Tachos could be fitted to be used on commercial work, 15 Hour rule on EU. 11 On domestic
My tacho comment was to provoke debate but does make some sense, Has as been said . the drivers need to grow some balls and tell them to shove it
In general we were treated better in the sixties where jobs were a penny a dozen. If you started a job on Monday morning and didn’t like it, off you went to start a new one Tuesday… if you wasn’t up the other end of the country by this time. Now you’ve got so many cheap labour types in the over crowded country, the bosses love it and so do the Government. It’s like a bloody whirlpool where you all get sucked down to the bottom.
You can’t be more right about the people who do this job. I’m romanian and I can see lots of guys from my country doing this job and actually believing they are being paid well.
Heard about stories with 240-260 parcels a day.
If you want details about the payment is sth like 120 pounds a day + 0.15 per mile as fuel alowance…all as self employed. But - around 180 a week as rent for van + hire and reward insurance.
Some still do the job because their english level is “I understand but can’t speak” - as every guy that knows no English at all will say exactly those words.
Have seen lots of adds with ‘‘no english required’’ on these jobs.
Personally I had a choise between this , Uber and a class 1 licence. Hope I did the right thing getting one…and from the Dvla and not the Romanian Police.
Hope I gave you an inside view why some people do this job.
When I see questions like ''Where can I find a job without knowing English ‘’ , I usually reply that ‘‘You have the same chances of employment as a Somali guy in Bucharest’’.
About the tachos on vans I would say use something like in the US when in commercial use : Log books.
There’s nothing new to this at all. Back in the late nineties early noughties I worked as a self employed van driver for Menzies delivering newspapers to newsagents. They dictated the run, route and how much I was to bill them ( which was the same every week unless I double ran). I was responsible for van, fuel, insurance, etc and my own tax. I worked seven days a week for 52 weeks (except Christmas day) and got no sick or holiday pay.
There were rumblings back then about us being Menzies employees rather than self employed, and an effort was made by a few of us to be recognised as such with all the associated perks of being employed.
Unfortunately,(fortunately!) I chucked it before any decision was made and I never followed it up. I assumed it was unsuccessful and drivers remained self employed.
So, here we are, nearly 20 years later and, although the name of the company involved has changed, nothing else has.
Having just put up with the stress of the US elections I think we need a photo of the little nurse…
Just as a professional reminder of my paramedic days of course!
W.
I saw the BBC West tv documentary about Amazon agency drivers .
They have no time to stop and find a loo, so use bottles and do a number two in the back of the van .
Hired vans were shown by a vehicle examiner to be in a dangerous condition on the road, one had the steering about to fall apart .
Regularly drivers admited on camera that they fell asleep at the wheel.
11 hours duty was 15 hours, the 10 hour driving limit was exceeded .
Christmas was 300 parcels .
More drops than Santa .
tommymanc:
SteveWalsh:
Make Tachograph compulsory in all commercial vehiclesHow would you know what a white van was used for?
I own a van which I used when the misses uses the car… Should I have to put my card in, to pop to the local shops in my personal van?
And how would it work for hire vans, they are commercial right, out for personal used. Next you’ll be saying they need a [zb] O licence too for them all
Worked more than 11 hours a day - delivery drivers are breaking the law if they exceed this limit
WHAT? did they drop the 15 hour a day rule?
Van driver and operators are on the radar of the authorities, and they are looking at Tachographs, O’licences and speed limiters, and I think something will happen with Internet shopping and the subsequent rise in van deliveries.
Of course there are a load of issues with private use and tracking multiple drivers, but it doesn’t mean it won’t happen, probably be just a pain in the neck for most people who use a van, but it will happen because we want goods as delivered as cheaply as possible and global corporations are willing to exploit loopholes in employment regulations by using 3rd party companies so they can blame them when it goes wrong and the ■■■■ hits the fan.
Your last point, Van drivers come under domestic drivers hours regulations which allows 11 hours work, but breaks don’t count towards that, so your working day can be extended far beyond.
When I was self employed I had an interview with a [nice] lady from MMRC, who then told me, and the firm I was contracted to, that I was actually an employee.
The grounds were basically that a, I only worked for one employer, b, that they dictated where and when I went, and c, that if I was unavailable, it wasn’t my responsibility to provide a replacement. It looks to me as if all those apply to the Amazon drivers in the film, so I guess HMRC might be paying the agency a visit before long.
SteveWalsh:
Make Tachograph compulsory in all commercial vehicles
I get 3 or 4 deliveries from myherpes weekly…normally its from a bulldog faced wifey in a people carrier with or without her brats strapped in the back along with the boxes depending on the time of day…work out how commercial she is…
WHY are people doing these jobs where they end up with such a low pro-rata hourly rate and are often compromising safety and/or breaking the law 
One guy interviewed on the tellybox, said there is no time to chat to customers and be nice to them, drivers are told , if there is a complaint about delivery, they are to phone the customer services phone number .
I guess the pressure is on , and time is wasted by no customers being in to receive their goods, and traffic delays, all that rushing around, can not be good for the health of the driver and other road users are put in risk .
I would imagine that there is a quick turn around in drivers and they burn out quickly .
ROG:
WHY are people doing these jobs where they end up with such a low pro-rata hourly rate and are often compromising safety and/or breaking the law
ROG:
Dlaczego ludzie robią te prace, gdzie kończy się z tak niską proporcjonalnej stawki godzinowej i często zagraża bezpieczeństwu i / lub łamanie prawa
That should help! 
Drops and hours are not the big story here IMO.
How does third party only insurance with a £5k excess sound 
And they’re charging you £125 for the pleasure. You must be a massive idiot to work to these conditions.
Terry T:
Drops and hours are not the big story here IMO.How does third party only insurance with a £5k excess sound
And they’re charging you £125 for the pleasure. You must be a massive idiot to work to these conditions.
Three full routes. Is that one day, or three days?
And why is the Amazon milage both paid and deducted??
I think it’s for three days but the vehicle and add-ons is charged weekly - it’s only a guess.
the nodding donkey:
And why is the Amazon milage both paid and deducted??
My guess is if you did the route in your own van you’d keep the mileage payment but because he rented the van Amazon get it.
This whole setup is a disgrace and the whole self employed scenario should be abolished ASAP. Be your own boss, pfffft, what a ■■■■■■■ joke. It’s a scam to deny workers decent pay and conditions. Surprised it’s gone on this long to be honest. UBER have been done for it, case pending of course. But they really seem to be going after this sort of thing now and long may it continue.
I just hope they don’t take too long to get round to HGV drivers. Most driver’s have proved themselves too stupid to avoid the £1 more for LTD scam and this inevitably keeps the rates down for everyone so I say to HMRC, do your worst.
It’ll never happen to hgv drivers. We’ve already seen the self employed limpers scam unravel. And seeing as it’s illegal to rent an o licence, there’s no way this could ever get off the ground.
Terry T:
the nodding donkey:
And why is the Amazon milage both paid and deducted??My guess is if you did the route in your own van you’d keep the mileage payment but because he rented the van Amazon get it.
This whole setup is a disgrace and the whole self employed scenario should be abolished ASAP. Be your own boss, pfffft, what a [zb] joke. It’s a scam to deny workers decent pay and conditions. Surprised it’s gone on this long to be honest. UBER have been done for it, case pending of course. But they really seem to be going after this sort of thing now and long may it continue.
I just hope they don’t take too long to get round to HGV drivers. Most driver’s have proved themselves too stupid to avoid the £1 more for LTD scam and this inevitably keeps the rates down for everyone so I say to HMRC, do your worst.
Where do you stop though. If I can’t get a backload and so it works out less than minimum wage is the customer, or the taxpayer, going to make up my earnings?
going a bit over the top now,in the paper yesterday it was reported that amazon drivers are pooing in bags and urinating in bottles because they don’t have time to go to the toilets,absolute load of bxxxxxxt,if that was true [and I can’t believe it is for one minute]are they really that scared of amazon and losing their jobs,if it was me and it reached that stage I would park the van up and tell them to shove the job
truckman020:
going a bit over the top now,in the paper yesterday it was reported that amazon drivers are pooing in bags and urinating in bottles because they don’t have time to go to the toilets,absolute load of bxxxxxxt,if that was true [and I can’t believe it is for one minute]are they really that scared of amazon and losing their jobs,if it was me and it reached that stage I would park the van up and tell them to shove the job
That’s what other drivers told the lad working undercover in the program, whether you choose to believe it or not.