I ask as I jumped in my Renault premium truck at 4 am Saturday morning, temp gauge was registering -10c, started the engine and a warning came up on the screen saying something like
“SOMETHING SOMETHING FUEL BLEED” when I saw it I assumed it meant the engine was being starved of diesel as that’s why you bleed the tank when you conk out because your tank is empty, but I had a full tank. Gave it a few good revs to check it was getting diesel into the engine and it seemed fine and left it to idle while I did my paper work and jumped out cab to do my walk round.
Jumped back in my cab 10 mins later and the warning has disappeared. So was it just because it was cold and the EM thought it was being starved of diesel it never came on again during the day and it stayed -10c all day, had to pour hot water (not boiling) into my water tank to clear the windscreen
is their a safe way to un-freeze a tank of diesel which does not have a tank heater
It’s not the freezing temperature you have to worry about but the Cold Filter Plugging Point (CFPP) which is when the fuel starts to solidify and block the filters. This spec. sheet for standard diesel shows the CFPP being at -15 degrees.
Biofuel (of the Fatty Acid Methy Ester types) has a much higher CFPP than standard diesel (which is refined in the UK to standard EN:590) and can start to solidify above the freezening temperature of water (around 4 degrees IIRC). I think most trucks running on biofuel have heaters to stop this being an issue, although there was a story a few years ago about a bus company that changed all its vehicles over to biofuel and they wouldn’t start one morning after a cold snap!
As an aside, if your engine is ‘CommonRail’ then the unused fuel is returned to the tank, there should be no need to bleed these.
you can light a fire under the diesel tank. they did in days gone by. must admit it would look a bit out of place now
mix a bit of parafin in with the diesel raises the freezing point, again another trick of days gone by. showing my age now.
there are that many addatives in modern diesel i reckon if your motor packs in in this country its time to go home.
dave:
you can light a fire under the diesel tank. they did in days gone by. must admit it would look a bit out of place now
mix a bit of parafin in with the diesel raises the freezing point, again another trick of days gone by. showing my age now.
there are that many addatives in modern diesel i reckon if your motor packs in in this country its time to go home.
it was '58 plate so there is no hope then tanks must freeze sometimes though in parts of scotland in the winter if the driver parks in an exposed postion and its a strong wind
i thought i read somewhere that it was illegal to now add parafin to your diesel tank or is that a MMTM DM
Cruise Control:
is their a safe way to un-freeze a tank of diesel which does not have a tank heater
I used to light a bonfire underneath mine.
The first time I had a diesel tank freeze I phoned the boss and he told me to light a fire under the tank, I think it took him about 10 minutes to convince me he wasn’t taking the ■■■■
I wonder what H&S would have to say about it these days
Cruise Control:
is their a safe way to un-freeze a tank of diesel which does not have a tank heater
I used to light a bonfire underneath mine.
The first time I had a diesel tank freeze I phoned the boss and he told me to light a fire under the tank, I think it took him about 10 minutes to convince me he wasn’t taking the ■■■■
I wonder what H&S would have to say about it these days
so how did you contain the fire in the olden days so it did not melt your tyres or depening on how long some of you been driving trucks stopping your wooden tyres burning
Many trucks will stop within a couple of miles from the depot, remember the fuel is not freezing but separating & waxing up.
The only effective remedy is to replace the filters. although lighting an old tyre near the tank can help, at least the driver stays warm
Most fuel suppliers will add enough additives in winter fuel and one problem is filling up with summer red and trying to get through the Blanc on it, it is better to use local fuel in those more extreme conditions
Your experience tells something about quality/composition of the fuel used.
IMHO, those -10degC took the fuel below its MFT (min filtration temp) that is it (the fuel) turned into a thick jelly that the pumps could not lift; though everything was turning as it should no/little fuel flow / pressure changes were recorded and the ECU concluded there must have been air in the system (which has similar symptoms).
As mentioned earlier, waxing point is the main trouble in winter, that’s when paraffin flakes form in the fuel and clogg up filter first and the rest of the system promptly afterwards. And this can, with some really crap fuel, happen even at +10degC. (so I don’t quite understand how can adding paraffin into tank help…)
Crude paraffin is byproduct at refineries and is dirt cheap compared to diesel fuel so some unscrupulous dealers buy it bulk and dilute it in diesel to boost profits. However, after some processing the paraffin can end up as an expensive major substance in cosmetics and pharmaceuticals.
In many countries there are two or three grades of diesel distributed over different periods of year with varying composition, paraffin content and MTF between 0 to -20/25degC.
If you don’t want to light a fire under a frozen tank then get some still liquid fuel from garage shop and pour it into the tank. you can also heat it up in a can on stove, just don’t tell H&S guy - and don’t take above 50-60degC
Cruise Control:
is their a safe way to un-freeze a tank of diesel which does not have a tank heater
I used to light a bonfire underneath mine.
The first time I had a diesel tank freeze I phoned the boss and he told me to light a fire under the tank, I think it took him about 10 minutes to convince me he wasn’t taking the ■■■■
I wonder what H&S would have to say about it these days
so how did you contain the fire in the olden days so it did not melt your tyres or depening on how long some of you been driving trucks stopping your wooden tyres burning
You would of put some of your waxey diesel with a rag in a biscuit tin or your old battered saucepan and DONT FORGET TO TAKE OFF YOUR FUEL CAP.
Cruise Control:
I ask as I jumped in my Renault premium truck at 4 am Saturday morning, temp gauge was registering -10c, started the engine and a warning came up on the screen saying something like
“SOMETHING SOMETHING FUEL BLEED” when I saw it I assumed it meant the engine was being starved of diesel as that’s why you bleed the tank when you conk out because your tank is empty, but I had a full tank. Gave it a few good revs to check it was getting diesel into the engine and it seemed fine and left it to idle while I did my paper work and jumped out cab to do my walk round.
Jumped back in my cab 10 mins later and the warning has disappeared. So was it just because it was cold and the EM thought it was being starved of diesel it never came on again during the day and it stayed -10c all day, had to pour hot water (not boiling) into my water tank to clear the windscreen
is their a safe way to un-freeze a tank of diesel which does not have a tank heater
i used to find that when the diesel started to wax up it was usually the fuel pipe elbows where the pipe came out of the fuel tank or into the fuel filters that blocked up first,i used to lag all the fuel pipes with strips of old blanket taken off the engine cover did,nt seem to have much trouble after that.be careful if you do light a fire under the fuel tank as the air pipes run in the chassis behind the tank and being made of plastic if they get hot they can burst with the pressure in them.as i found out to my cost
Cruise Control:
is their a safe way to un-freeze a tank of diesel which does not have a tank heater
I used to light a bonfire underneath mine.
The first time I had a diesel tank freeze I phoned the boss and he told me to light a fire under the tank, I think it took him about 10 minutes to convince me he wasn’t taking the ■■■■
I wonder what H&S would have to say about it these days
so how did you contain the fire in the olden days so it did not melt your tyres or depening on how long some of you been driving trucks stopping your wooden tyres burning
When I was on m/e in the '70’s and '80’s,we were no strangers to waxing up of diesel with some of the extremes of temperature we ran into.
If your diesel tank waxed up overnight,to thaw the tank out most drivers had a 7 pound tin of grease,put a piece of rag in it for a wick and light it,stick it under your tank then have a brew for half an hour.
But then,the diesel in youre fuel lines and filters has waxed up too so the whole system has to be bled to get the thawed out diesel through.
If the engine is left running all night then the diesel fuel returned to the tank from the engine is usually enough to prevent the tank waxing up.
It wasn’t until just before I finished on the m/e that I noticed that I never saw a Skandinavian truck with frozen derv,and when I asked a Swedish driver why this was so,he told me that they were in the habit of putting a cup full of brake fluid into the diesel,that will stop it!
I used to have “Arctic Fox”, this was a coiled element which sat in the diesel tank, it looked just like a huge kettle element except it was fed by hot water from the cooling system, I also had a Thermoline fuel line heater but I still had to light bonfires beneath my tank, or change filters at -40 etc…
