44 Tonne Ton:
Then why do so many struggle with it? I have recently been helping someone with very basic numeracy and literacy and beleive me there’s a lot out there
There are a lot out there and i understand exactly what you’re saying. I believe its a reliance on ‘old terms’ like spreadover, counting breaks from when they start instead of looking at what you can do in the 24 hour period when you start work and other such stuff. I think its a reluctance to change or embrace the new rules being hampered by what they knew that causes so many to go wrong. Even with limited numeracy and literacy it can’t be hard to fathom out that working 14 hours and taking 12 hours off is a reduced rest. But yes, this is probably the same thing you come across as i have done.
44 Tonne Ton:
Then why do so many struggle with it?
Because they are led to believe they are complicated so approach them with that mindset, from then on it’s all downhill.
It’s just a matter of reading them carefully and cutting through the legal speak.
Coffee, I’m talking about people who can barely count or read and write. They struggle with this whatever way you try and communicate it to them. You have the advantage of being very capable in this area others don’t and never will. We either simplify it or demand a higher standard of education from drivers. The CPC unfortunately is waiting for the coach and horses to drive through it.
mike68:
What continues to amaze me is the amount of drivers who don’t know the rules. This is why we need the driver cpc.
Based on what I’ve heard about some of the tacho courses being given as part of the Driver’s CPC drivers will still be none the wiser after the course as most of them seem to range from minor inaccuracies to total ■■■■■■■■ being taught.
Hence the need to simplify. I know a lot of drivers struggle to understand the rules as they are at present and rely on other people for advice,not always a good idea! I’m a long way from being any sort of expert myself!
Doesn’t matter how simple they are if the courses are teaching nonsense.
Not had any experience of the driver cpc but surely drivers hours would be a large part of the course if this is not the case then why bother, most of what we do is common sense drivers hours is quite complicated to some, when we should all be experts surely. Please don’t tell me i have to pay 500 quid to someone who knows less than me.
44 Tonne Ton:
Then why do so many struggle with it?
Because they are led to believe they are complicated so approach them with that mindset, from then on it’s all downhill.
It’s just a matter of reading them carefully and cutting through the legal speak.
Coffee, I’m talking about people who can barely count or read and write. They struggle with this whatever way you try and communicate it to them. You have the advantage of being very capable in this area others don’t and never will. We either simplify it or demand a higher standard of education from drivers. The CPC unfortunately is waiting for the coach and horses to drive through it.
I just think Mike C has hit the nail on the head and I mentioned it on page one. Many are remembering old fashioned terms and confusing themselves with that.
Spreadover, split breaks, 36 hour breaks and so on.
Coffee has written the regulations down in a very simple way.
It seems as though many planners are at fault or drivers who think they must drive to the maximum and then panic when the layby is full.
Before we became so paranoid about a minute over a spreadover, the easy way was, drive 3, have a shower & a coffee, drive 3 have your lunch. by then you know if you are going to get tipped today or tomorrow. have a relaxing 3 hours or chase for the last 4 hours.
If you are tipping that day, you can plan the tip and a break in the same place. many factories and warehouses will have a shower if you ask them nicely. The rules are simple, the driver makes them difficult by being so rigid with their understanding of them.
mike68:
Not had any experience of the driver cpc but surely drivers hours would be a large part of the course
You would think so but it doesn’t have to be.
mike68:
Please don’t tell me i have to pay 500 quid to someone who knows less than me.
I couldn’t even begin to count the number of threads in the Legal Forum where someone has posted in contradiction of the answer given to a question on driver’s hours, with supporting links to the relevant bit of legislation, qualifying it with statements such as - “But our driver trainer told us…” or “That’s not right, on the course I was on they told us that…”. So unfortunately it seems there is a good chance you will be taught by someone who doesn’t actually know the rules and just regurgitates the same old myths and inaccuracies.
mike68:
Not had any experience of the driver cpc but surely drivers hours would be a large part of the course if this is not the case then why bother, most of what we do is common sense drivers hours is quite complicated to some, when we should all be experts surely. Please don’t tell me i have to pay 500 quid to someone who knows less than me.
Hmmm, you fear you may have to pay someone £500 who knows less than you? I’d say thats your least problem. The CPC is not a course and nor is drivers hours a large part of ‘the course’. The CPC is a requirement to undergo a certain amount of work related training in a certain amount of time. It could include drivers hours as you mention, but it doesn’t have to.It could be health and saftey at work, ADR, manual handling, fuel efficient driving the list goes on. Theres no test, just you getting some training. And in your case you plan on paying £500 for it, in my case i’ll get my employer to provide my work related training. Looks like you have a lot to learn
Wheel Nut:
Coffee has written the regulations down in a very simple way.
Very simple but accurate and if a driver followed them they would be very unlikely to ever get an infringement.
Wheel Nut:
The rules are simple, the driver makes them difficult by being so rigid with their understanding of them.
Driver’s don’t like change. I can only imagine the many posts and threads on here full of complaint if the rules were completely changed for a ‘simple version’.
Nope leave it as it is, it’s not perfect but it works fairly well, as drivers we do too many hours anyway, but we do a lot less than other countries where there is no legislation. Just sit down go through it and it really is quite simple and the digi card makes easier too (Still miss winding it on nine hours for a night out with the lads though)
mike68:
Nope leave it as it is, it’s not perfect but it works fairly well, as drivers we do too many hours anyway, but we do a lot less than other countries where there is no legislation. Just sit down go through it and it really is quite simple and the digi card makes easier too (Still miss winding it on nine hours for a night out with the lads though)
mike68:
Not had any experience of the driver cpc but surely drivers hours would be a large part of the course if this is not the case then why bother, most of what we do is common sense drivers hours is quite complicated to some, when we should all be experts surely. Please don’t tell me i have to pay 500 quid to someone who knows less than me.
Hmmm, you fear you may have to pay someone £500 who knows less than you? I’d say thats your least problem. The CPC is not a course and nor is drivers hours a large part of ‘the course’. The CPC is a requirement to undergo a certain amount of work related training in a certain amount of time. It could include drivers hours as you mention, but it doesn’t have to.It could be health and saftey at work, ADR, manual handling, fuel efficient driving the list goes on. Theres no test, just you getting some training. And in your case you plan on paying £500 for it, in my case i’ll get my employer to provide my work related training. Looks like you have a lot to learn
As an agency driver it looks like i have to pay for it myself, after 21 years I learn things all the time and am happy to do so and a lot of it comes from this site, if it means I become better at what I do and more employable then great, i just don’t want to pay for something without there being any benefit just a card that says I can do something Which I already do.
mike68:
Nope leave it as it is, it’s not perfect but it works fairly well, as drivers we do too many hours anyway, but we do a lot less than other countries where there is no legislation. Just sit down go through it and it really is quite simple and the digi card makes easier too (Still miss winding it on nine hours for a night out with the lads though)
Which countries have no legislation Mike?
Anywhere outside the E.U and most of the developing countries.
mike68:
Not had any experience of the driver cpc but surely drivers hours would be a large part of the course if this is not the case then why bother, most of what we do is common sense drivers hours is quite complicated to some, when we should all be experts surely. Please don’t tell me i have to pay 500 quid to someone who knows less than me.
Hmmm, you fear you may have to pay someone £500 who knows less than you? I’d say thats your least problem. The CPC is not a course and nor is drivers hours a large part of ‘the course’. The CPC is a requirement to undergo a certain amount of work related training in a certain amount of time. It could include drivers hours as you mention, but it doesn’t have to.It could be health and saftey at work, ADR, manual handling, fuel efficient driving the list goes on. Theres no test, just you getting some training. And in your case you plan on paying £500 for it, in my case i’ll get my employer to provide my work related training. Looks like you have a lot to learn
As an agency driver it looks like i have to pay for it myself, after 21 years I learn things all the time and am happy to do so and a lot of it comes from this site, if it means I become better at what I do and more employable then great, i just don’t want to pay for something without there being any benefit just a card that says I can do something Which I already do.
I can set your mind at rest there Mike, you dont get a card. You just get to keep your licence if you do it, if you don’t do it you won’t be working In theory it should drive wages up a bit, wether it works in practice remains to be seen but i reckon you won’t get such a glib attitude from employers who have paid to train you i.e if you won’t do it then there’s the door, they may have to engage themselves in management skills !! But thats just my guess.
mike68:
Nope leave it as it is, it’s not perfect but it works fairly well, as drivers we do too many hours anyway, but we do a lot less than other countries where there is no legislation. Just sit down go through it and it really is quite simple and the digi card makes easier too (Still miss winding it on nine hours for a night out with the lads though)
Which countries have no legislation Mike?
Anywhere outside the E.U and most of the developing countries.
Non EU European countries have legislation, they use our old rules and call them AETR.
mike68:
Not had any experience of the driver cpc but surely drivers hours would be a large part of the course if this is not the case then why bother, most of what we do is common sense drivers hours is quite complicated to some, when we should all be experts surely. Please don’t tell me i have to pay 500 quid to someone who knows less than me.
Hmmm, you fear you may have to pay someone £500 who knows less than you? I’d say thats your least problem. The CPC is not a course and nor is drivers hours a large part of ‘the course’. The CPC is a requirement to undergo a certain amount of work related training in a certain amount of time. It could include drivers hours as you mention, but it doesn’t have to.It could be health and saftey at work, ADR, manual handling, fuel efficient driving the list goes on. Theres no test, just you getting some training. And in your case you plan on paying £500 for it, in my case i’ll get my employer to provide my work related training. Looks like you have a lot to learn
As an agency driver it looks like i have to pay for it myself, after 21 years I learn things all the time and am happy to do so and a lot of it comes from this site, if it means I become better at what I do and more employable then great, i just don’t want to pay for something without there being any benefit just a card that says I can do something Which I already do.
I can set your mind at rest there Mike, you dont get a card. You just get to keep your licence if you do it, if you don’t do it you won’t be working In theory it should drive wages up a bit, wether it works in practice remains to be seen but i reckon you won’t get such a glib attitude from employers who have paid to train you i.e if you won’t do it then there’s the door, they may have to engage themselves in management skills !! But thats just my guess.
I understand it’s a legal requirement if you want to work, i’m sure you get a card which looks similar to the digi card with your photo on it? anyway anything that improves our lot is to be welcomed, these vehicles and the goods they carry ain’t cheap if they were mine I would like the guy at the helm to be good or better than good.
mike68:
Nope leave it as it is, it’s not perfect but it works fairly well, as drivers we do too many hours anyway, but we do a lot less than other countries where there is no legislation. Just sit down go through it and it really is quite simple and the digi card makes easier too (Still miss winding it on nine hours for a night out with the lads though)
Which countries have no legislation Mike?
Anywhere outside the E.U and most of the developing countries.
Non EU European countries have legislation, they use our old rules and call them AETR.
Listen stop ganging up on me! There’s some poor bugger going down the road right now i don’t know where but he is, with no tacho, no maintainance contract bald tyres, overloaded with a container full of much cheapness.I don,t know where but somewhere.
Coffeeholic:
Non EU European countries have legislation, they use our old rules and call them AETR.
Listen stop ganging up on me! There’s some poor bugger going down the road right now i don’t know where but he is, with no tacho, no maintainance contract bald tyres, overloaded with a container full of much cheapness.I don,t know where but somewhere.
mike68:
Listen stop ganging up on me! There’s some poor bugger going down the road right now i don’t know where but he is, with no tacho, no maintainance contract bald tyres, overloaded with a container full of much cheapness.I don,t know where but somewhere.
LOL !! We’re trying to get your post count up Mike !!! I’m off to bed
mike68:
Listen stop ganging up on me! There’s some poor bugger going down the road right now i don’t know where but he is, with no tacho, no maintainance contract bald tyres, overloaded with a container full of much cheapness.I don,t know where but somewhere.
LOL !! We’re trying to get your post count up Mike !!! I’m off to bed
14357 and 4577 o.k i
know when i’m beat “better to stay silent and let everyone think I’m a fool than to open my mouth and remove all doubt”
