Seems it`s not just we oldies who hanker for the “good ole days”.
BBC R4 at 08hr05 (sorry can`t do a link) reported a survey saying that many young people of today in the UK wish they had been born in their parents era. Reasons cited include housing and (relevant to us) job prospects and security.
I cant access the Beeb too well here, so cant see exactly which think tank is reporting this survey, or who made it etc, so no idea of how accurate it is.
Greed is at the bottom of all of the recent problems people are facing in the 21st century ,It really is dog eat dog now .Years ago we had it far better than kids have it now ,Imagine leaving school now and trying to compete with the world for a job in the uk ? .Everyone wants to be rich .All companies want maximum profit .I was born in 1969 ,I consider that the very best era to have been be born into ,Good cars ,Good times !We had struggles but we had enough to enjoy life .I see council houses are all going to private firms ,I see people giving up and begging on the streets who i grew up with .Times have changed massively !It is easy to judge and say get a grip ,But yes it is really getting bad now .if you need help you have to jump through hoops for anything.If you want a job you have to have massive experience or be the perfect candidate ,Years ago you went from job to job until you were happy !Now you are forced into being a number and like it or lump it . You are right pal.Things have definately come full circle .Times are hard for kids now .The only thing we can do is try to direct our children better than our folks directed us .
It will never be any better while the few control the masses with greed …
I am glad i was born when i was .
Things started to change during the 1980s…
People seem to delude themselves that they have rights where the reality is they don’t.
I took my driving test in 1977 and it was made clear to me that driving a vehicle is a privilege and not a right.
Cars park wherever they want to, particularly in small villages because the owner thinks it s their right to do so. They then complain when trucks clog up the road because they figure that they have a right to live in a village that is free from other traffic other than there own car.
It’s not difficult to resolve…national service for everyone from their 18 th birthday for 2 years…if they don’t want to then put them on litter picking for 12 hours a day 7 days a week… if they don’t want to do that then 2 years in chokey on bread and water.
Things aren’t terrible, it’s just piles of stupid, naive, internet-obsessed idiots who think the world owes them everything on a plate. They come out of school thinking they’re going to get a 45k a year job and miss out the entry level crap or they think they can make millions playing FIFA on YouTube.
Houses may be dearer, I don’t know, but my mortgage is 2.5 times my salary (roughly) which I believe has been the average for a long time.
There’s also the easy way to make you look good on Facebook, stick everything on the drip. Credit cards for nice clobber, PCP on a new Beemer, you can look the part for Instagram but have eyewatering debts and have made it impossible to save up for a deposit.
All this whinging, moaning, woe is me, it’s the Tories fault bolleaux rustles my jimmies, all these snowflakes wouldn’t have the “problems” they think they have if they went out and got what they wanted instead of demanding someone give them it.
A.
I was born 1949, so even as a small child I missed the majority of rationing etc and wasn’t even aware of it at that age. By the time I was aware of the world we were into the '60’s and what a time that was. No shortage of housing, jobs etc and although never rich was never poverty struck either. The '70’s, getting married starting a family buying a house. Houses were fairly cheap (my first one was £1250) but mortgage interest was high, tax relief on mortgages helped a lot. Then along came the '80’s, when it all started to go pear shaped. houses got dearer. interest rates were massive and jobs started to become a bit scarce I am convinced that I was born at just the right time, even though at this time of life when I have a few bob put away it is impossible to get a decent return on savings. I certainly wouldn’t want to be in the shoes of youngsters today who really must look to the future with a certain amount of despair.
Adonis.:
Things aren’t terrible, it’s just piles of stupid, naive, internet-obsessed idiots who think the world owes them everything on a plate. They come out of school thinking they’re going to get a 45k a year job and miss out the entry level crap or they think they can make millions playing FIFA on YouTube.Houses may be dearer, I don’t know, but my mortgage is 2.5 times my salary (roughly) which I believe has been the average for a long time.
There’s also the easy way to make you look good on Facebook, stick everything on the drip. Credit cards for nice clobber, PCP on a new Beemer, you can look the part for Instagram but have eyewatering debts and have made it impossible to save up for a deposit.
All this whinging, moaning, woe is me, it’s the Tories fault bolleaux rustles my jimmies, all these snowflakes wouldn’t have the “problems” they think they have if they went out and got what they wanted instead of demanding someone give them it.
A.
June 2017 average house price £223k
average weekly wage £506 = about £25k p.a.
So a house costs about 9 times a year`s pay
1990 av house price £60k
pay £14k p.a.
So a house used to cost about 4 and a bit times a year`s pay.
landregistry.data.gov.uk/app/ukhpi
ons.gov.uk/employmentandlab … rkinghours
Average wages and house prices are crude tools, but Id say they reflect what lots of us see. Its NOT just the shiftless youth who can`t get up off their butts, there is a real problem out there.
It all went wrong when Maggie Thatcher came in and bribed council house dwellers to get their votes,reason now no council houses for the kids of the same people who were bribed,do not RIP Maggie Thatcher.
Adonis.:
and miss out the entry level crap
The thing is there is no entry level crap. What you’re referring to is permanent crap - entire crap firms with only crap jobs.
It’s not like an apprenticeship where you’re truly being skilled and moulded by a reputable firm, and you spend at most a couple of your teenage years on poor pay and doing some of the simpler drudge work, but get genuine skills and a rock solid career out of it.
The last time I bumped into someone in this game who’d been through one of these driving apprenticeships, he was expressing his desire to leave the industry! 
bobbya:
It all went wrong when Maggie Thatcher came in and bribed council house dwellers to get their votes,reason now no council houses for the kids of the same people who were bribed,do not RIP Maggie Thatcher.
That is very true, she was also the one who brought down the demise of the unions. She will go down in the history books as one of the most despised prime ministers in this country.
UKtramp:
bobbya:
It all went wrong when Maggie Thatcher came in and bribed council house dwellers to get their votes,reason now no council houses for the kids of the same people who were bribed,do not RIP Maggie Thatcher.That is very true, she was also the one who brought down the demise of the unions. She will go down in the history books as one of the most despised prime ministers in this country.
Yes,I lived through the miners strikes she has wrecked whole towns and villages from my area,hateful Tory woman.
Rjan:
Adonis.:
and miss out the entry level crapThe thing is there is no entry level crap. What you’re referring to is permanent crap - entire crap firms with only crap jobs.
It’s not like an apprenticeship where you’re truly being skilled and moulded by a reputable firm, and you spend at most a couple of your teenage years on poor pay and doing some of the simpler drudge work, but get genuine skills and a rock solid career out of it.
The last time I bumped into someone in this game who’d been through one of these driving apprenticeships, he was expressing his desire to leave the industry!
This post makes sense. Driving is not a career where you will earn decent money from in the most. Some driving jobs pay better than others but still does not give good prospects. Driving is more of a lifestyle choice, it is ridiculous hours in the most, it has little in the way of facilities, you are looked upon as a second class citizen and is very hard work. Who in their right head would choose this as an apprenticeship. Those that do would indeed be wanting out and understandingly so.
Franglais:
Adonis.:
Things aren’t terrible, it’s just piles of stupid, naive, internet-obsessed idiots who think the world owes them everything on a plate. They come out of school thinking they’re going to get a 45k a year job and miss out the entry level crap or they think they can make millions playing FIFA on YouTube.Houses may be dearer, I don’t know, but my mortgage is 2.5 times my salary (roughly) which I believe has been the average for a long time.
There’s also the easy way to make you look good on Facebook, stick everything on the drip. Credit cards for nice clobber, PCP on a new Beemer, you can look the part for Instagram but have eyewatering debts and have made it impossible to save up for a deposit.
All this whinging, moaning, woe is me, it’s the Tories fault bolleaux rustles my jimmies, all these snowflakes wouldn’t have the “problems” they think they have if they went out and got what they wanted instead of demanding someone give them it.
A.
June 2017 average house price £223k
average weekly wage £506 = about £25k p.a.
So a house costs about 9 times a year`s pay1990 av house price £60k
pay £14k p.a.
So a house used to cost about 4 and a bit times a year`s pay.
landregistry.data.gov.uk/app/ukhpi
ons.gov.uk/employmentandlab … rkinghoursAverage wages and house prices are crude tools, but I
d say they reflect what lots of us see. Its NOT just the shiftless youth who can`t get up off their butts, there is a real problem out there.
Like you say, crude tools, house prices are much cheaper here than down South, and are much closer to what I’ve said.
I heard a young couple in the radio a while ago saying how they’d managed to save up for their first place together. North of 250k for a 1 bed flat. 
in that scenario yes, there is a real problem. If that was me I’d move elsewhere and buy a 3 bed semi with a garden for 120k like I can here.
A.
Rjan:
Adonis.:
and miss out the entry level crapThe thing is there is no entry level crap. What you’re referring to is permanent crap - entire crap firms with only crap jobs.
It’s not like an apprenticeship where you’re truly being skilled and moulded by a reputable firm, and you spend at most a couple of your teenage years on poor pay and doing some of the simpler drudge work, but get genuine skills and a rock solid career out of it.
The last time I bumped into someone in this game who’d been through one of these driving apprenticeships, he was expressing his desire to leave the industry!
I wasn’t really referring to driving, more just in general. People leaving school with a couple of A levels or Uni with a degree in Media Studies expecting to walking in to managerial positions (scarily some do) without ever having done a crap job like hospitality or bottom of the rung in their chosen career.
A driving apprenticeship seems to me to be a way for employers to get greener than green teenagers to do the same job as everyone else for a fraction of pay. The normal entry to driving is a couple of weeks training, how that can be stretched out to a year or more is beyond me.
A while ago I worked in a warehouse on a bit more than NMW, I did exactly the same work as a guy who was there as an ‘apprentice warehouse operator’ on about 3 quid an hour. He was a helmet who seemed to think that after his 2 years he would have a little bit of a paper saying he was more qualified than anyone else and would be able to get a job in any warehouse anywhere.
A.
I suppose I could be classed as one of those “Young’uns”. I’m 26, I own my own home with a £70,000 mortgage, I’ve got a really nice car (£50K worth) and a decent job. But, when growing up I had nothing. My mum was always broke, working all hours trying to make ends meet. Now, I support my mum whenever I can be it with money or just time to help her with stuff. Life is what you make it, yes I’ve had it cushty the last few years but before that I had a hard upbringing that taught me the value of money. Young people today have this sort of attuide where they think the world owns them something, the snowflakes who think everyone deserves a “participation award”.
However, I think a lot of problems facing young people today are the fault of the Baby Boomer generation.
I think Adonis must be a neighbour. My house is a 3 bed semi, end of the road so a big garden, stand alone brick garage, kitchen and bathroom around 2,year old, New roof and windows, worth around 160k. Plenty of two bed trad. Terraces for 80k. 15 miles from Chester, Warrington, Liverpool, 30 miles from Manchester, so plenty of job opportunities.
It’s a huge difference up here to the South and that’s part of the problem that everywhere is so London centric.
Jobs maybe tough for school leavers, but when I left school there were 3,million unemployed, so not what I would call easy and plenty of low pay, going nowhere jobs.
Part of what people hanker for, I think, when they look back to the good old days , is stabity, or the perception of stability. We are far more rootless, we move or are supposed to move for work, and its seen as a positive to do so. But by doing that you leave family and community behind that give you a solid foundation. All well and good if you are a high flyer on the trading floor, but if you work in a shop, or you drive a truck, you lose a support system. Your mum isn’t there to pick the kids up from school so one of you has to take a part time job or pay for after school. Your dad isn’t there to help you decorate/ fix the plumbing so you get someone in. When you are I’ll you manage on your own because your new mates you don’t know well enough for them to help you out .
And all the current political uncertainties, NK. And Trump, Brexit, will we have a job or will the robots do it all, leads to even more feelings of instability.
People complain and reminisce how great the good old days were. Well if you look back you would remember, black and white TVs, long hard work, no health and safety. Not many could afford a car, people died at younger ages, poor health care. Terraced accommodation, two families living in one house, poverty, poor schooling, less choices, civil wars and world wars. The list is endless, we have never had it so good. It is now that we have become so accustomed to softer living that we have to complain and moan over the slightest thing that is not up to our expectations. In the “old days” we didn’t complain, we simply got on with it.
As mentioned a lot on here wages and house prices around the country differ. Going by the examples above it’s people like me in the crapper, like radar im one of the so called younger lot on here at 29yrs old.
As an example, my 2 bed flat in Stroud, Gloucestershire cost £130k, the local Downton’s depot pay £9hr, the only reason any of them have a house is because they got it years ago, no young driver at that place will have a house.
I even pay over £70 now a month for a council garage now compared to a mate of mine in Nuneaton who thought paying £15 a month was excessive
Adonis.:
Rjan:
Adonis.:
and miss out the entry level crapThe thing is there is no entry level crap. What you’re referring to is permanent crap - entire crap firms with only crap jobs.
It’s not like an apprenticeship where you’re truly being skilled and moulded by a reputable firm, and you spend at most a couple of your teenage years on poor pay and doing some of the simpler drudge work, but get genuine skills and a rock solid career out of it.
The last time I bumped into someone in this game who’d been through one of these driving apprenticeships, he was expressing his desire to leave the industry!
I wasn’t really referring to driving, more just in general. People leaving school with a couple of A levels or Uni with a degree in Media Studies expecting to walking in to managerial positions (scarily some do) without ever having done a crap job like hospitality or bottom of the rung in their chosen career.
Because to aspire to anything less nowadays is to aspire to poverty and insecure work. Certainly graduates 30 years ago wouldn’t have expected to go into anything less than a managerial position - why on earth would you if you’d already spent all those extra years learning?
Frankly you just sound out of touch when you complain that, yes, workers want a wage they can live on!
A driving apprenticeship seems to me to be a way for employers to get greener than green teenagers to do the same job as everyone else for a fraction of pay. The normal entry to driving is a couple of weeks training, how that can be stretched out to a year or more is beyond me.
Agreed. It’s also partly because the employers think that the shortage of new entrants willing to accept poor conditions is because they’re not catching people young enough.
A while ago I worked in a warehouse on a bit more than NMW, I did exactly the same work as a guy who was there as an ‘apprentice warehouse operator’ on about 3 quid an hour. He was a helmet who seemed to think that after his 2 years he would have a little bit of a paper saying he was more qualified than anyone else and would be able to get a job in any warehouse anywhere.
A.
Indeed, but once upon a time older workers and parents would have educated their children better, and indeed prevented such exploitation.
UKtramp:
People complain and reminisce how great the good old days were. Well if you look back you would remember, black and white TVs, long hard work, no health and safety. Not many could afford a car, people died at younger ages, poor health care. Terraced accommodation, two families living in one house, poverty, poor schooling, less choices, civil wars and world wars. The list is endless, we have never had it so good. It is now that we have become so accustomed to softer living that we have to complain and moan over the slightest thing that is not up to our expectations. In the “old days” we didn’t complain, we simply got on with it.
And look at where that got us. Workers wages kept up with inflation even in the 1970s, nowadays they’re falling in real terms.
Only a fool thinks that mobile phones or colour TVs fully makes up for being unable to afford a place to live, raise your kids, or have a pension in old age.
Rjan:
Indeed, but once upon a time older workers and parents would have educated their children better, and indeed prevented such exploitation.
My point exactly, if your not happy in something, then bloody well do something about it. I put all of my children through good education so they do not have to complain or be exploited. We are not living in a third world country in England. There are ample opportunities to better yourself, get off your backside and change your life, no one will do it for you. We are now a generation of moaning lazy pratts who are willing to do nothing and why we are flooded with citizens from the EE community who have traveled here to take the jobs to better their lives. You should look at them as examples of commitment, they don’t moan, they roll up their sleeves and get on with it.