I got caught behind an accident on the A1 last night, when I joined the queue I had 1`hour left on a 15 hour spread (I would have made it back to the yard at that). Eventually got off the A1 at Boroughbridge and followed the A168, first layby appears at 15 hours and 45 mins I jumped in and had a night out there. I wanted to know how far over your time have people gone? I was going to try and get to Wetherby Services, I think that would have taken at least another 30-45 mins! Would that have been accepeable to VOSA, a 16.5 hour day to get to reasonal parking?
God this has been covered so many times, if you really need to go past your 15 hrs it should be to find the first available safe place to park, and no 16 1/2 hrs wouldn’t have been acceptable.
Fileep:
I got caught behind an accident on the A1 last night, when I joined the queue I had 1`hour left on a 15 hour spread (I would have made it back to the yard at that). Eventually got off the A1 at Boroughbridge and followed the A168, first layby appears at 15 hours and 45 mins I jumped in and had a night out there. I wanted to know how far over your time have people gone? I was going to try and get to Wetherby Services, I think that would have taken at least another 30-45 mins! Would that have been accepeable to VOSA, a 16.5 hour day to get to reasonal parking?
I would have pressed on to Wetherby (as long as it was feasible that you COULD have reached there if there had not been a hold up) and wrote on back of card/printout " Held up RTA, stopped at first available SUITABLE secure park facility" As I personally do not consider a lay by a SUITABLE o/n parking place.
As you know anything over your 15 is naughty, however in the Vosa sanctions policy they can give you some leeway (up to an hour) as long as it’s once a blue moon, I wouldn’t want to push my luck by going over that. Don’t forget to do your printout(s) and do the necessary on the back.
If you only do UK work then it’ll be ok now and again.
As long as you make a note on a printout or diary it keeps you legal.
Office pen pushers will tell you different, But Vosa are pretty fair. They have to prove that you don’t care about the rules, That you were recless and wilfully broke the rules before they can fine you or take you to court.
The foriegn police/vosa equivelent don’t work like that. They’ll often give out fines when you’re perfectly legal.
bald bloke:
God this has been covered so many times, if you really need to go past your 15 hrs it should be to find the first available safe place to park, and no 16 1/2 hrs wouldn’t have been acceptable.
The EU rules say that it’s to the first suitable stopping place, however VOSA own publication says different (and unbelievably) seems to incorporate some common sense, having said that if you get an arsey plod/vosa, going to 15.01 might not be acceptable and you may drive away (possibly after 45 hours) with at the very least a verbal warning.
I don’t think VOSA would have any problem with it at all - Provided your written entry (made on reaching the safe stopping place, of course) clearly included the fact that it was the first suitable, safe place, and the reason(s) for this.
bald bloke:
God this has been covered so many times, if you really need to go past your 15 hrs it should be to find the first available safe place to park, and no 16 1/2 hrs wouldn’t have been acceptable.
Well, I supposed I asked the question has it’s never happened to me before! Please excuse me!
Anything is acceptable. You could go four hours over the 4.5 if you were in, say, a 15 mile queue behind a motorway accident, provided you stop at the first available place and you write your sob story out on the printout or rear of the analogue chart.
Of course, whether some French or Spanish copper would see it the same way is a different matter. 
Fileep:
Would that have been accepeable to VOSA, a 16.5 hour day to get to reasonal parking?
No as that’s just taking the ■■■■ as you stated you went past a lay by earlier on
I think it would have been acceptable for you to head for the services, but it might depend on what VOSA bod stops you. But in any case you could argue in Court that you have no facilities in a Layby and I know some companies where the load isn’t insured unless it’s parked over night in what is considered a suitable parking place. And for some bazaar reason they think that MSA’s are suitable. 
I always worked to the principle that a layby was NOT a suitable stopping place and would always carry on the the next MSA or base whichever was nearer.
But never had to worry about foreign plods either!
(and just to be extra safe, all the laybys I passed were full).
I know I’m getting boring on this subject on this and other threads 
, but I don’t give a ratsass 
so here goes…,If you all refused, as I do, to MAKE DO with o/n parking in ■■■■ ■■■■ stinking, rat infested, crime laden, unsuitable for purpose lay bys, with yer mirrors pulled in , it would send out a message to powers that be, that it was no longer an option for them to ignore the present o/n parking situation in the UK, and provide us with basic human conditions… but won’t happen will it
robroy:
I know I’m getting boring on this subject on this and other threads
I don’t think it will make a blind bit of difference to those in power if truck driver didn’t use layby’s. On some of the services now you can hardly park after 5pm and truck end up on the entrance and exit.
Have they found more space? Nope they’ve put signs on the entrance and exit saying no parking.
The only way it might change is when insurance companies refuse to insure loads park in laybys over night.
The regulations say that you can carry on to the first suitable stopping place, personally I don’t regard a lay-by as a suitable parking place if I’ve no food or washing facilities so I’d have carried on, and I would expect VOSA to be understanding about it.
mickyblue:
Fileep:
Would that have been accepeable to VOSA, a 16.5 hour day to get to reasonal parking?No as that’s just taking the ■■■■ as you stated you went past a lay by earlier on
Thats why I stopped in the first layby, available! although I was happy staying in a layby, some other drivers don’t find these a suitable place to stop. Fair play to them, I think if I wanted to argue the point that if I needed toilet facilities then I could have pressed on.
Just to add something , if you do that and run over your time make sure you take a printout for the run over just over 1 minute after you have stopped and wright on back of the two copy’s one for you and one for the company. and then in the morning when you put you mode to work take another two printout to explain the insufficient rest you had, as 16.5 and 9 don’t go into 24 hours.
tachograph:
The regulations say that you can carry on to the first suitable stopping place, personally I don’t regard a lay-by as a suitable parking place if I’ve no food or washing facilities so I’d have carried on, and I would expect VOSA to be understanding about it.
THIS^^^^^^^^^
You all gotta stop ■■■■■■■ yourselfs with worry about what VOSA are going to do about running over your hours! A stinking laybye is not a SUITABLE parking place…just crack on and stop worrying. 
If I was ever “fined” for such a situation Id make ■■■■ sure Id have my day in court to argue the toss on this one!
delboytwo:
Just to add something , if you do that and run over your time make sure you take a printout for the run over just over 1 minute after you have stopped and wright on back of the two copy’s one for you and one for the company. and then in the morning when you put you mode to work take another two printout to explain the insufficient rest you had, as 16.5 and 9 don’t go into 24 hours.
You should remain on “rest” for at least 9 (or 11, if you have already had your permitted reduced daily rests for that week) hours. Yes, this means that your start time for the following day(s) will be later than planned, but the emergency/unforseen event is long gone by then. If your load(s) need to be rescheduled or trans-shipped then so be it.
msgyorkie:
tachograph:
The regulations say that you can carry on to the first suitable stopping place, personally I don’t regard a lay-by as a suitable parking place if I’ve no food or washing facilities so I’d have carried on, and I would expect VOSA to be understanding about it.THIS^^^^^^^^^
You all gotta stop ■■■■■■■ yourselfs with worry about what VOSA are going to do about running over your hours! A stinking laybye is not a SUITABLE parking place…just crack on and stop worrying.
If I was ever “fined” for such a situation Id make ■■■■ sure Id have my day in court to argue the toss on this one!
just found this on the web
ec.europa.eu/transport/modes/roa … e_1_en.pdf
- A transport undertaking must plan carefully a driver’s safe trip foreseeing, for instance, regular
traffic jams, weather conditions and access to adequate parking places, that is, it must organize work in
such a way that drivers are able to comply with the Regulation and should take into account the
requirements of shippers and insurance companies concerning safe parking are satisfied.- A driver must rigorously stick to the rules and not deviate from driving time limits unless
exceptional circumstances occur unexpectedly and it becomes impossible to comply with the
Regulation without endangering road safety, the safety of persons, the vehicle or its load. If a driver
decides that it is necessary to derogate from the Regulation and that this will not jeopardise road safety
he/she must indicate the nature and reason for derogation manually (in any Community language, on
the record sheet or on the print out from the recording equipment or on the duty roster) as soon as
he/she stops.- An enforcer must apply professional discretion when controlling a driver and assessing whether the
departure from driving limits is justified.
When assessing the legitimacy of the deviation on the basis of Article 12 all circumstances must be
examined carefully by an enforcer including:
(a) a history of driver’s driving records to establish the pattern of driver’s performance and verify
whether the driver normally complies with driving and rest time rules, and that the deviation is
exceptional;
(b) the deviation from driving time limits must not be a regular occurrence and must be caused by
exceptional circumstances such as: major traffic accidents, extreme weather conditions, road
diversions, no place at the parking area, etc. (This list of possible exceptional circumstances is
only indicative. The principle for assessment is that the motive of possible deviation from driving
limits must not be known or even possible to foresee beforehand);
(c) daily and weekly driving limits should be respected, hence the driver should not have any ‘time
gains’ by exceeding driving limit in search of a parking place;
(d) the deviation from the driving time rules must not lead to a reduction of the required breaks,
daily and weekly rest.
Comment: European Court of Justice, Case C-235/94