Carryfast and that Elite transport post

UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUMS THE UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUM (INTERACTIVE)
61

kr79:
All very interesting but it says where possible containers are fees able to put on a train to central hubs as they are not generally time critical. The uk and to a certain extent European road haulage industry has evolved in to such a streamlined operation a train could never compete with a lot of its work.
I think you will find the British international haulage operation collapsed long after Mrs T left number 10.
There still are and always be British and Irish trucks going over the water but on jobs where the customer is willing to pay for a premium service.
It’s a fact despite what orys will tell us the Eastern European haulage industry destroyed the Western European one due to much lower costs. First it was the poles now as there costs are rising its the bg and ro registered trucks doing it.
Look at the amount of German hauliers that followed hitlers lead and invaded the east and reregistered there fleets there.

The fact is rail freight is taking,and/or projects to take,an ever larger market share of both the euro and the domestic freight transport market.The road transport industry is allowing itself to be pushed into your idea of the long haul road transport sector being seen just as some type of ‘premium’ relatively rare service while rail does all the rest.When what matters is competing for as much of the long haul market,for freight transport,as a whole,as possible.Which of course includes deliveries from the sea terminal docks to the customers both in the uk and in europe.

However the fact is the freight transport industry is,for some reason,treated differently to all others in that EU and national government policy is to deter and not allow competition between the different transport modes ( especially between the long haul road transport and rail freight industries ) on a level playing field.

No surprise that the biggest winner under that policy is the big busines rail freight industry which effectively runs under a system of protectionism and tax subsidies in it’s favour.The actual policy in reality,at least in Britain since the Thatcher years,being one of effectively taxing long haul trucks off the road wherever possible and making them run under less than ideal length and gross weight limits.

62

Angus25:
Carry fast what’s your problem with the rail industry they probably do pay fuel duty but did you get turned down for a job or were you abused by savils train driving friend and if we are going on about fuel duty those bloody farmers only using red diesel when moving between farms in your world we probably put the tracktor on a truck so trucker don’t feel left out

Why the zb would anyone with an interest in the road transport industry ( which includes it’s long haul sector ) not have any ‘problem’ with the ‘enemy’ which is the rail freight industry in just the same way that anyone with any interest whatsoever in the rail freight industry views the long haul sector of the road transport industry as the enemy.

Basic economics ( unless it’s a communist state ) says the two different modes should rightly view each other in that way and should be looking to compete and take as much market share from the other as possible in a level playing field trading environment.Which means trucks being allowed to run at optimum gross weights and lengths and with equal fuel costs in the sense of fuel taxes.Simples.

So exactly what and how much ‘fuel duty’ does the rail freight industry pay for it’s fuel compared to road fuel duty and VAT on that road fuel duty :question: :question: .

63

Angus25:
You’ll find you don’t have to damage trucks or get violent but you can block ports in and out you can block wagons from moving

If you did it, thus abridging my freedom to move, you will have police at your neck in 15 minutes.

but foreign trucks will never under cut the trains

So far they do… :slight_smile:

The thing is we can not compete with forine trucks on the fact that they have large fuel tanks using cheap fuel

And who exactly stops you from fitting big tanks and filling them with cheap fuel abroad?

64

Can you tell me how much I pay per liter of fuel be cause I bet you can’t both industry have to work together or shall we close the channel tunnel and just drive trucks though the sea as rail,air and ferries are the enemy and we sould all unite against the scum that we took the work from in the first place

65

Angus25:
Can you tell me how much I pay per liter of fuel be cause I bet you can’t both industry have to work together or shall we close the channel tunnel and just drive trucks though the sea as rail,air and ferries are the enemy and we sould all unite against the scum that we took the work from in the first place

To be honest, I lost you here… But if you ask about diesel prices in Europe, Prices in Poland for example are about the same as prices in France and higher than prices in Spain.

66

Sorry ■■■■ I was asking carry fast

67

Instead of making and scoring a point from every post without actually saying something, let us hear your views, ideas and the way forward.

You have mentioned bs, you have mentioned subsidy, you have mentioned protectionism, yet not once have you been able to show any of these in actual figures. You will of course know that the fuel excise duty on road vehicles is identical to that paid by the train operating companies. A recent study suggests that a diesel engine costs 60p per mile to run, an electrified track brings this figure down to 47p per mile while Switchlogic on a recent journey managed to turn out a respectable 51p per mile.

There are subsidies available but they are available to all, coach operators to build a new terminus, haulage companies to build a rail terminal at Motherwell or Daventry, rail companies to build platforms, tunnels and lay track, incidentally only 500 miles of new railway track has been laid in the last 50 years.

On another thread about delays, it was stated there are too many lorries on the road, as there are too many buses with one two or three passengers on a 40 seater vehicle. The British Transport Commission had a clean sheet when they began. there were too many stuck in the mud managers, politicians and staff who refused to change. The original A B & C licencing could work today as entry into the road haulage market is far too simple.

Initially the ports were run by the railways before becoming ABP, the railway was British Rail, they had their own police force and they ran “well” Hotels, Travel companies and a huge haulage company called British Road Services. The ships or ferries were run by them with Associated Humber Lines, Atlantic Steam Navigation Caledonian, Grand Union Canal and Mortons.

Huge transport companies grew out of the BTC/BRS - National Freight Corporation, Roadline, Red Star, Pickfords, Exel, DHL.

I think it is time we revisited the past and looked at some of this again, let us sort the congestion out, get people out of cars on to buses and trains, get local goods onto the roads to local shops and let the train take the strain with the bulk movements. It will take a lot of work, but may be worth trying. No one has a god given right to have 4 cars in the driveway or on the street outside their homes.

68

Angus25:
Sorry ■■■■ I was asking carry fast

No problem, ■■■■69, sorry I misunderstood you.
(is that a new politeness, changing people’s nicknames to make them sound silly)? :slight_smile:

69

Lot of good points in there that train at 60 ppm is that per container or the whole thing? If the whole thing there’s no way trucks can compete.

70

Wheel Nut:
You have mentioned bs, you have mentioned subsidy, you have mentioned protectionism, yet not once have you been able to show any of these in actual figures. You will of course know that the fuel excise duty on road vehicles is identical to that paid by the train operating companies. A recent study suggests that a diesel engine costs 60p per mile to run, an electrified track brings this figure down to 47p per mile while Switchlogic on a recent journey managed to turn out a respectable 51p per mile.

But for sure a cargo train can carry much more stuff than switchlogic in his truck?

71

Wheel Nut:
Instead of making and scoring a point from every post without actually saying something, let us hear your views, ideas and the way forward.

You have mentioned bs, you have mentioned subsidy, you have mentioned protectionism, yet not once have you been able to show any of these in actual figures. You will of course know that the fuel excise duty on road vehicles is identical to that paid by the train operating companies. A recent study suggests that a diesel engine costs 60p per mile to run, an electrified track brings this figure down to 47p per mile while Switchlogic on a recent journey managed to turn out a respectable 51p per mile.

There are subsidies available but they are available to all, coach operators to build a new terminus, haulage companies to build a rail terminal at Motherwell or Daventry, rail companies to build platforms, tunnels and lay track, incidentally only 500 miles of new railway track has been laid in the last 50 years.

On another thread about delays, it was stated there are too many lorries on the road, as there are too many buses with one two or three passengers on a 40 seater vehicle. The British Transport Commission had a clean sheet when they began. there were too many stuck in the mud managers, politicians and staff who refused to change. The original A B & C licencing could work today as entry into the road haulage market is far too simple.

Initially the ports were run by the railways before becoming ABP, the railway was British Rail, they had their own police force and they ran “well” Hotels, Travel companies and a huge haulage company called British Road Services. The ships or ferries were run by them with Associated Humber Lines, Atlantic Steam Navigation Caledonian, Grand Union Canal and Mortons.

Huge transport companies grew out of the BTC/BRS - National Freight Corporation, Roadline, Red Star, Pickfords, Exel, DHL.

I think it is time we revisited the past and looked at some of this again, let us sort the congestion out, get people out of cars on to buses and trains, get local goods onto the roads to local shops and let the train take the strain with the bulk movements. It will take a lot of work, but may be worth trying. No one has a god given right to have 4 cars in the driveway or on the street outside their homes.

Sounds like a Commie hell whole to me. :unamused:

So you’re saying that freight trains have to run on white diesel not red and those which run on electricity have their electricity costs around doubled by taxation :question: . :confused: :unamused:

72

kr79:
Lot of good points in there that train at 60 ppm is that per container or the whole thing? If the whole thing there’s no way trucks can compete.

Is that door to door from dockside to customer and subject to road levels of fuel taxation rates would be a better question. :unamused:

73

Angus25:
Can you tell me how much I pay per liter of fuel be cause I bet you can’t both industry have to work together or shall we close the channel tunnel and just drive trucks though the sea as rail,air and ferries are the enemy and we sould all unite against the scum that we took the work from in the first place

I don’t give a zb how much you’re paying for fuel my question is how much do train operators pay for fuel.Same question do freight trains run on white diesel or red :question:. Or assuming electric locos are they subject to the same percentage of taxation over the top of cost as road fuel is :question:.

But no ferries aren’t the enemy which is how we got trucks across the Channel before the tunnel ever existed and why do ‘both’ industries ‘have’ to ‘work together’ when they ‘should be’ competing with each other.

74

Carryfast:
I don’t give a zb how much you’re paying for fuel my question is how much do train operators pay for fuel.Same question do freight trains run on white diesel or red :question:. Or assuming electric locos are they subject to the same percentage of taxation over the top of cost as road fuel is :question:.

Some run on Mazut (a heavy oil) :slight_smile:

75

Carryfast:

Angus25:
Can you tell me how much I pay per liter of fuel be cause I bet you can’t both industry have to work together or shall we close the channel tunnel and just drive trucks though the sea as rail,air and ferries are the enemy and we sould all unite against the scum that we took the work from in the first place

I don’t give a zb how much you’re paying for fuel my question is how much do train operators pay for fuel.Same question do freight trains run on white diesel or red :?:. Or assuming electric locos are they subject to the same percentage of taxation over the top of cost as road fuel is :?:.

So you’ve never heard of ferries which is how we got trucks across the Channel before the tunnel ever existed and why do ‘both’ industries ‘have’ to ‘work together’ when they ‘should be’ competing with each other.

Yeah but think of all the boats carrying cargo unaccompanied trailers and containers they could all be done by hauliers if it wasn’t for the big business sailing under a flag of convenience with Filipino crews. Imagine a fleet of lhv trucks stretching from Beijing to Europe pulling containers.

76

kr79:

Carryfast:

Angus25:
Can you tell me how much I pay per liter of fuel be cause I bet you can’t both industry have to work together or shall we close the channel tunnel and just drive trucks though the sea as rail,air and ferries are the enemy and we sould all unite against the scum that we took the work from in the first place

I don’t give a zb how much you’re paying for fuel my question is how much do train operators pay for fuel.Same question do freight trains run on white diesel or red :question:. Or assuming electric locos are they subject to the same percentage of taxation over the top of cost as road fuel is :question:.

So you’ve never heard of ferries which is how we got trucks across the Channel before the tunnel ever existed and why do ‘both’ industries ‘have’ to ‘work together’ when they ‘should be’ competing with each other.

Yeah but think of all the boats carrying cargo unaccompanied trailers and containers they could all be done by hauliers Imagine a fleet of lhv trucks stretching from Beijing to Europe pulling containers.

:open_mouth: :smiling_imp: :laughing:

By all accounts the train from China to Germany only hauls 100 40 foot containers so get hold of 65 ozzy triples road trains running on red diesel ( don’t forget they all run seperate so the customers can have staggered departure times ) sorted.I’ll ask Harry if he’s in I am too so that’s two of the outfits sorted already. :smiley: It would be worth it just to upset wheelnut. :smiling_imp: :wink: :laughing:

77

Carryfast:

kr79:

Carryfast:

Angus25:
Can you tell me how much I pay per liter of fuel be cause I bet you can’t both industry have to work together or shall we close the channel tunnel and just drive trucks though the sea as rail,air and ferries are the enemy and we sould all unite against the scum that we took the work from in the first place

I don’t give a zb how much you’re paying for fuel my question is how much do train operators pay for fuel.Same question do freight trains run on white diesel or red :question:. Or assuming electric locos are they subject to the same percentage of taxation over the top of cost as road fuel is :question:.

So you’ve never heard of ferries which is how we got trucks across the Channel before the tunnel ever existed and why do ‘both’ industries ‘have’ to ‘work together’ when they ‘should be’ competing with each other.

Yeah but think of all the boats carrying cargo unaccompanied trailers and containers they could all be done by hauliers Imagine a fleet of lhv trucks stretching from Beijing to Europe pulling containers.

:open_mouth: :smiling_imp: :laughing:

By all accounts the train from China to Germany only hauls 100 40 foot containers so get hold of 65 ozzy triples road trains running on red diesel ( don’t forget they all run seperate so the customers can have staggered departure times ) sorted.I’ll ask Harry if he’s in I am too so that’s two of the outfits sorted already. :smiley: It would be worth it just to upset wheelnut. :smiling_imp: :wink: :laughing:

That would go well with your vast knowledge of international transport :wink: Good at maths too I see…

78

switchlogic:

Carryfast:

kr79:

Carryfast:

Angus25:
Can you tell me how much I pay per liter of fuel be cause I bet you can’t both industry have to work together or shall we close the channel tunnel and just drive trucks though the sea as rail,air and ferries are the enemy and we sould all unite against the scum that we took the work from in the first place

I don’t give a zb how much you’re paying for fuel my question is how much do train operators pay for fuel.Same question do freight trains run on white diesel or red :question:. Or assuming electric locos are they subject to the same percentage of taxation over the top of cost as road fuel is :question:.

So you’ve never heard of ferries which is how we got trucks across the Channel before the tunnel ever existed and why do ‘both’ industries ‘have’ to ‘work together’ when they ‘should be’ competing with each other.

Yeah but think of all the boats carrying cargo unaccompanied trailers and containers they could all be done by hauliers Imagine a fleet of lhv trucks stretching from Beijing to Europe pulling containers.

:open_mouth: :smiling_imp: :laughing:

By all accounts the train from China to Germany only hauls 100 40 foot containers so get hold of 65 ozzy triples road trains running on red diesel ( don’t forget they all run seperate so the customers can have staggered departure times ) sorted.I’ll ask Harry if he’s in I am too so that’s two of the outfits sorted already. :smiley: It would be worth it just to upset wheelnut. :smiling_imp: :wink: :laughing:

That would go well with your vast knowledge of international transport :wink: Good at maths too I see…

Maybe Harry knows some Chinese to ask the directions and read the road signs. :open_mouth: :smiling_imp: :laughing:
What’s wrong with the maths I make that 195 containers v the train’s 100. :unamused:

79

195 because?

80

switchlogic:
195 because?

It beats 100 unless they need to make it a round figure of 200.Although having said that maybe a just a doubles roadtrain would be more acceptable in euroland as an LHV no point in upsetting them.In which case it still beats 100 boxes. :bulb: