About once a fortnight my Brother and I would stay overnight at my Nan’s House, she lived on Liverpool Road (Islington) one junction away from Holloway Road, at the other end of the road was a Transport Café I think it was called Brady’s.
We would lay in bed and listen to the Lorries coming and going and we would guess what they were by the sound of the engine, we were good at it.
You could hear the Foden from some distance away, if it stopped at the lights that were about 50yds from our bedroom, well it was like Christmas Eve for two kids who were lorry mad, we’d listen to it making it’s way to Holloway Road and count the gear changes, we thought it was the best.
I know next to nothing about this Engine, over the years my Dad had Leyland’s, Aec’s and Fodens (Gardner), was this Engine a success, was it reliable, what was it like on fuel and how was it to drive…
Guy Big J 8lxb:
About once a fortnight my Brother and I would stay overnight at my Nan’s House, she lived on Liverpool Road (Islington) one junction away from Holloway Road, at the other end of the road was a Transport Café I think it was called Brady’s.
We would lay in bed and listen to the Lorries coming and going and we would guess what they were by the sound of the engine, we were good at it.
You could hear the Foden from some distance away, if it stopped at the lights that were about 50yds from our bedroom, well it was like Christmas Eve for two kids who were lorry mad, we’d listen to it making it’s way to Holloway Road and count the gear changes, we thought it was the best.
I know next to nothing about this Engine, over the years my Dad had Leyland’s, Aec’s and Fodens (Gardner), was this Engine a success, was it reliable, what was it like on fuel and how was it to drive…
I had very little dealings with the Foden stroker but I know many folk who ran them and, if driven correctly, they were fine. You needed to keep them above the 2000 rpm range otherwise they tended to overheat, my last gaffer drove one when he worked for Bernard Swain and Tommy Babb who has the restored S21 cabbed mixer on the show circuit both said the same. The 12 speed box was developed to make this easy. Tommy’s has the extra cooling tank mounted on the dashboard in the cab to keep a good head of water above the engine which the later versions were fitted with, a lot of the problems were caused by drivers used to Gardner engines etc driving the two strokes the same but you had to forget all that and really ‘drive’ them like most 'strokers including the Rootes TS3 which took some getting used to. When I toured the Foden works around 1976 they were still building them for The Admiralty as they were fitted in pairs into their high speed launches.
The transport cafe and digs was Georgie Brays. The food was…‘not bad’, the digs were appalling. I only stayed there one night (I was a young lad, still learning)…never again. No sleeper cabs in those long gone days.
windrush:
I had very little dealings with the Foden stroker but I know many folk who ran them and, if driven correctly, they were fine. You needed to keep them above the 2000 rpm range otherwise they tended to overheat, my last gaffer drove one when he worked for Bernard Swain and Tommy Babb who has the restored S21 cabbed mixer on the show circuit both said the same. The 12 speed box was developed to make this easy. Tommy’s has the extra cooling tank mounted on the dashboard in the cab to keep a good head of water above the engine which the later versions were fitted with, a lot of the problems were caused by drivers used to Gardner engines etc driving the two strokes the same but you had to forget all that and really ‘drive’ them like most 'strokers including the Rootes TS3 which took some getting used to. When I toured the Foden works around 1976 they were still building them for The Admiralty as they were fitted in pairs into their high speed launches.
Pete.
What’s they saying, bang your knee on the way up, jam your fingers in the door and then if that fails drive it like you stole it!
grumpy old man:
The transport cafe and digs was Georgie Brays. The food was…‘not bad’, the digs were appalling. I only stayed there one night (I was a young lad, still learning)…never again. No sleeper cabs in those long gone days.
Thanks for the correct name, there was always plenty of lorries parked up there…
windrush:
I had very little dealings with the Foden stroker but I know many folk who ran them and, if driven correctly, they were fine. You needed to keep them above the 2000 rpm range otherwise they tended to overheat, my last gaffer drove one when he worked for Bernard Swain and Tommy Babb who has the restored S21 cabbed mixer on the show circuit both said the same. The 12 speed box was developed to make this easy. Tommy’s has the extra cooling tank mounted on the dashboard in the cab to keep a good head of water above the engine which the later versions were fitted with, a lot of the problems were caused by drivers used to Gardner engines etc driving the two strokes the same but you had to forget all that and really ‘drive’ them like most 'strokers including the Rootes TS3 which took some getting used to. When I toured the Foden works around 1976 they were still building them for The Admiralty as they were fitted in pairs into their high speed launches.
Guy Big J 8lxb:
About once a fortnight my Brother and I would stay overnight at my Nan’s House, she lived on Liverpool Road (Islington) one junction away from Holloway Road, at the other end of the road was a Transport Café I think it was called Brady’s.
We would lay in bed and listen to the Lorries coming and going and we would guess what they were by the sound of the engine, we were good at it.
You could hear the Foden from some distance away, if it stopped at the lights that were about 50yds from our bedroom, well it was like Christmas Eve for two kids who were lorry mad, we’d listen to it making it’s way to Holloway Road and count the gear changes, we thought it was the best.
I know next to nothing about this Engine, over the years my Dad had Leyland’s, Aec’s and Fodens (Gardner), was this Engine a success, was it reliable, what was it like on fuel and how was it to drive…
Thanks for posting that article Deanb I enjoyed that, they made good power for their size didn’t they, shame I never had the chance to drive one, I grew up with the 12sp box and thought it was a good box.
I think it was Silver Roadways who seemed to have a few of them, thanks once again…
I have related this tale on another thread but when “I were a Lad” growing up in Kendal and probably around 61/62 or so a regular sight passing through the Town was a Foden artic coupled to a test weighted trailer. It usually was travelling North on the A6 in mid or later morning then a couple of hours or so later early afternoon it returned South through the town on it’s way back to Elworth I believe after it had climbed Shap Fell it turned around at the Shap Granite Pink Quarry for it’s return jouney. Now this used to go on 5 days a week for months and I can say that this unit was one hell of a noisy ■■■■■■■ which I was able to understand in later years was the Foden 2 Stroke !!! As I was never ever a Foden enthusiast even when they were fitted with a Gardner engine ! So I could never grasp why they, Fodens, persisted in “flogging” the dead horse of their own in house engine for installation in commercial vehicles as it must have been quite evident that it was an unmitigated failure ! But of course Fodens were very stubborn and ignored the direction of travel the Industry was taking during the 1970’s and this led to their downfall in 1980.
Just my opinion as an operator during those years, others may hold a different and totally opposite opinion ! I’m only glad that I was never called on by a Foden Salesman nor was I ever tempted to enquire about a Foden either ! Cheers Bewick.
The Foden High Speed Diesel Two Stroke engine began development during the latter years of WWII and the reason for Foden to design and build their own powerplant was a simple one and something that would also reappear in later decades of vehicle manufacture. The war years had increased the productivity and manufacturing capability while turning out vehicles for the Ministry of Supply and Defence and to enable this to be kept up post war it was felt Gardner’s ability to meet future engine requirements for the company as well as other makers using the Patricroft engines would effect this. An engine had been tried previously in 1938 named the ‘Nemesis’ a four cylinder oil engine based on the Gardner 4LW, however this experiment did not hold up to the better fuel consumption, starting reliability and noise emission of the Gardner. The failure of this earlier attempt could be the reason Foden designers decided to go for the Two Stroke, a one cylinder test engine proved successful so production started on a four cylinder Two Stroke and it was ready in 1945.
It developed 84 bhp at 2,000 rpm and weighed less than 1,000 Ibs due to the use of cast aluminium crankcase and cylinder block. The FD4 Mk 1 was followed by the FD6 six cylinder two stroke developing 120 bhp at 2,000 rpm, 350 Ibs/ft Torque at 1500 rpm and weighed under 1,200 Ibs, while the equivalent Gardner 6LW developed 112 bhp at 1,700 rpm with 358 Ibs/ft of Torque at 1,300 rpm but weighed 350 Ibs heavier than the FD6 installed. The job now was to build up the same customer confidence as the Gardner engine range did and Foden sales teams set about this. Marine examples of 4, 6 and 12 cylinder engines were also developed and the commercial engine developed over the years into the Mk III FD6 of the Sixties which most of us on this site recall in Foden’s of the period. Foden obviously felt producing their own engine was worthwhile since the early model and sold well in the UK and especially on overseas contracts. Hope you found this useful GUY Big J. Franky.
We did have one Foden mixer with a 'stroker fitted at our quarry for a while but apart from changing some filters on it we did no other maintenance as the mixers usually went to Stafford for repairs etc. The lad who drove it had a hand with hardly any fingers on it, an abnormallity from birth, but he could make it sing! I have seen a pic of the original single cylinder engine and it was interesting, I can’t remember whether it was in Foden’s museum when we visited in 1976? The last firm I worked for had run an ex Sellers and Kent Foden eight wheeler flat many years before and that had the two stroke fitted. I remember the senior partner (the late Frank Gough) telling me that he rode from Wirksworth up to Manchester one saturday alongside the regular driver as there was an urgent load of asphalt blocks to be delivered and he had never seen a man change gear so rapidly before in his life! "We passed every lorry and quite a few cars up those banks between Newhaven and Whaley Bridge " I remember Frank telling me “and it wasn’t bad on fuel as well”. When I worked for them they still had the parts book and workshop manual for it, plus some other books on Dodge trucks etc, and he offered them to me when the firm closed down as he knew I collected Foden memorabilia etc and would have liked to add it to my collection. We did a deal but when I asked him about calling for it somebody had offered him more money so they got it alas. I think the two stroke was a brave attempt by Foden’s to try something in heavier weight trucks that British operators were not used to, and even to this day they have never really accepted anything other than ‘traditional’ four stroke engines.
windrush:
I think the two stroke was a brave attempt by Foden’s to try something in heavier weight trucks that British operators were not used to, and even to this day they have never really accepted anything other than ‘traditional’ four stroke engines.
Pete.
The main issue with two strokes is getting enough air into the cylinder charge and relying on just the scavenging of the outgoing exhaust to drag the charge in was never the ideal solution.The loss of the induction stroke really wastes a lot of cylinder volume because there isn’t time to fill the cylinder properly before the start of the compression stroke unlike in the case of a four stroke.Bolting a turbocharger to a two stroke is a game changer in that regard providing potentially massive effective specific outputs both torque and power.
windrush:
I think the two stroke was a brave attempt by Foden’s to try something in heavier weight trucks that British operators were not used to, and even to this day they have never really accepted anything other than ‘traditional’ four stroke engines.
Pete.
The main issue with two strokes is getting enough air into the cylinder charge and relying on just the scavenging of the outgoing exhaust to drag the charge in was never the ideal solution.The loss of the induction stroke really wastes a lot of cylinder volume because there isn’t time to fill the cylinder properly before the start of the compression stroke unlike in the case of a four stroke.Bolting a turbocharger to a two stroke is a game changer in that regard providing potentially massive effective specific outputs both torque and power.
I think the two stroke was a brave attempt by Foden’s to try something in heavier weight trucks that British operators were not used to, and even to this day they have never really accepted anything other than ‘traditional’ four stroke engines.
