. Simplistic, but a sensible approach to keeping the industry standard up.

Health and Safety

We want a minimum standard for health and safety. This means that no driver could be made to feel under pressure to do something that they feel is unsafe or be put under pressure to rush the job. We should have a working environment that is as calm and relaxed as possible to ensure the safety of the driver and everyone else around them.

Pension

As a direct result of the contract ‘merry-go-round’, many drivers have fragmented pensions from multiple contractors. Every time a contract is up for tender and the “employer” changes, the previous pensions schemes are not transferred over. The union UNITE has for some time now been working tirelessly to get an industry standard pension that is portable so every time a contract is lost and gained the pension moves with the driver. This has benefits for all parties as the companies do not have the same admin costs and the drivers have one continuous pension throughout their career.

It has been widely reported that tanker drivers earn £45k per annum for an average 37 hour week, if this is true it is for the minority, for the most part tanker drivers work what can only be described as antisocial hours to say the least.

Drivers will normally start a “day” shift as early as 2am, completing a 12 hour shift then passing the baton over to the afternoon shift. This pattern may be repeated four or five days a week. This can be gruelling; many drivers will have 4 days on, 4 days off, but some companies like to maximise weekend working by enforcing a five-days-over-seven working week.

Yes, we do earn a good wage, but at what cost to our family lives, health and social lives? I barely need to answer that, with what I have written so far.

Of course, many who drive other heavy goods vehicles will ask what makes out work so special.

Think about how often a goods delivery happens in a public domain where there is only one person carrying out all the parts of the delivery on their own.

Think about the product being delivered by the tanker driver, a flammable liquid that has the explosive power to do devastating damage.

One gallon of petrol will have the explosive power to transport a family of four in a middle sized hatchback for 30 - 40 miles!

That’s one little green can filled with 4.5 litres. On average there are 36000 to 42000 litres of fuel on board an articulated tanker.

It’s a huge responsibility - and it shouldn’t be done on the cheap! This is why we’re demanding the industry gives us the minimum standard we deserve.

So why strike? Simple: to stop the race to the bottom!

Every time a contract gets put out to tender the companies compete based on cost. This means one thing and one thing only, an attack on the terms and conditions of workers.

It means decreased wages, tight times to do a job, poor training, poor pensions to new entrants, an unfair division between men and women doing the same jobs.

It will also discourage the best drivers from applying - and when they are essentially in charge of transporting a mobile bomb, this is more than worrying. The safety of the general public is at risk if we do not stop the rot.

I want to finish on a different note - to other goods drivers on the road. We are all professional drivers playing a valuable role. We fuel tanker drivers are not fighting for our benefit alone. But we are the section of the industry that attracts the greatest renumeration. What direction will your wages and standards go in if we’re doing the top job on the cheap? It’s largely the same companies that are trying to cut costs in both of our sectors.

We can only fight our fight with your backing, with every last person in the haulage industry saying enough is enough. By sticking together we can revitalise this industry like a phoenix from the ashes of decades of cost down agendas.

If employers want to compete then let them, not on how cheap they are but on fundamental issues such as quality not quantity, safety not speed, and with drivers who drive with pride and professionalism. As the kings of the road…

Support the Fuel Tanker Drivers’ campaign

heathyboy:
We are on the brink of battle with greedy oil companies and employers who thought that the campaign fuel tanker drivers began four years ago had gone away. Initially our fight was difficult and seemed to be going nowhere - some felt let down by the union, and many believed it was the right fight but simply at the wrong time.

But now we’ve reinvigorated and rebranded our campaign. Called ‘Enough is Enough’, the campaign has four main points:

Terms and conditions

We are demanding minimum standards for all tanker drivers. A draft agreement has been drawn up by the union with the help of the oil trades sub-committee, and this is our starting point for negotiations. The agreement takes into account the anti-social working hours of tanker drivers, and demands additional premiums for working nights, early starts, or five days over seven.

Training

We want a standard of training that is at the highest quality across the board regardless of who we work for. We are demanding a passport system whereby all drivers must meet a minimum standard to get their ‘passport’ to drive a tanker, ensuring no individual without the appropriate training and necessary competence may carry out any operation within the industry. For example, if a driver has not been trained for petroleum spirit deliveries then they would not be allowed to deliver petroleum spirit; if they’re not trained on cargo pumps then they can’t perform pump work. Simplistic, but a sensible approach to keeping the industry standard up.

Health and Safety

We want a minimum standard for health and safety. This means that no driver could be made to feel under pressure to do something that they feel is unsafe or be put under pressure to rush the job. We should have a working environment that is as calm and relaxed as possible to ensure the safety of the driver and everyone else around them.

Pension

As a direct result of the contract ‘merry-go-round’, many drivers have fragmented pensions from multiple contractors. Every time a contract is up for tender and the “employer” changes, the previous pensions schemes are not transferred over. The union UNITE has for some time now been working tirelessly to get an industry standard pension that is portable so every time a contract is lost and gained the pension moves with the driver. This has benefits for all parties as the companies do not have the same admin costs and the drivers have one continuous pension throughout their career.

It has been widely reported that tanker drivers earn £45k per annum for an average 37 hour week, if this is true it is for the minority, for the most part tanker drivers work what can only be described as antisocial hours to say the least.

Drivers will normally start a “day” shift as early as 2am, completing a 12 hour shift then passing the baton over to the afternoon shift. This pattern may be repeated four or five days a week. This can be gruelling; many drivers will have 4 days on, 4 days off, but some companies like to maximise weekend working by enforcing a five-days-over-seven working week.

Yes, we do earn a good wage, but at what cost to our family lives, health and social lives? I barely need to answer that, with what I have written so far.

Of course, many who drive other heavy goods vehicles will ask what makes out work so special.

Think about how often a goods delivery happens in a public domain where there is only one person carrying out all the parts of the delivery on their own.

Think about the product being delivered by the tanker driver, a flammable liquid that has the explosive power to do devastating damage.

One gallon of petrol will have the explosive power to transport a family of four in a middle sized hatchback for 30 - 40 miles!

That’s one little green can filled with 4.5 litres. On average there are 36000 to 42000 litres of fuel on board an articulated tanker.

It’s a huge responsibility - and it shouldn’t be done on the cheap! This is why we’re demanding the industry gives us the minimum standard we deserve.

So why strike? Simple: to stop the race to the bottom!

Every time a contract gets put out to tender the companies compete based on cost. This means one thing and one thing only, an attack on the terms and conditions of workers.

It means decreased wages, tight times to do a job, poor training, poor pensions to new entrants, an unfair division between men and women doing the same jobs.

It will also discourage the best drivers from applying - and when they are essentially in charge of transporting a mobile bomb, this is more than worrying. The safety of the general public is at risk if we do not stop the rot.

I want to finish on a different note - to other goods drivers on the road. We are all professional drivers playing a valuable role. We fuel tanker drivers are not fighting for our benefit alone. But we are the section of the industry that attracts the greatest renumeration. What direction will your wages and standards go in if we’re doing the top job on the cheap? It’s largely the same companies that are trying to cut costs in both of our sectors.

We can only fight our fight with your backing, with every last person in the haulage industry saying enough is enough. By sticking together we can revitalise this industry like a phoenix from the ashes of decades of cost down agendas.

If employers want to compete then let them, not on how cheap they are but on fundamental issues such as quality not quantity, safety not speed, and with drivers who drive with pride and professionalism. As the kings of the road…

Support the Fuel Tanker Drivers’ campaign

With the greatest of respect, healthyboy, I’m sure you didn’t write that yourself. :wink:

There’s a fair bit of that which I can agree with, and more that I can actually sympathise with.But there’s a lot in there that’s laughable PR bulldust.

The comment about “doing the whole delivery on your own within the public domain”…come on man, even the bloody postman can manage that! :smiley:

Correct me if I’m wrong please, but you deliver from refineries or storage depots to garage forecourts which are normally level, lit and on public roads. You do not have to negotiate farm tracks, drive off-road, tip up under wires, or even get particularly dirty. Wasn’t so long ago that tanker work was a collar and tie job.

There’s no handball beyond carrying the delivery pipes. You do not carry cash, so are not at risk of being mugged; you know your delivery points, so are not at risk of getting lost. AFAIK you do not do nights away. Your kit (quite rightly) has to meet very high maintenence standards above and beyond that which us normal mortals endure.

Your start times may well be ■■■■ but you’re far from unique in this; you’re doing regular 12 hour shifts like a lot of others but you’re not doing 15 hour days unless something goes wrong.

Given that you are “demanding” extra money for shifts, can you please confirm that you do not receive such payments already?

Would the “passport” system be a recognised trade training programme, or simply a re-introduction of the “dead mans shoes” system which made new entry from outside your own clique virtually impossible?

And you want a working environment that’s “calm and relaxed”? You’re in the wrong job mister.

One last question. I’d always considered that working to rule was a viable option prior to all-out striking. Is it not the case that your job is already so hide-bound by Spanish practices and union interference that if you were to work to rule, no-one would notice the difference… and that’s really what you’re afraid of? :wink:

So this dispute is about H&S issues. If they are that important why have they not been resolved before now? These drivers should have brought this matter to a head long ago, if that is the real reason for the industrial action.

As has been stated in previous posts, there are drivers with far worse conditions and far less pay than tanker drivers.

This is about a union that has no consideration for the working class it alledgedly represents, after all if there is no fuel then workers could be laid off and receive no pay because of it. This more about a leader who wants confrontation with the Government. Scargill did the same and we all know how sucessful that was for the miners.

A milk tanker driver does work under far worst conditions, far worst hours.
5 out of 7 is nothing more than normal, the whole world does it.
Every tanker driver deliver on his own (and mostimes not on a nice forecourt with coffee and snacks)
Petrol and Diesel are only dangerous under the right circumstances, they are not driving bombs, and the governements recognise that, hence the reason for single wall tanks in a square constructions.
If they where driving bombs the would be proper heavy gauge steel in a cilinder form.
If you drive hydrogen perioxide than you can say that you drive a bomb
Starting at 02:00hrs, how many multi drop drivers, animal feed drivers etc. do that.

BUT FUNNY ENOUGH THE UNION DON’T STAND UP FOR THEM, BECAUSE IT GIVES NO MEDIA COVER!!!

iT DOESN’T ■■■■ JOE BLOG UP ON THE STREET WHO IS GONE PAY FOR THIS

1 REASON MORE NEVER PAY ONE PENNY ON ANY UNION, I WOULDN’T EVEN GIVE THEM THE SMELL OF MY ■■■■.

repton:

44 Tonne Ton:
What you lose in the short term you make up in the long term if you do it right Guv’nor. As no doubt you know. :wink:

Too right! Just look at the British car manufacturing industry in the 1970’s and the miners in the 1980’s. Both sterling examples of how going on strike had massive long term advantages.

Oh, hang on, neither of those industries exist in any meaningful way in this country any more. Hmmmmmm…

Paul

But they do in Germany.The difference was/is they didn’t get where they are now by imposing wage restraint and reducing terms and conditions for their workers during the 1970’s and then chucking them out of work in favour of cheap imports as the government did here. :imp: