The Big Driver Shortage Problem in the UK

As those who read history know, revolution only comes about when the people are at their lowest, and most desparate. When dying in a violent protest is no worse a prospect than dying at home from Malnutrition. …

As our ‘elected leaders’ know very well, as long as they provide food and x factor on TV, the masses will grumble, but roll over and ask for more.

You and I are all guilty of this to some degree. I have given up on societies obsession with gathering more and more baubles. No loans. No mortgage. No rent. I don’t take, and give no more than my tax on my wages. But I still work, and pay taxes.

We have it to good to revolt.

Think of the political feat that it was to take a situation with a stagnating economy and a slight shortage of labour to get them all to sign up and go to Europe to fight rather than just let market forces step in, and push up local wages where the shortages were the most acute.

Places like Yorkshire and Scotland should, by rights, already seen some hiking of drivers pay (except in tramping) by now. But no.

Down here in Kent, you only have to look at the main trade route roads the A2, M20, M2 to see that they are pretty much choc-a-bloc with foreign drivers these days.

The market force is

(1) Resist the supply and demand wage increases
(2) Fill the vacancy with a “9 points OK” local driver OR migrant
(3) Go through the pretence of real capitalism happening, and raise wages eventually but by inflation only (so no real increase happens)
(4) Rinse and repeat.

If you disrupt this chain, then even then - wages might rise, but the pound falls to compensate. This will see an increase in lifestyle for those drivers who don’t holiday abroad, and the “pound in your pocket” argument applies.

If memory serves, the 1980’s saw jobs being destroyed En Masse, and the pound not staying strong anyway.

Today, 2017 we’ll see jobs destroyed En Marche (!) and the pound is already faceplanted. :unamused:

The EU citizen on the other hand, sees an over-priced currency that, they unfortunately cannot get paid much of when working, so try and move to minimalist work ethic to get around.
No one wants to put themselves out any more.

This Euro-wide recession is different from past ones.
We don’t get out of it with War this time, and we don’t get out of it with Fiat Currency whenever we feel like it any more.

Interestingly, the longer we attempt to pursue Brexit, the more likely one of the good-old-fashioned solutions is eventually going to happen all over again.
What’s all brand new - is the concept of a war vs a bureaucracy rather than another nation state or Empire as such.

How hard can that be? Past wars have occurred on things like “Trade Disruption” so there’s plenty of precedence for it.
Peace is a very finely balanced aspect of Geographical European life as it stands. Greece were not in a position to fight their way out. We’d struggle with our wound-down armed forces, and the like.
But… and here’s the big issue that seems to be being ignored…
Attempts to get large numbers migrants and ethnics and even lefties into the police & armed forces where their lives are actually in danger - have fallen flat over the years.
If these forces were as diverse as our governments would have had it, then there won’t be any pressure build-up. But they are not. Thus, the governments wind them down instead, hoping that law and order can be maintained with reduced people whilst steadly allowing any newcomers of any sort to out-breed us over time.
This, then - makes this particular repetition of History enough different that when it comes - we won’t see it coming as usual, people like myself being ignored as usual.
Churchill got ignored as a sitting back bench MP throughout the 30’s, but was eventually proven right. His argument wasn’t about “Ethnicity” or “Religion” or “Immigration”. It was about what was going on in Europe.

A handful of ordinary workers, of which I am one - are not going to be listened to, curse of Cassandra as usual of course. :frowning:

History will be repeating itself, and because time runs against Britain when it comes to Europe - I say it’ll be sooner than anyone thinks!

Winseer:
Churchill got ignored as a sitting back bench MP throughout the 30’s, but was eventually proven right. His argument wasn’t about “Ethnicity” or “Religion” or “Immigration”. It was about what was going on in Europe.

It would be a mistake to paint Churchill as any champion of the working class.While also being a major part of the establishment with a liking for centralised dictatorial government including being a founding member of the EU project.

As for the 1930’s he actually signed off the Ten Year Rule in 1928 which financially crippled our forces.With him having no input in the cabinet which implemented the re armament programme of the mid 1930’s with the credit for that going in large part to the Chancellor …Neville Chamberlain in Ramsay McDonald’s coalition administration.

nationalarchives.gov.uk/cabi … mament.htm

independent.co.uk/news/uk/po … 18317.html

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tonypandy_riots

google.co.uk/amp/m.wikihow. … %3Famp%3D1

I don’t think anyone will be firing nukes out of anger. If they ever get fired, it’ll be out of madmanship.
The danger there is that if Russia’s “Dead Man Switch” is a reality (no reason why it shouldn’t be) then the first stray nuke that explodes within Russian borders anywhere, will bring about an automated holocaust response, almost “Terminator Skynet” Style.

Computers can be mad too. They don’t just say “No”. :frowning:

TiredAndEmotional:

NRL_KL:
The driver shortage problem has long been an issue for the UK’s haulage firms. Reports show that there are approximately 80,000 licence holders for Class I and II but they are not all willing to drive; in total figures are leaning towards an industry shortage of over 45,000, and this is a growing concern. The average age of a lorry driver is close to 54 and we are losing more drivers than we can replenish, yet there are enough licence holders out there to supply the industry, but if we can’t persuade them to drive the industry will literally grind to a halt. So what are the main reasons why licence holders are not interested in getting back behind the wheel? I spent a lot of time talking with drivers, the FTA, the RHA, fleet operators to try and find out why and this is what was uncovered:

“Poor pay conditions, whilst there has been a slight improvement in this area the average wage for an HGV driver is £24,700, or less if newly qualified.”

“It is too expensive to become a driver, whilst many companies support their drivers through subsidised training (or in some cases completely cover the cost of their training) the rest fork out anywhere between £3k-£4k, which the driver has to fund.”

“Conditions on the road are not fit for drivers. Many drivers have to live in their Lorries, they are shunned from certain services with “No HGV’s” signs placed at entrances, and the truck stops that are available are often grotty, food is awful and it’s a miserable means to an ends. On the continent there is a difference in culture and mind-set. Services often include accommodation, waiter service and the drivers feel more looked after, as such their visits to the service stations are an enjoyable experience rather than an unpleasant one.”

“Legislation and accountability. Many drivers are put off by red tape and the level of accountability that they are ultimately responsible for.”

“As a newly qualified driver it can be difficult to find work and many companies shun them due to a lack of experience, there seems to be a myth about newly qualified drivers being unsuitable. As such the drivers are more likely re-apply in a few years or so because they know that companies will hire drivers with 2 or 3 years on their licence. The obvious problem being that the last time that driver actually drove an HGV was probably in their examination and their hours of experience is low. In fact they are most likely to pose more of a risk to employers than a freshly qualified driver.”

There are of course many other reasons, but these echo the majority. So how can we fix this industry problem? Firstly the average age is something that needs to be addressed so as to replenish attrition from retired drivers, this is a slow burner but many companies now offer apprenticeships to encourage younger drivers to take up driving and once qualified, a £21k+ salary is quite attractive to youngsters. Furthermore, the companies who are developing these individuals benefit from being able to coach the apprentices through the entire process of learning to drive and so they have greater confidence and trust in their employees. Ex armed forces personnel, there are so many drivers who are currently operating in the armed forces who regularly drive HGV class I and II vehicles, when they are ready to leave the armed forces they have plenty of experience and the advantage of hitting the ground running. Moving forwards we still need to address the infrastructure issues in the UK, this will be key to keeping our drivers happier with life on the road, otherwise these ‘driverless’ HGV testing companies (currently testing in the USA) may indeed solve the shortage crisis for us!

Thanks for reading, please post your comments, opinions and more importantly ANY factors which put you off driving as an occupation which I have not mentioned in this article.

You’re obviously an employer/agency [zb] and you’re clearly not taking things on board. Jog on ■■■■■■!

Not an agency or an employer but thanks for lowering the tone!

NRL_KL:

TiredAndEmotional:

NRL_KL:
The driver shortage problem has long been an issue for the UK’s haulage firms. Reports show that there are approximately 80,000 licence holders for Class I and II but they are not all willing to drive; in total figures are leaning towards an industry shortage of over 45,000, and this is a growing concern. The average age of a lorry driver is close to 54 and we are losing more drivers than we can replenish, yet there are enough licence holders out there to supply the industry, but if we can’t persuade them to drive the industry will literally grind to a halt. So what are the main reasons why licence holders are not interested in getting back behind the wheel? I spent a lot of time talking with drivers, the FTA, the RHA, fleet operators to try and find out why and this is what was uncovered:

“Poor pay conditions, whilst there has been a slight improvement in this area the average wage for an HGV driver is £24,700, or less if newly qualified.”

“It is too expensive to become a driver, whilst many companies support their drivers through subsidised training (or in some cases completely cover the cost of their training) the rest fork out anywhere between £3k-£4k, which the driver has to fund.”

“Conditions on the road are not fit for drivers. Many drivers have to live in their Lorries, they are shunned from certain services with “No HGV’s” signs placed at entrances, and the truck stops that are available are often grotty, food is awful and it’s a miserable means to an ends. On the continent there is a difference in culture and mind-set. Services often include accommodation, waiter service and the drivers feel more looked after, as such their visits to the service stations are an enjoyable experience rather than an unpleasant one.”

“Legislation and accountability. Many drivers are put off by red tape and the level of accountability that they are ultimately responsible for.”

“As a newly qualified driver it can be difficult to find work and many companies shun them due to a lack of experience, there seems to be a myth about newly qualified drivers being unsuitable. As such the drivers are more likely re-apply in a few years or so because they know that companies will hire drivers with 2 or 3 years on their licence. The obvious problem being that the last time that driver actually drove an HGV was probably in their examination and their hours of experience is low. In fact they are most likely to pose more of a risk to employers than a freshly qualified driver.”

There are of course many other reasons, but these echo the majority. So how can we fix this industry problem? Firstly the average age is something that needs to be addressed so as to replenish attrition from retired drivers, this is a slow burner but many companies now offer apprenticeships to encourage younger drivers to take up driving and once qualified, a £21k+ salary is quite attractive to youngsters. Furthermore, the companies who are developing these individuals benefit from being able to coach the apprentices through the entire process of learning to drive and so they have greater confidence and trust in their employees. Ex armed forces personnel, there are so many drivers who are currently operating in the armed forces who regularly drive HGV class I and II vehicles, when they are ready to leave the armed forces they have plenty of experience and the advantage of hitting the ground running. Moving forwards we still need to address the infrastructure issues in the UK, this will be key to keeping our drivers happier with life on the road, otherwise these ‘driverless’ HGV testing companies (currently testing in the USA) may indeed solve the shortage crisis for us!

Thanks for reading, please post your comments, opinions and more importantly ANY factors which put you off driving as an occupation which I have not mentioned in this article.

You’re obviously an employer/agency [zb] and you’re clearly not taking things on board. Jog on ■■■■■■!

Not an agency or an employer but thanks for lowering the tone!

An idiot then.

NRL_KL:

TiredAndEmotional:

NRL_KL:
The driver shortage problem has long been an issue for the UK’s haulage firms. Reports show that there are approximately 80,000 licence holders for Class I and II but they are not all willing to drive; in total figures are leaning towards…

Snipped for brevity…

…still need to address the infrastructure issues in the UK, this will be key to keeping our drivers happier with life on the road, otherwise these ‘driverless’ HGV testing companies (currently testing in the USA) may indeed solve the shortage crisis for us!

Thanks for reading, please post your comments, opinions and more importantly ANY factors which put you off driving as an occupation which I have not mentioned in this article.

You’re obviously an employer/agency [zb] and you’re clearly not taking things on board. Jog on ■■■■■■!

Not an agency or an employer but thanks for lowering the tone!

NRL_KL gets up and has another go.

Just to satisfy my curiosity I did a search on a few job sites for HGV driving jobs in the locality. Page after page of agency ads repeating the same job, multiple agencies for the same company, but only three jobs for companies; three proper jobs if you will. To compound that I know of agency drivers sat at home with no work. Whatever driver shortage you are thinking of it doesn’t exist around here!

Stanley Knife:
Just to satisfy my curiosity I did a search on a few job sites for HGV driving jobs in the locality. Page after page of agency ads repeating the same job, multiple agencies for the same company, but only three jobs for companies; three proper jobs if you will. To compound that I know of agency drivers sat at home with no work. Whatever driver shortage you are thinking of it doesn’t exist around here!

I suggest what we actually have is a THIN market for actual HGV jobs with poor liquidity.

This would be the same as the current state of the Housing Market:

(1) We’re told that our house is worth a fortune - until you decide you want to sell for that apparent price you’re told it’s currently worth.
(2) When you do decide to sell a house - don’t expect much action for getting on for half a year - unless you’ve offered it at a bargain price for some cash buyer to get their grubby mits on.
(3) If you try and get a mortgage on a property worth say, £200k - you’ll be told you can only borrow £120k because the lender has valued it for mortgage application purposes a lot lower than the vendor’s asking price clearly… It was bad enough trying to come up with £25k-£40k deposit - but £80k■■?

So what happens in the end? How much is your house really worth?

F— knows. Truth is, there hasn’t been a “full price buyer with a full mortgage” up your street for some time now.

Then they tell us there is a “permanent shortage of properties”.
Nope. There is a shortage of people being able to buy and sell at asking prices.

That’s it.

If driving a wagon paid top dollar everywhere, we’d hear kids at university saying things like “F… this accountancy/literature/history lark - I’m off to get a class one licence and life the high life!” :sunglasses:

Meanwhile, to fill any desperate vacancies that need filling - you don’t advertise the job, you advertise one job as five separate shifts with five different agencies that hey presto - makes it look like there are twenty five times as many jobs as initially apparent!

…Then that client can pick the best of them, and offer them the single full time job that was all that was originally on offer…

(Well, that’s how I got my current job anyways! :grimacing: )