Juddian:
Opticruise was hopeless in auto, long winded wouldn’t start to describe it, but, switch it into MH, note Not M, because changes in MH were nearly twice as fast as in M, and it was a peach of a box.
I had one new in 2006 in a car transporter, tried it in auto for about a fortnight till it managed to stall out on me turning onto a main road from an uphill side road, yes i spat me dummy out with it and anyone within earshot learned a whole new vocabulary.
From that moment on i drove it in manual, discovering along the way that MH allowed far quicker shifts, discovered also that it was unfailingly responsive to what you the driver wanted, turned out to be my favourite AMT box of all due to still having that clutch pedal so the driver was still in charge of maneuvers and starting off from stationary.
Just shows how much we all like different things.
Don’t get me started on Mercs, whilst i have the greatest respect for older versions apart from that awful EPS box, i liked the despised by many square Axor (when it was fitted with the slapover manual it proved a good workhorse the engien of which remined me of good ■■■■■■■ lumps), having driven the newer model i have yet to find a single good thing to say about them apart from the V6 has a nice engine note so you can sort of convince yourself its a V8, but with a blocked fuel filter.
We had a few brand new Opticruise with clutch pedals and i preffered them to the Dafs , like you say each to their own , we had one driver who complained they were changing from top into 11th all the time so we switched the kick down off , it solved the problem of a hard footed driver who wasn’t using cruise. They were brilliant on fuel running around 1150rpm in top gear with 23 ton gross
Indeed they were good on fuel.
Volvo 420 FMs were averaging 6mpg (they downrated some to 380 to try and improve fuel which only served to make it worse cos they were stuggling afterwards), Scania 420’s easily topping 7.
Yes i know those figures sound appalling but in mitigation the huge amount of fast idling involved running PTO’s, they tared off at 22 tons plus and that the running was seldom easy with multi drops galore many of which were in towns.
rigsby:
Still waiting for you to come here for your training on the Foden 12speed Patrick . Me or Pete could soon get you up to speed and make a proper driver of you , and as a bonus there is also ROF’s sheeting and roping course , although he is a bit pricey .
I would love to have a go at that Dave! But to address more pressing matters first… if I’m not mistaken all the above mentioned training courses include a breakfast? I’m now at The Stockyard near Rotherham having scrambled eggs on toast, which gent is it that pays for it again?
Just book it to ‘The Earl of Macclesfield, courtesy of The Shed on the Allotment’ Patrick, it will find its way there, no problem. Dave and me don’t provide food though, this side of the Cat and Fiddle we struggle enough to feed our sens!
Merc EPS: never driven one (or anything non British in fact) but a lad who ran a few trucks carting blocks out of Ballidon quarry bought one and, after intial missgivings, the driver liked it. Having said that I can’t remember if he bought anymore, he was a ‘Foden man’ really?
Juddian:
Opticruise was hopeless in auto, long winded wouldn’t start to describe it, but, switch it into MH, note Not M, because changes in MH were nearly twice as fast as in M, and it was a peach of a box.
I had one new in 2006 in a car transporter, tried it in auto for about a fortnight till it managed to stall out on me turning onto a main road from an uphill side road, yes i spat me dummy out with it and anyone within earshot learned a whole new vocabulary.
From that moment on i drove it in manual, discovering along the way that MH allowed far quicker shifts, discovered also that it was unfailingly responsive to what you the driver wanted, turned out to be my favourite AMT box of all due to still having that clutch pedal so the driver was still in charge of maneuvers and starting off from stationary.
Just shows how much we all like different things.
Don’t get me started on Mercs, whilst i have the greatest respect for older versions apart from that awful EPS box, i liked the despised by many square Axor (when it was fitted with the slapover manual it proved a good workhorse the engien of which remined me of good ■■■■■■■ lumps), having driven the newer model i have yet to find a single good thing to say about them apart from the V6 has a nice engine note so you can sort of convince yourself its a V8, but with a blocked fuel filter.
We had a few brand new Opticruise with clutch pedals and i preffered them to the Dafs , like you say each to their own , we had one driver who complained they were changing from top into 11th all the time so we switched the kick down off , it solved the problem of a hard footed driver who wasn’t using cruise. They were brilliant on fuel running around 1150rpm in top gear with 23 ton gross
Indeed they were good on fuel.
Volvo 420 FMs were averaging 6mpg (they downrated some to 380 to try and improve fuel which only served to make it worse cos they were stuggling afterwards), Scania 420’s easily topping 7.
Yes i know those figures sound appalling but in mitigation the huge amount of fast idling involved running PTO’s, they tared off at 22 tons plus and that the running was seldom easy with multi drops galore many of which were in towns.
Ours were better than the FMs and CFs , i think around 11.5 mpg but we were running light , and the drivers liked them
coomsey:
As you might recall I was an earthmoving man in the 80s . Most of the motors were Cat n all of them were auto box. I don’t remember any problems with them . The last motor was a 789 dumper running around 300ton n the box never missed a beat in the 3yr I had her. Now I’m not saying she’d have dashed off at a roundabout but she had no silly habits n God only knows there was some daft haul roads n ramps you’d never run into on normal roads. So I can’t understand why they’re issues with them, surely the technology is out there.
Here she is, just for the hell of it, NEVER broke down in 3yr,n she was on 16hr shifts
0
Hiya Coomsey,
Whole different breed of vehicles and set-up mate, most, if not all, have got a torque converter fitted so all of the above described problems wouldn’t appear on dumpers, wheel loaders etc.
That’s one of the reasons the tractor units plated for 250t had torque converters too, although Volvo has proved now that it can be done with a “normal” gearbox fitted with crawler gears.
Cheers, Patrick
Just shows you what I know Patrick ! Now that’s begging the question why aren’t they using something similar ?
coomsey:
As you might recall I was an earthmoving man in the 80s . Most of the motors were Cat n all of them were auto box. I don’t remember any problems with them . The last motor was a 789 dumper running around 300ton n the box never missed a beat in the 3yr I had her. Now I’m not saying she’d have dashed off at a roundabout but she had no silly habits n God only knows there was some daft haul roads n ramps you’d never run into on normal roads. So I can’t understand why they’re issues with them, surely the technology is out there.
Here she is, just for the hell of it, NEVER broke down in 3yr,n she was on 16hr shifts
0
Hiya Coomsey,
Whole different breed of vehicles and set-up mate, most, if not all, have got a torque converter fitted so all of the above described problems wouldn’t appear on dumpers, wheel loaders etc.
That’s one of the reasons the tractor units plated for 250t had torque converters too, although Volvo has proved now that it can be done with a “normal” gearbox fitted with crawler gears.
Cheers, Patrick
Just shows you what I know Patrick ! Now that’s begging the question why aren’t they using something similar ?
No worries mate
I think that costs and fuel saving would be the answer to your question, another reason for the industry to fit most vehicles with auto 'boxes would be, as some others already said, to attract fresh blood that haven’t been brought up around lorries. The results of that wise decision can be seen by the driving standards nowadays…
Sorry I’m a bit behind ( had a couple o bad days with the POst concussion anyway as NMM says it’s the drivers Sorry steering wheel attendants over in this parish that are the problem . A friend works for the main highways contractor in Ontario and they have had to order the new 6 wheeler gritters with Alison auto box as in my friends say the newer and not so new “driver” can’t drive a manual and don’t want to learn
JIMBO47:
Sorry I’m a bit behind ( had a couple o bad days with the POst concussion anyway as NMM says it’s the drivers Sorry steering wheel attendants over in this parish that are the problem . A friend works for the main highways contractor in Ontario and they have had to order the new 6 wheeler gritters with Alison auto box as in my friends say the newer and not so new “driver” can’t drive a manual and don’t want to learn
Probably more to do with council labourers want the overtime opportunities provided by gritting.While the career ‘drivers’ have to sit at home.
JIMBO47:
Sorry I’m a bit behind ( had a couple o bad days with the POst concussion anyway as NMM says it’s the drivers Sorry steering wheel attendants over in this parish that are the problem . A friend works for the main highways contractor in Ontario and they have had to order the new 6 wheeler gritters with Alison auto box as in my friends say the newer and not so new “driver” can’t drive a manual and don’t want to learn
You reminded me of something there , we were coming up to the xmas rush and needed as many box trailers and units as possible. We rented some manual Scanias and the night shift were the first to use them The day after i had a defect note on my desk stating a gearbox fault with one of the Scanias. I went out in it and sure enough the synchro felt like it had gone in first in top range . I took the driver out on his next shift and explained that if he took his time with it there would be no problem he flatly refused. The vehicle was off hired and he took an auto CF
JIMBO47:
Sorry I’m a bit behind ( had a couple o bad days with the POst concussion anyway as NMM says it’s the drivers Sorry steering wheel attendants over in this parish that are the problem . A friend works for the main highways contractor in Ontario and they have had to order the new 6 wheeler gritters with Alison auto box as in my friends say the newer and not so new “driver” can’t drive a manual and don’t want to learn
I’d have thought the Alison box would be well suited for gritters anyway, more likely to be actually plowing substantial snowdrifts in the USA and the Alison will gear up and down seamlessly as and when needed without losing power momentarily as in a normal gearshift, or for momentarily plus another second or two in automated manual boxes as found here
Fuel taxation not in lalaland either as in Britain and the EU.
rigsby:
Still waiting for you to come here for your training on the Foden 12speed Patrick . Me or Pete could soon get you up to speed and make a proper driver of you , and as a bonus there is also ROF’s sheeting and roping course , although he is a bit pricey .
I would love to have a go at that Dave! But to address more pressing matters first… if I’m not mistaken all the above mentioned training courses include a breakfast? I’m now at The Stockyard near Rotherham having scrambled eggs on toast, which gent is it that pays for it again?
Just book it to ‘The Earl of Macclesfield, courtesy of The Shed on the Allotment’ Patrick, it will find its way there, no problem. Dave and me don’t provide food though, this side of the Cat and Fiddle we struggle enough to feed our sens!
Merc EPS: never driven one (or anything non British in fact) but a lad who ran a few trucks carting blocks out of Ballidon quarry bought one and, after intial missgivings, the driver liked it. Having said that I can’t remember if he bought anymore, he was a ‘Foden man’ really?
Pete.
Tried to put it on his tab Pete, but when I mentioned “The Earl of Macclesfield” the lass serving me went all bananas for some reason! “He and his mate from the other side of the Pennines” was all she said and rolled her eyes…
Did Foden or ERF ever offered a auto 'box as an option in their heyday? Maybe just the ones that worked for the council?
pv83:
Tried to put it on his tab Pete, but when I mentioned “The Earl of Macclesfield” the lass serving me went all bananas for some reason! “He and his mate from the other side of the Pennines” was all she said and rolled her eyes…
Did Foden or ERF ever offered a auto 'box as an option in their heyday? Maybe just the ones that worked for the council?
Foden did offer a torque converter inplace of a clutch, I should have a workshop manual with details of it, possibly only on some of the dumper chassis though? I will search later. At the 1968 Earls Court show they had a 32ton Leyland engined tractor unit with a Self Changing Gears 10 speed semi auto gearbox on display though.
Yes Patrick , in the 80s we got an ERF with auto change , it was basically a twin splitter with auto control . What a load of rubbish , couldn’t sort out gear properly and had to be recovered when it went on strike and stuck in neutral . David Davies also had one and they both went back to Sandbach to have gearsticks refitted .
At MFS we had a Seddon Atki with 240 Gardner and 9-speed Fuller,VWA 427S along with two with 180 and DB box.They were nearly always the last wagons to go off park cos drivers didn’t like them,preferring the Scania 81s we ran. I’d not been there long and one day,as I handed paperwork in off a night delivery run I asked if I could be allocated the SA with 240.It was explained to me that nearly all our drivers had never had to tackle a constant mesh box and especially a wagon with arse about face gear change like the 240 had.I had that unit on nights for a long time,and it hardly ever went out on days.Our TSMs used to send the ones with 180s out first.
rigsby:
Yes Patrick , in the 80s we got an ERF with auto change , it was basically a twin splitter with auto control . What a load of rubbish , couldn’t sort out gear properly and had to be recovered when it went on strike and stuck in neutral . David Davies also had one and they both went back to Sandbach to have gearsticks refitted .
Yes, it was called SAMT and many ERFs were re-converted to standard manual Twin-splitter operation.
rigsby:
Yes Patrick , in the 80s we got an ERF with auto change , it was basically a twin splitter with auto control . What a load of rubbish , couldn’t sort out gear properly and had to be recovered when it went on strike and stuck in neutral . David Davies also had one and they both went back to Sandbach to have gearsticks refitted .
Yes, it was called SAMT and many ERFs were re-converted to standard manual Twin-splitter operation.
That’s right silly little stick if I remember we had one on demo but didn’t buy one say no more.Couldn’t beat the twin splitter.
IVECO also used that SAMT set up, my 440E52 EuroStar had it and it was soon ripped out and replaced with a gearstick, behind the electropneumatic nonsense was a regular Twin Splitter, however the shift pattern was upside down, 1st and 3rd back and 2nd and 4th forwards. It wasn’t a problem, not least because the Twin Splitter lived up to it’s advertising behind that big oversquare V8, just slot it into the top hole and the splitter switch took care of anything but the most severe terrain.
rigsby:
Still waiting for you to come here for your training on the Foden 12speed Patrick . Me or Pete could soon get you up to speed and make a proper driver of you , and as a bonus there is also ROF’s sheeting and roping course , although he is a bit pricey .
I would love to have a go at that Dave! But to address more pressing matters first… if I’m not mistaken all the above mentioned training courses include a breakfast? I’m now at The Stockyard near Rotherham having scrambled eggs on toast, which gent is it that pays for it again?
Just book it to ‘The Earl of Macclesfield, courtesy of The Shed on the Allotment’ Patrick, it will find its way there, no problem. Dave and me don’t provide food though, this side of the Cat and Fiddle we struggle enough to feed our sens!
Merc EPS: never driven one (or anything non British in fact) but a lad who ran a few trucks carting blocks out of Ballidon quarry bought one and, after intial missgivings, the driver liked it. Having said that I can’t remember if he bought anymore, he was a ‘Foden man’ really?
Pete.
Tried to put it on his tab Pete, but when I mentioned “The Earl of Macclesfield” the lass serving me went all bananas for some reason! “He and his mate from the other side of the Pennines” was all she said and rolled her eyes…
Did Foden or ERF ever offered a auto 'box as an option in their heyday? Maybe just the ones that worked for the council?
There’s still an E reg 8 wheeler in a shed nr Buxton with an Alison auto box in ex Birmingham city council waste ,A auto box was available in the Foden Alpha 2 range.
We ran 4 X 1844 Mercs with the EPS box at Bewick Transport and they gave faultless service. AND for Danl’s info I did drive them on a number of occasions and they were spot on !
Bewick:
We ran 4 X 1844 Mercs with the EPS box at Bewick Transport and they gave faultless service. AND for Danl’s info I did drive them on a number of occasions and they were spot on !
Very appropriate initials for the gearbox
Round the yard is that
on a number of occasions and they were spot on ! 
