My son sells DAF Trucks (I much prefer wagons but I must change with the times. DAF are as near as you can get today as a Commercial Vehicle Manufacturer with the old Leyland Plant still manufacturing,
Three things made me ask this question.
1st a Post on the Bedford thread saying that you forget how many Bedfords were sold in Europe. I remembered when they proudly stated they were Europes biggest Truck manufacturer & all their production was made in UK
2nd was my son asked me why they stopped production and that’s a thing so many of us have opinions. When I told him mine he said GM cut their noses off to spite their face.
3rd and final was I was looking at photos taken by the roadside of wagons passing and there are so many different sizes & types still with the exception of some of the DAFS all made overseas.
So I as the question,Had GM kept production of Bedfords going, where would they be today. Still High Volume? Or fallen from grace & disappeared anyway?
You might firstly need to re assess the idea which seems to be that GM closed down Bedford’s operations in isolation ?.
When the fact is GM decided to walk away from heavy truck manufacturing worldwide including domestically in the US.Which seems to have possibly been the result of a business ‘arrangement’ with Volvo.Which took out products like the Astro just the same as the TM and also removed the Detroit engine division from the frame just as the 60 series was well into production.
As for Bedford it had for too long been a totally dependent and integrated division of GM which was never going to survive outside of the GM Group on its own as an independent firm.Logically Bedford’s only progression would have been all about the TM.Which Volvo would have obviously seen as being a similar threat to its operations in Europe as GM’s operations were in the US etc.On that note Bedford’s fate was arguably sealed by the end of the 1970’s with no realistic future from the early 1980’s on. 
The Leatherhead “Key Board Warrior” strikes again, another thread down the Crapper 
Not at all, well not yet anyway, it will when he rewords and repeats that post a hundred times, but at the moment it’s a good post.
Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
newmercman:
Not at all, well not yet anyway, it will when he rewords and repeats that post a hundred times, but at the moment it’s a good post.Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
Well we will just have to wait & see, Once the Detroit fires up we are really ■■■■■■ IMO, Regards Larry.
Don’t let him fire up a V8 for goodness sake!
Retired Old ■■■■:
Don’t let him fire up a V8 for goodness sake!
Now you’ve done it, he’ll be off on one about the 71 series bus engines in the TM now.
Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
Returning to the title of the thread, the same question could be asked of several of the famous marques of the past. If you analyse the current truck market and manufacturers supplying it then of the Western companies possibly only Mercedes offers the wide range of commercial vehicles of all sizes that Bedford did, from the smallest van to the max. weight artic. I don’t believe that Bedford would ever have ‘cracked’ the heavy truck market, they were too late with their TM (like Ford with the Transcontinental) and buyers’ perceptions of who made what and for which market sector counted then for a lot of what they bought. (It still does to this day). It would have needed one superb truck for Bedford to compete successfully in the max. weight artic sector. I think that if their core products had been developed then Bedford could still have had a presence in the markets that it had dominated for decades, but by the end Bedford models were very dated.
If Bedford had marketed a single version of the TM from the outset, using the ■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■ driveline it would have met with bigger and wider success IMHO. Robert
gingerfold:
Returning to the title of the thread, the same question could be asked of several of the famous marques of the past. If you analyse the current truck market and manufacturers supplying it then of the Western companies possibly only Mercedes offers the wide range of commercial vehicles of all sizes that Bedford did, from the smallest van to the max. weight artic. I don’t believe that Bedford would ever have ‘cracked’ the heavy truck market, they were too late with their TM (like Ford with the Transcontinental) and buyers’ perceptions of who made what and for which market sector counted then for a lot of what they bought. (It still does to this day). It would have needed one superb truck for Bedford to compete successfully in the max. weight artic sector. I think that if their core products had been developed then Bedford could still have had a presence in the markets that it had dominated for decades, but by the end Bedford models were very dated.
I tend to agree, but from my memory I saw a prototype replacement of the TK/TL range that really looked a winner, because after all the last TLs they produced would have been excellent vehicles for their price and weight range, had they had modern up to date cabs.
Also the TM was such a small portion when you take the market they had for 7.5 to 16 ton gvw rigids, Also we mustn’t forget the PSV market. Bedfords were the most poplular by far for coach operators and were starting to establish a following with Bus companies on bus bus routes. Had Bedford taken over Leyland which was what GM had origionally wanted I think they probably would have developed with Leyland a succesful heavier range. However the cost would have been at Landrover’s expence (They only wanted Leyland if they got Landrover) I don’t think GM ever would have develloped Range Rover & Land Rover to be the premum vehicle it is today.
Bathgate got what it deserved anyway as the majority of vehicles were sub standard ad the strikes were rife. I would have imagined they would have had to end production & rid us of the Leyland Redine range as it certainly duplicaed Bedford’s core rangge.
Bathgate got what it deserved anyway as the majority of vehicles were sub standard ad the strikes were rife. I would have imagined they would have had to end production & rid us of the Leyland Redine range as it certainly duplicaed Bedford’s core rangge.
[/quote]
+1.as did the rest of the british auto industry thanks to the workforce/union oriated workshy way of operating…if by some chance they were still clinging on today,then it would only be for how long till they go down the pan…built in Britain by brits= recipie for shoddy quality and disaster.there may be a exception to that rule somewhere,but few and far between,hence the uk is finished and should just lie back and take the kicking its taking every day from foreigners flooding in.
Another aspect I forgot to mention is the loss of the Military contract by Bedford. Am I alone in feeling physically sick when I see German vehicles driven by British soldiers. I hope we never have another world war in particular another European war. But sadly anything is possible. We should have never considered ditching Bedford after how they had served our troups during WW2 & since., particularly as the Military had decided at the time that Bedford were the best option.
If the Military contract was a major factor in the closure how our politicians should hold their heads in shame.
Yes I agree Bedford was badly let down by someone as another thread states, bedfords you saw them every were I think they were the back bone of many a good British company but would have needed a lot of investment to bring them up todays regulations
Carl Williams:
Another aspect I forgot to mention is the loss of the Military contract by Bedford. Am I alone in feeling physically sick when I see German vehicles driven by British soldiers. I hope we never have another world war in particular another European war. But sadly anything is possible. We should have never considered ditching Bedford after how they had served our troups during WW2 & since., particularly as the Military had decided at the time that Bedford were the best option.If the Military contract was a major factor in the closure how our politicians should hold their heads in shame.
Hi Carl,
You could say the same thing about Scammell regards the military contracts
atlas man:
Yes I agree Bedford was badly let down by someone as another thread states, bedfords you saw them every were I think they were the back bone of many a good British company but would have needed a lot of investment to bring them up todays regulations
.
atlas man:
Yes I agree Bedford was badly let down by someone as another thread states, bedfords you saw them every were I think they were the back bone of many a good British company but would have needed a lot of investment to bring them up todays regulations
I agree but what we must remember it is now 30 years since they stopped production. The Dunstable plant had a production line over 1 mile long, they were still by far UK’s biggest producer of CVs & probably still amongst the biggest in Europe.Had their production continued their products would have evolved and would have progressed to something not recognisable today, with gradual investment as they had in their previous 60 years of history.
And I know Carryfast is keen to mention the Detroit Diesel Engine but that was fitted in less than 5% of their production and apart from that everything was made in Britain, I know they were owned by GM, but at one time GM’s most profitable part of their business & run as a British Company, with minimum of USA interference
Carl Williams:
And I know Carryfast is keen to mention the Detroit Diesel Engine but that was fitted in less than 5% of their production and apart from that everything was made in Britain, I know they were owned by GM, but at one time GM’s most profitable part of their business & run as a British Company, with minimum of USA interference
In the case of a ‘what might have been topic’ I was only keen to mention the Detroit engine in the sense of the 60 series. On that note as I said a 60 series powered TM would have ticked all the required boxes of an all/mostly in house GM product,which its business case was built on and as such a Volvo F10/12 killer.Unfortunately for Bedford Volvo probably knew it as part of a plan which seems to have been all about it taking over GM’s position both in Europe and worldwide regards GM’s heavy truck operations.The only question then being exactly when that plan started to be put into action.But realistically no successful TM,let alone no GM parent, meant no Bedford.While much of the lack of success of the TM can only be put down to deliberate failure to make the best use of the in house resources available from the earliest point in the form of firstly the turbo 92 series.Let alone also closing down the whole GM truck operation worldwide bearing in mind it having the 60 series in its armoury by the late 1980’s.
gingerfold:
Returning to the title of the thread, the same question could be asked of several of the famous marques of the past. If you analyse the current truck market and manufacturers supplying it then of the Western companies possibly only Mercedes offers the wide range of commercial vehicles of all sizes that Bedford did, from the smallest van to the max. weight artic. I don’t believe that Bedford would ever have ‘cracked’ the heavy truck market, they were too late with their TM (like Ford with the Transcontinental) and buyers’ perceptions of who made what and for which market sector counted then for a lot of what they bought. (It still does to this day). It would have needed one superb truck for Bedford to compete successfully in the max. weight artic sector. I think that if their core products had been developed then Bedford could still have had a presence in the markets that it had dominated for decades, but by the end Bedford models were very dated.
I’d suggest that the Iveco / Fiat group currently offer a range similar to what Bedford did and up until the takeover of the truck division by Volvo then Renault too offered a full range of vehicles, Clio through to Magnum, however I would agree that Mercedes have the most comprehensive range, from Citan through to Actros, and then the more specialist vehicles like the Econic, Unimog & Zetros. It’s also interesting to note that Daimler sell more Canters then the rest of the Mercedes Truck brand added together.
As regards where would Bedford have been today? We’ll never know
Carl Williams:
Another aspect I forgot to mention is the loss of the Military contract by Bedford. Am I alone in feeling physically sick when I see German vehicles driven by British soldiers. I hope we never have another world war in particular another European war. But sadly anything is possible. We should have never considered ditching Bedford after how they had served our troups during WW2 & since., particularly as the Military had decided at the time that Bedford were the best option.If the Military contract was a major factor in the closure how our politicians should hold their heads in shame.
The Bedford reportedly outperformed the rest of the vehicles on trial for the new 4 tonner G.S.
Talk at the time was Leyland won the contract simply in an effort to save them and make them marketable for purchase.
The sad thing was that not only did Leyland sink anyway the loss of a large contract sunk Bedford also.
Ironically we were still using Bedford MJ’s when the DAF’s had just about fell apart.
Decent looking 4 tonner
[
[
AWD TM
[