milodon:
what I’m interested in is, if for example I start driving at 10pm sunday after completing a weekly rest, then drive for 4.5h, take 9h off and then have a full 9h of driving (with a break of course), am I breaking something somewhere?
LEGAL because you have started a NEW 24 hour period at the end of the 9h reduced daily rest - the daily shift clock has been ‘RESET’ is one way to look at it.
ROG:
Are you saying that this (7 shifts and 42 hours of driving) is illegalFull Weekend rest
Mon 0600 - 1400 Driving hours = 6 (9 hours off)
Mon 2300 - 0700 Driving hours = 6 (11 hours off)
Tue 1800 - Wed 0200 Driving hours = 6 (9 hours off)
Wed 1100 - Wed 1900 Driving hours = 6 (11 hours off)
Thu 0600 - Thu 1400 Driving hours = 6 (9 hours off)
Thu 2300 - Fri 0700 Driving hours = 6 (11 hours off)
Fri 1800 - Sat 0200 Driving hours = 6
Full Weekend rest
Mon 0600
Scotchbaz:
Totally, in point of fact between your first and second shift you’ve managed to drive 11 hours in one 24 hour period, put your hand out for the cane and take six of the best
Which rule says that cannot be done 
Article 4 (k)
‘daily driving time’ means the total accumulated driving time between the end of one daily rest period and the beginning of the following daily rest period or between a daily rest period and a weekly rest period.
Article 4 (q)
‘driving period’ means the accumulated driving time from when a drive commences driving following a rest period or a break until he takes a rest period or break.
the driving period may be continous or broken.
SENARIO -
Full Weekend rest
Mon 0600 - 1400 Driving hours = 6 (9 hours off)
Mon 2300 - 0700 Driving hours = 6 (11 hours off)
Tue 1800 - Wed 0200 Driving hours = 6 (9 hours off)
Wed 1100 - Wed 1900 Driving hours = 6 (11 hours off)
Thu 0600 - Thu 1400 Driving hours = 6 (9 hours off)
Thu 2300 - Fri 0700 Driving hours = 6 (11 hours off)
Fri 1800 - Sat 0200 Driving hours = 6
Full Weekend rest
Mon 0600
muckles:
As far as I understand it’s 6 consecutive 24 hour periods, not 6 shifts. So if you start at 06:00hrs on Monday you must start your weekend break before 06:00 the following Sunday.
I am really going to stick my neck out here with some logical thinking instead of waiting for a GURU to come along 
The drivers week is from Sunday Midnight to Sunday Midnight so as long as all the driving and rest hours are conformed to within that period, then I cannot see how any rules can be broken.
Now awaits GURU…
rog i think you should go look over the times again because, now im no maths expert but from 2300 - 0700 is 8 hours to me, you seemt o think its 6 hours? lol
Mon 2300 - 0700 Driving hours = 6 (11 hours off)
lol
gogzy:
rog i think you should go look over the times again because, now im no maths expert but from 2300 - 0700 is 8 hours to me, you seemt o think its 6 hours? lolMon 2300 - 0700 Driving hours = 6 (11 hours off)
lol
ERR… that’s 6 hours of driving done in an 8 hour shift…
Regulation No 561/2006 of the European Parliament
Article 4
“a week” means the period of time between 00.00 on Monday and 24.00 on Sunday.Article 7
Within each period of 24 hours after the end of the previous daily rest period or weekly rest period a driver shall have taken a new daily rest period.
If the portion of the daily rest period which falls within that 24 hour period is at least nine hours but less than 11 hours, then the daily rest period in question shall be regarded as a reduced daily rest period.A weekly rest period shall start no later than at the end of six 24-hour periods from the end of the previous weekly rest period.
I might well be wrong ROG, but due to differing interpretations of the regs over the EU, I have always found it safer to give the authorities in other counties no ammunition at all. As a driver to foreign climes, I have no wish to give the numerous bent enforcement authorities in various countries the chance to give me the midnight express treatment or take any of my hard earned cash. If that means taking the law to the ‘nth degree, then so be it. The rules can be seen to be fairly ambiguous in many areas, but to have them defined even more by EU bureaucracy would inevitably lead to even more muddle. Belt and braces, I say.
Your quote of the regs does not refer to the ‘number of days/shifts’ between the weekly rest periods to which this topic is trying to resolve.
I still say that a driver can do as many ‘days’ as they like PROVIDING that all driving and rest periods are adhered to within the EU driver week (Sunday Midnight to Sunday Midnight)
It comes down to the DEFINITION of what a ‘driving day’ is with regard to the regs.
Article 4 (k)
‘daily driving time’ means the total accumulated driving time between the end of one daily rest period and the beginning of the following daily rest period or between a daily rest period and a weekly rest period.
ROG:
It comes down to the DEFINITION of what a ‘driving day’ is with regard to the regs.
Quite ROG, definition, but are you going to argue your own case in a Greek court of law? You’re braver than me, driving all over Europe to your own tight definitions of the regs. Like I said, and especially in Europe, belt and braces.
In fact, nuts to the Greeks, you wouldn’t need to go that far, because I’d love to see what the German Authorities would make of your definition.
Scotchbaz:
Quite ROG, definition, but are you going to argue your own case in a Greek court of law? You’re braver than me, driving all over Europe to your own tight definitions of the regs. Like I said, and especially in Europe, belt and braces.
you might just want to stay home for good in case they scare you that much. I’ve always tried to get the most out of the regulations, and in case of a heavy dispute my legal costs are insured
Just to make things a little more interesting -
8 shifts of 6 hours done in one week (Sunday Midnight to Sunday Midnight) with a total of 32 hours of driving time.
OVER 45 hours weekly rest
Mon 0200 - Mon 0800 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 9 hours daily rest
Mon 1700 - Mon 2300 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
Tue 1000 - Tue 1600 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 9 hours daily rest
Wed 0100 - Wed 0700 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
Wed 1800 - Thu 0000 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 9 hours daily rest
Thu 0900 - Thu 1500 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
Fri 0200 - Fri 0800 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
Fri 1900 - Sat 0100 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
OVER 45 hours weekly rest
Repeat previous week…
I cannot comment on what other countries do but all EU countries are supposed to be following the same regulations as the UK
milodon:
you might just want to stay home for good in case they scare you that much. I’ve always tried to get the most out of the regulations, and in case of a heavy dispute my legal costs are insured
You do realise that this is a public forum and that anyone including law enforcement agencies can and probably do view this. By “getting the most” out of the regulations, what exactly do you mean? In case of legal dispute (does that mean potentially breaking the law?) you’re insured? Why, if you’re so sure of yourself?
ROG:
Just to make things a little more interesting -8 shifts of 6 hours done in one week (Sunday Midnight to Sunday Midnight) with a total of 32 hours of driving time.
OVER 45 hours weekly rest
Mon 0200 - Mon 0800 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 9 hours daily rest
Mon 1700 - Mon 2300 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
Tue 1000 - Tue 1600 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 9 hours daily rest
Wed 0100 - Wed 0700 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
Wed 1800 - Thu 0000 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 9 hours daily rest
Thu 0900 - Thu 1500 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
Fri 0200 - Fri 0800 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
Fri 1900 - Sat 0100 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
OVER 45 hours weekly rest
Repeat previous week…I cannot comment on what other countries do but all EU countries are supposed to be following the same regulations as the UK
Have you done this?
As far as I can see this thread has been confused by quoting the wrong regulations and also by high-jacking the thread with irrelevant questions, as MADBAZ has already pointed out 6 driving periods does appear to be the rule for the AETR rules which are being quoted in this thread but not for the EU rules, and as both the UK and Belgium work to the EU REGULATION (EC) No 561/2006 the AETR rules don’t come into the question unless the driver will be going to countries which work to AETR rules.
The EU regulations clearly state that you must start a new weekly rest period no later than the end of six 24 hour periods from the last weekly rest period.
As long as you have the correct daily rest periods and don’t go over the 6 x 24 hour periods (144 hours) from your last weekly rest and as long as you abide by the other rules regarding driving hours/breaks ec’t there’s nothing to stop you doing more than 6 shifts between weekly rest periods.
Article 8 (6) - REGULATION (EC) No 561/2006:
A weekly rest period shall start no later than at the end of six
24-hour periods from the end of the previous weekly rest
period.
Page 18 - Drivers hours and tachograph rules:
Weekly rest periodsA driver must start a weekly rest period no later than at the end of six consecutive 24-hour periods from
the end of the last weekly rest period.
So the answer for countries working to EU regulation (EC) No 561/2006 is that there’s no reason why you should not have 7 cards between weekly rest periods.
Scotchbaz:
You do realise that this is a public forum and that anyone including law enforcement agencies can and probably do view this. By “getting the most” out of the regulations, what exactly do you mean? In case of legal dispute (does that mean potentially breaking the law?) you’re insured? Why, if you’re so sure of yourself?
By getting the most out of regulations I mean driving up to the legal maximum, not legal maximum minus x amount of time, because some numpty on a power trip likes to interpret the rules to suit his agenda, in some place I might never have the pleasure of visiting. A legal dispute means exactly that, a dispute, i don’t see any other way of describing it, nor a need to. Yes, I am sure of myself, up to a point, but I am aware of the gazillion different people in uniforms, many of whom have a vague idea about the regulations, hence the insurance, what you are suggesting is akin to pointing a finger at a person who has insured his house against a fire, and screaming arsonist.
milodon:
what you are suggesting is akin to pointing a finger at a person who has insured his house against a fire, and screaming arsonist.
PMSL 
Thanks “tachograph” for clearing that up.
ROG:
Just to make things a little more interesting -8 shifts of 6 hours done in one week (Sunday Midnight to Sunday Midnight) with a total of 32 hours of driving time.
OVER 45 hours weekly rest
Mon 0200 - Mon 0800 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 9 hours daily rest
Mon 1700 - Mon 2300 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
Tue 1000 - Tue 1600 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 9 hours daily rest
Wed 0100 - Wed 0700 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
Wed 1800 - Thu 0000 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 9 hours daily rest
Thu 0900 - Thu 1500 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
Fri 0200 - Fri 0800 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
Fri 1900 - Sat 0100 (driving time during shift = 4 hours) then 11 hours daily rest
OVER 45 hours weekly rest
Repeat previous week…I cannot comment on what other countries do but all EU countries are supposed to be following the same regulations as the UK
Scotchbaz:
Have you done this?
No, I was just using this as an EXAMPLE of the legal use of 8 tacho cards/shifts in the drivers working week with a full weekly rest at each end.
ADD - it would really screw up a persons sleep pattern if the above was done
tachograph:
As far as I can see this thread has been confused by quoting the wrong regulations and also by high-jacking the thread with irrelevant questions, as MADBAZ has already pointed out 6 driving periods does appear to be the rule for the AETR rules which are being quoted in this thread but not for the EU rules, and as both the UK and Belgium work to the EU REGULATION (EC) No 561/2006 the AETR rules don’t come into the question unless the driver will be going to countries which work to AETR rules.The EU regulations clearly state that you must start a new weekly rest period no later than the end of six 24 hour periods from the last weekly rest period.
As long as you have the correct daily rest periods and don’t go over the 6 x 24 hour periods (144 hours) from your last weekly rest and as long as you abide by the other rules regarding driving hours/breaks ec’t there’s nothing to stop you doing more than 6 shifts between weekly rest periods.
Article 8 (6) - REGULATION (EC) No 561/2006:
A weekly rest period shall start no later than at the end of six
24-hour periods from the end of the previous weekly rest
period.
Page 18 - Drivers hours and tachograph rules:
Weekly rest periodsA driver must start a weekly rest period no later than at the end of six consecutive 24-hour periods from
the end of the last weekly rest period.So the answer for countries working to EU regulation (EC) No 561/2006 is that there’s no reason why you should not have 7 cards between weekly rest periods.
I think you are misinterpreting the regs too.
To use ROG’s example of the Monday, although it lookshe has managed to squeeze two daily shifts/driving periods into 24 hours (the Monday). The fact he has had a daily rest period starts off another 24 hour period. Note the word ‘period’.His daily rest for the second 24 hour period in going to finish on Tuesday at 10.am…So infact, still using the Monday as the example two 24 hour periods have been used in actual real time of…hang on let me count
Monday 02.00 until Tuesday 10.00, 32 hours is it? I’m probably explaining it badly, but i’m certain that each 24 hour ‘period’ is inbetween daily rest periods, whether you fully use up the 24 hours or not. You can’t bank them.Six shifts is all you are allowed. You’ll know when you’re on you’re sixth shift (or 24 hour period if you prefer) as you will of had five daily rest periods.
milodon:
what I’m interested in is, if for example I start driving at 10pm sunday after completing a weekly rest, then drive for 4.5h, take 9h off and then have a full 9h of driving (with a break of course), am I breaking something somewhere?
You’re not breaking anything.
tachograph:
The EU regulations clearly state that you must start a new weekly rest period no later than the end of six 24 hour periods from the last weekly rest period.As long as you have the correct daily rest periods and don’t go over the 6 x 24 hour periods (144 hours) from your last weekly rest and as long as you abide by the other rules regarding driving hours/breaks ec’t there’s nothing to stop you doing more than 6 shifts between weekly rest periods.
Page 18 - Drivers hours and tachograph rules:
Weekly rest periodsA driver must start a weekly rest period no later than at the end of six consecutive 24-hour periods from the end of the last weekly rest period.
So the answer for countries working to EU regulation (EC) No 561/2006 is that there’s no reason why you should not have 7 cards between weekly rest periods.
Mike-C:
I think you are misinterpreting the regs too.
To use ROG’s example of the Monday, although it lookshe has managed to squeeze two daily shifts/driving periods into 24 hours (the Monday). The fact he has had a daily rest period starts off another 24 hour period. Note the word ‘period’.His daily rest for the second 24 hour period in going to finish on Tuesday at 10.am…So infact, still using the Monday as the example two 24 hour periods have been used in actual real time of…hang on let me count
Monday 02.00 until Tuesday 10.00, 32 hours is it? I’m probably explaining it badly, but i’m certain that each 24 hour ‘period’ is inbetween daily rest periods, whether you fully use up the 24 hours or not. You can’t bank them.Six shifts is all you are allowed. You’ll know when you’re on you’re sixth shift (or 24 hour period if you prefer) as you will of had five daily rest periods.
I think you have got ‘Period’ and ‘shift’ meaning the same which they are not.
The regs say - A driver must start a weekly rest period no later than at the end of six consecutive 24-hour periods from the end of the last weekly rest period - it says nothing about a limit on the number of shifts done within that period.
IF, and I say IF, the regs had said - A driver must start a weekly rest period no later than at the end of six consecutive shifts from the end of the last weekly rest period - then that would be a different matter.
ROG:
[I think you have got ‘Period’ and ‘shift’ meaning the same which they are not.
They are !! To illustrate my point…how many hours in a day can you drive ? And what is a day?
