bobthedog:
So to make sure we are clear, you asked someone over 20 years ago about the driving test here, curry, right?
Yeah, and that is sooooo relevent to today, isn’t it!! And of course, we need to be aware that you, as the font of all knowledge, are completely up to date with all the procedures over here…
Now listen, before you make even more of a ■■■ of yourself… Modern autoshift transmissions, derived from the constant mesh boxes used, also block change… Now get your stupid head working right. We, those of us that have traveled in Europe and North America as working men and women and not paying tourists like you, actually do know more about it than you do.
Get over it. And stop hijacking threads. You spout more crap than a field of buffalo… (those are big cows to you… google it if you need to. I spelled it right for you…)
I am sure you could be a nice man, but in very small doses… maybe 2 or 3 seconds a year.
That video seemed to be ‘up to date’ enough to me Bob and those automated manuals seem to do everything wrong probably because they’ll never be able to do the job as good as a decent driver can.So that driver in the video under instruction should have just told the instructor to zb off and used clutchless changes and just use the brakes from whatever speed it’s doing,in whatever gear it’s in,and then just put it whatever gear is needed to pull away again and if he moans about it just tell him that is the up to date method used by auto boxes and if it’s good enough for a robot then it’s good enough for a real driver.
A bit late and sorry to interrupt the flow of this thread, but I’m amazed to find another subject on which Rob_k and I concur. I would never have guessed he was into economical driving like me.
beefy4605 (see 2nd page of topic), if you read this, and if that 14mpg over a 140 mile trip did not involve an overall 10,000ft descent with the wind behind you, how do you do it? I presume not going very fast and hating having to brake (which is what I do) comes into it, but I find even 13mpg requires the patience of Mother Theresa (typically over a 500 mile run on all sorts of roads in a loaded-up 420bhp 26 tonner mind you).
Also anyone know the typical mpg (or is it gpm?) of those waste disposal HGVs on urban work, which always seem to me to be revving their nuts off at speeds of up to 20mph before braking again?
JLS Driver SOS:
Well I have a V8 Landrover Discovery auto and I get over 40mpg out of her… and then I start her up and take her for a drive and she drops to 12
Here’s a question; The non-sync I drove today is a right pig to get into gear from neutral; I read the manual regarding how far to put clutch down (clutch brake etc) but the ■■■■ thing grinds/resists going in. When moving it’s nigh on perfect, block changing up and down etc…Any ideas? Workshop think it needs adjusting, which they’re reluctant to do as it’s being sold soon…
I’m no expert on cm boxes, (a week away in an ERF was enough!) only thing I can think you might try is engaging a higher gear before engaging the one you want to pull away.
In response to last 2 posts; Yes D1UK, I tried what you said, it still grinded but a lot less (or certainly a lot quieter), and yes Bob it maybe just the clutch as, given it’s age, it’s only used when we’re desperate ie normally I drive an 8w when my 6w is off the road but we’ve had a couple of jobs that have been tight to get into, hence I was asked to fire up the museum piece. When we had several of these (we are 1 driver 1 truck) we noticed any problems and they were dealt with; Now, it seems everybody except me and Dad kick up a stink when asked to drive the truck in question and so problems go unreported/neglected…
commonrail:
i dont give a toss about fuel consumption or brake linings.the more fuel i use the better.my boss dosnt give a toss about his employees so why would i try and save him money,he`s a [zb].i also try and use the most expensive truckstops too ha ha
Presumably you dont give a toss about having a job there or the income you earn from it either?
Because if you and perhaps your colleagues have that attitude there probably won’t be a company to work for before long.
Carryfast:
even with a synchro box matching the revs on downshifts takes the loads off the synchronisers and the driveline and prevents excessive braking forces at the drive axle which you’d get if you just let the clutch in with less revs than what match the road speed.
100% correct, but there is a difference between blipping then catching it at the right spot as the revs come back down & just matching the revs to road speed by gently applying some throttle.
The stacked Scanny drivers did it just “cos it sounds good.” (nobody can deny).
Actrosman:
I even ‘blip’ when in the car (especially when making that slick, quick downshift to accelerate past grandad in the middle lane and the guy behind has flashed me out)
Sorry to say Actrosman, the perfect example of an ill prepared unplanned driver. Whilst looking for an over taking opportunity, with a manual gear box, you should already be in a responsive gear ready to go.
And what would u prefer me to do if it were you that flashed me out…pull out in 5th and, as i have no revs, accelerate away slowly and bring you down from 75ish rather rapid or as soon as i see you flash, drop into 4th and GTF outta the way? I know which driver i would sooner have pull out.
Sorry to say Actrosman, the perfect example of an ill prepared unplanned driver. Whilst looking for an over taking opportunity, with a manual gear box, you should already be in a responsive gear ready to go
And what would u prefer me to do if it were you that flashed me out…pull out in 5th and, as i have no revs, accelerate away slowly and bring you down from 75ish rather rapid or as soon as i see you flash, drop into 4th and GTF outta the way? I know which driver i would sooner have pull out.
A good driver should always be in the right place, at the right time, in the correct gear.
Yes, I did pass in an autoshift, it was a very primitive affair though, just an electronic/air assisted gearstick really and it wouldn’t block change, however block changing IS recommended by the manufacturers, the multispeed transmission is only in existance to ensure a gear for every given road speed, on level ground I use the folowing (clutchless) progression, 1lo, 2hi, 4lo, 5lo, 6lo, 7lo, 7hi, 8lo, 8hi, that’s how I was taught by the manufacturers to use an 16spd box.
Wheel Nut has it right on downshifting and to add to that, there is no need to blip the throttle in a synchromesh box, that can cause premature failure of the synchros, I learned thgis from a manufacturer too and whatever anybody says to the contrary (no prizes for guessing who ) they should know what they’re talking about as they make the things
Come on, guys… I am a widower so the only sport I get is watching curryfart get shot down in flames… I find it amazing that you haven’t torn him a new ■■■■■■■, Rob… having seen you drive forwards into many (myself included) I am slightly concerned that you agree with him…
Atkins at Findern had rev tracers on their fleet and everyone was told to keep under a certain rev limit to conserve fuel and the MPG figures were posted up in the cabin.
One old hat who had an Iveco was constantly getting grief for revving the motor like a two stroke, but always top on the MPG list. About the same time I did a bit of relief driving for a local company, Derby to Glasgow. On the first run I asked about the fuel card etc and was told, it will make it there and back. It run out between Stoke and Uttoxeter. The gaffer took it the following day and run out about 5 miles after I had, the regular driver came back and again did the complete journey on a tank! Now he was a complete and utter speed freak, 85 loaded down shap etc (which, TBH, was the norm in those days) and it was then that we found out the more you thrashed the old turbo-techs, the better they did on MPG.
Best fuel figures I ever had was on an Iveco Eurostar 470 4x2 with AStronic, Ex Man morocco truck. 12.5 -13 mpg running trailers from North wales to Tilbury and going back bob-tail for the next. It pulled like a train and we always found with them that the stronger they pulled, the better they were on fuel.
Yes, I did pass in an autoshift, it was a very primitive affair though, just an electronic/air assisted gearstick really and it wouldn’t block change, however block changing IS recommended by the manufacturers, the multispeed transmission is only in existance to ensure a gear for every given road speed, on level ground I use the folowing (clutchless) progression, 1lo, 2hi, 4lo, 5lo, 6lo, 7lo, 7hi, 8lo, 8hi, that’s how I was taught by the manufacturers to use an 16spd box.
Wheel Nut has it right on downshifting and to add to that, there is no need to blip the throttle in a synchromesh box, that can cause premature failure of the synchros, I learned thgis from a manufacturer too and whatever anybody says to the contrary (no prizes for guessing who ) they should know what they’re talking about as they make the things
My maths was never any any good but it’s good enough to know that block changing relates to downshifts not upshifts and what you seem to be doing there is going up the box using skip shifting not coming down the box using block changing. But having said that it makes it much less confusing if you count all the gears instead of using all that lo/hi bollox.
If wheelnut has it right on downshifting then you must have it wrong on block changing.
But if the manufacturers wanted clutchless changing they would lock the clutch except for when moving away from standstill and double declutching and matching the revs on downshifts with a synchro box actually benefits the synchronisers by helping them out and it stops you transmitting excessive braking forces to the drive wheels and the multi speed transmission is only in existence because it’s a lot better to use that than something like an old British wide ratio bag of bolts and it’s not only a lot better for keeping the engine in it’s correct torque/power band but close ratios also apply a lot less stresses into the drive line than wide ratios.Which is why it’s a lot better to downshift the thing sequentially instead of leaving a massive gap between gear ratios using block changing which often means leaving out all the gears between 12th and 3rd for example.
I think what you put there just relates to having not grown up with driving TM’s with Detroits and Fullers in them and a DAF 2800 with a constant mesh ZF in it.Clutchless changes and block change downshifts on those yeah right.
By the way check out Zetorpilot’s posts on this old topic about double de clutching synchro boxes and the conclusions reached in that debate.It went along the lines of it’s bad driving that wrecks transmissions not double de clutching and matching engine and roadspeeds on downshifts.
Snudger:
Also anyone know the typical mpg (or is it gpm?) of those waste disposal HGVs on urban work, which always seem to me to be revving their nuts off at speeds of up to 20mph before braking again?
4mpg I get out of mine mainly due to having a Pto continuously running all the hydraulics and stopping and starting every few metres
Gonna have to start calling you Rob… 