Bearing in mind young and old people were killed - are the implication is that ‘the wagon was crawling along the pavement, doing no real speed, and people were just unlucky enough to be in the way’?
If it had been going faster - there would have been more structure impact damage we’re implied…
Why doya think we have to have medicals every few years?
Come to that - of those drivers that have actually died at the wheel - how many of them careened anywhere except pulling up sharpish?
A stroke or brain aneurysm might drop one in their tracks - but a heart attack presents a warning - long enough to get someone clutching their chest for example.
Think also of other cases where a driver has ploughed into people, killing them. What’s needed for them to NOT be accused of “causing death by dangerous driving”? What gets a driver in the clear?
… No one can be suggesting surely that any of the victims here were in any way culpable in their own deaths? - If the driver “was not to blame” and there is no kind of mechanical fault, then the remaining implications are obvious.
Think how YOU would expect to be treated as a professional driver, should you have just killed some people in an RTC of any kind?
The posts above imply that the Scottish legal system is completely different to ours, and results in a lot more people getting off without even being charged. Surely it isn’t THAT different?
There needs to be an investigation into the circumstances of this tragedy to be sure… If you’re not looking very hard at the driver, then what else ARE you going to “look hard at”?
Even if I’m completely off base on all these ideas - the law looks like an ■■■ right now for not providing as many answers as possible in the near term, whilst witness testimony is freshest.
“An inquest has been opened, and adjourned well into the new year” smacks of “brush it under the carpet”. Even if that’s the “normal, done thing” - it’s still bang out of order!
The best retort for conspiracy theories - is the full disclosure of proven facts at the earliest opportunity.
Winseer:
Bearing in mind young and old people were killed - are the implication is that ‘the wagon was crawling along the pavement, doing no real speed, and people were just unlucky enough to be in the way’?
If it had been going faster - there would have been more structure impact damage we’re implied…
Why doya think we have to have medicals every few years?
Come to that - of those drivers that have actually died at the wheel - how many of them careened anywhere except pulling up sharpish?
A stroke or brain aneurysm might drop one in their tracks - but a heart attack presents a warning - long enough to get someone clutching their chest for example.
Think also of other cases where a driver has ploughed into people, killing them. What’s needed for them to NOT be accused of “causing death by dangerous driving”? What gets a driver in the clear?
… No one can be suggesting surely that any of the victims here were in any way culpable in their own deaths? - If the driver “was not to blame” and there is no kind of mechanical fault, then the remaining implications are obvious.
Think how YOU would expect to be treated as a professional driver, should you have just killed some people in an RTC of any kind?
The posts above imply that the Scottish legal system is completely different to ours, and results in a lot more people getting off without even being charged. Surely it isn’t THAT different?
There needs to be an investigation into the circumstances of this tragedy to be sure… If you’re not looking very hard at the driver, then what else ARE you going to “look hard at”?
Even if I’m completely off base on all these ideas - the law looks like an ■■■ right now for not providing as many answers as possible in the near term, whilst witness testimony is freshest.
“An inquest has been opened, and adjourned well into the new year” smacks of “brush it under the carpet”. Even if that’s the “normal, done thing” - it’s still bang out of order!
The best retort for conspiracy theories - is the full disclosure of proven facts at the earliest opportunity.
A stroke, aneurysm or heart attack is likely to result in a defence of automatism against any criminal charge although a charge is unlikely in the first place if it was a case of automatism. It’s possible automatism will also be used in denying the claims against the Insurers for injuries etc although due to the nature of the case there’s a good chance the Insurers will just settle the claims as an ex gratia.
Winseer:
There needs to be an investigation into the circumstances of this tragedy to be sure… If you’re not looking very hard at the driver, then what else ARE you going to “look hard at”?
But the police ARE investigating the accident and that will obviously be looking closely at the driver and the vehicle and any other factors, but until the PF decides if any charges are to brought there is nothing that can be said on those that are subject to that investigation.
Even if I’m completely off base on all these ideas - the law looks like an ■■■ right now for not providing as many answers as possible in the near term, whilst witness testimony is freshest.
But nobody can provide answers now as it is still being investigated, that is for a trial or FAI in front of a sheriff to determine.
As for witnesses, they will have already given their accounts to the police.
The legal process can’t be ignored or speeded up just because you want to discuss the case on Trucknet.
Winseer:
There needs to be an investigation into the circumstances of this tragedy to be sure… If you’re not looking very hard at the driver, then what else ARE you going to “look hard at”?
But the police ARE investigating the accident and that will obviously be looking closely at the driver and the vehicle and any other factors, but until the PF decides if any charges are to brought there is nothing that can be said on those that are subject to that investigation.
Even if I’m completely off base on all these ideas - the law looks like an ■■■ right now for not providing as many answers as possible in the near term, whilst witness testimony is freshest.
But nobody can provide answers now as it is still being investigated, that is for a trial or FAI in front of a sheriff to determine.
As for witnesses, they will have already given their accounts to the police.
The legal process can’t be ignored or speeded up just because you want to discuss the case on Trucknet.
Hes obviously on his high horse demanding every single detail being released straight away. Legal process means nothing to some people and he is obviously one of them. Just because nothing is released about the investigation because that is the legal process,he is one of those who automatically assumes a conspiracy. The fact it will all be revealed when the process is complete is not good enough
I used to find Winseer a good read but he has really made himself to look like a paranoid ■■■.im not sure if he is at the wind up,i hope not.he comes accross as a bit of a ■■■
Winseer’s far from a ■■■, too many people have short memories.
Our media and leaders have form for being economical with the truth when it doesn’t suit their agenda, the healthy mind doesn’t accept everything they say at face value for good reason, such as cast iron guarantees.
In 2004 a poor young lad was snatched and killed by a gang of youths in Glasgow in a racially motivated attack, because it suited the regimes in charge at the time there was almost nothing reported about this, especially by the state broadcaster the BBC doing its impartiality act , had the attackers/victim been racially the other way round we’d never have heard the end of it…that’s only one example and i’m not going to raise the lads name publicly, his family deserved better at the time let alone having it dragged up again, for those who wish to find out a bit of searching will find the case.
The same people are still in control of the country and the media as we enter 2015, Winseer and others are right to question official versions which often vary according to shifting goalposts, without the internet most of us would never have known about that 2004 heinous crime nor much else that’s been going on and you simply cannot trust the BBC or the MSM, and they, the govt are desperate to put the internet genie back in the bottle, why?
Juddian:
Our media and leaders have form for being economical with the truth when it doesn’t suit their agenda
I fully agree with you on this. Many many cases are documented with cast iron proof. But windseer is screaming conspiracy because the details are not being released quickly enough for his liking.
Juddian:
In 2004 a poor young lad was snatched and killed by a gang of youths in Glasgow in a racially motivated attack, because it suited the regimes in charge at the time there was almost nothing reported about this, especially by the state broadcaster the BBC doing its impartiality act , had the attackers/victim been racially the other way round we’d never have heard the end of it…
I have ALWAYS felt this to be true. The incident you mention was over in the press within a week. We are still hearing about Stephen Lawrence almost 20yrs later. Plus there was a case last year of three minorities attacking and stabbing a white kid for walking through “their” park. It got half a page mention in the media,not on tv news at all. Reverse that to three whites attacking a minority and it will roll on forever. But im not sure what this has to do with Windseer’s ramblings
Juddian:
Winseer and others are right to question official versions which often vary according to shifting goalposts
But hes not querying the official versions. He’s shouting about it all being a conspiracy simply because the details have not been released yet. The fact it is still being investigated and therefor CANT be disclosed is passing him by because it does not fit his agenda. Im well aware the media and government will twist everything they can to their own ends but at the moment there is nothing to disclose and that’s why no new evidence has been released.
1 would have thought that the results so to speak of the lorries mechanical status would have been done by now
Also the medical condition of the driver ascertained
So is the shot caller at the PF on holiday / sick
For the sake of the families they should hurry up.
Charge or Clear the driver
the press could easily find out and name the driver/binnies,the fact they haven’t,then is because they have been told not to,hence theres a specific reason as to why not to,to allow the powers that be to decide how to play it. in 4 years on and off of driving bin trucks,ive yet to see a single binnie wear a seat belt,so they wouldn’t have been wearing one.they will be working out how to hide whatever it is that they don’t want to be public info…they cant even release whether he had a heart attack or whatever,hence were they ■■■■■■■■■ Taliban…whatever it is,then theres a specific reason not to just name them anyway.nobody will blame the driver for having a heart attack unless he was over the limit as well.the bottom line is,theyre hiding something,otherwise the press would have released it already.simple as that
Wow,we do love a conspiracy theory on here don’t we!!!
Firstly,can ANYONE show me where,following an accident a drivers name has been released BEFORE charges were bought against him?
Secondly IF he had a stroke/heart attack/whatever at the wheel it is HIGHLY unlikely any charges will be brought against the driver as his defence team would rightly argue that he had no influence over what happened and and any way of doing anything to avoid it.
One of our drivers had a stroke at the wheel and ploughed into the back of a stationary wagon @ 50mph was that his fault?he lost all feeling and ability to control the right side of his body which meant no way to brake or take evasive action…maybe this is what caused the Glasgow tradegy?!
Go back to your lives people and stop with the conspiracy/■■■■■■■■/made up crap unless you have any facts you’d like to share.
in england the cps and nearly all forensic labs etc etc, shut down for christmas about the 8th of december until at least the second week of january, whilst in some cases these services can be called upon out of these times i doubt the police have the full resources to comb all the cctv and forensic evidence they have gathered with thses services on shutdown, i think they already know what the decision to charge is but cannot make an anouncement before all the ts have been crossed and that will be when the services resume, if the man behind the wheel had a stroke then surely he cannot be prosecuted and surley the facft that he has to live with what has happened for the rest of his days is enough for him to deal with
ckm1981:
Wow,we do love a conspiracy theory on here don’t we!!!
Firstly,can ANYONE show me where,following an accident a drivers name has been released BEFORE charges were bought against him?
Secondly IF he had a stroke/heart attack/whatever at the wheel it is HIGHLY unlikely any charges will be brought against the driver as his defence team would rightly argue that he had no influence over what happened and and any way of doing anything to avoid it.
One of our drivers had a stroke at the wheel and ploughed into the back of a stationary wagon @ 50mph was that his fault?he lost all feeling and ability to control the right side of his body which meant no way to brake or take evasive action…maybe this is what caused the Glasgow tradegy?!
Go back to your lives people and stop with the conspiracy/[zb]/made up crap unless you have any facts you’d like to share.
Ok I’m sorry I’ve bit my tongue as long as possible.
How many of you have actually been down to the scene of this accident and had a look for yourselves?
The final resting place of the lorry done VERY little damage to the wall it impacted with - Only a broken piece of glass, so the truck was obviously slow by this stage.
Whether or not the driver had a heart attack will be discovered, considering there was no damage to the cab as such it’s clear that by remaining in hospital something is wrong with the guy. The only time that charges would be pressed is if he knew about a condition and didn’t disclose it.
This crash has had an effect on this city, just like the Clutha did.
I lost a friend in this accident so watching some of you argue such pointless issues that you know absolutely nothing about just boils my blood.
This topic should have been locked a long time ago.
Stagedriver, firstly let me offer you my condolences for the loss of your friend in this tragedy. I would like to say however that your calls for this thread to be locked are based only on your (understandably) raw emotions. As far as I can see there have been few if any disrespectful posts on this subject and this is after all a discussion forum. If the mods in effect start censoring posts on the off chance that they may offend somebody then we have started down imo a very slippery slope indeed.
I’m not wishing to have a pop at you in any way shape or form but surely you realised before you clicked on this thread that some of the content would possibly to you at least come across as distasteful? Yet still you opened it!
Glasgow is a great and very resilient city so it and its inhabitants WILL recover from this senseless waste, but please don’t use this tragedy as some sort of springboard to muzzle natural comment and speculation.
the maoster:
Stagedriver, firstly let me offer you my condolences for the loss of your friend in this tragedy. I would like to say however that your calls for this thread to be locked are based only on your (understandably) raw emotions. As far as I can see there have been few if any disrespectful posts on this subject and this is after all a discussion forum. If the mods in effect start censoring posts on the off chance that they may offend somebody then we have started down imo a very slippery slope indeed.
I’m not wishing to have a pop at you in any way shape or form but surely you realised before you clicked on this thread that some of the content would possibly to you at least come across as distasteful? Yet still you opened it!
Glasgow is a great and very resilient city so it and its inhabitants WILL recover from this senseless waste, but please don’t use this tragedy as some sort of springboard to muzzle natural comment and speculation.
+1 @stagedriver:
Please also accept my condolences in this sad time.
Discussions of sensitive topics by there very nature will cause upset to those affected and will give rise to wide speculation, ill informed opinions and a plethora of unsubstantiatable posts (and thats just me).
Over time the facts will come out and these can be discussed providing everyone behaves respectfully.
Police have announced their report will be finished by end of this month.
Whilst I think its ridiculous that they take this long to complete an investigation, I think we should wait for the report before starting our own investigation!!
, had the attackers/victim been racially the other way round we’d never have heard the end of it…that’s only one example and i’m not going to raise the lads name publicly, his family deserved better at the time let alone having it dragged up again, for those who wish to find out a bit of searching will find the case.