i am basing all my posts on Rog example of a 4 on and 2 off shift
Sun & mon off
Tue, wed, thu & fri annual leave
Sat & sun off
trucknetuk.com/phpBB/viewtopic.p … =0#p533007
and in the shift Rog use the driver would be back at work on Monday as that would be when he works as the 4 on 2 off shift cycle starts and that’s all i have being trying to get across
if you look it does straddle two weeks that all i have being trying to explain
there are a load of possible ways of look at it with the regs but if you read just this bit
Week: is defined as the period between 00.00 hours Monday and 24.00 hours on the
following Sunday.
Note: You should only input 48 hours for one week of leave that starts / finishes 00.00 on
Monday morning. Any other period of 7 consecutive days (e.g. Wednesday to Tuesday)
should be worked out on a daily basis).
and then look at the example you will i hope see why i have being going on for ever and a day about it
tachograph:
delboytwo:
you leave as to start Monday and you have to be off on leave till Mon
Without wishing to get into a discussion on the meaning of the word “leave” I’d say the leave does start Monday Del, if fact I’d say the leave starts when you finish work on Friday.
Monday to Sunday is 7 consecutive days leave and 4 days holiday 
Agreed, although I think if someone asked Rog’s imaginary worker what he was doing next week the reply would be something along the lines of, ‘I have the week off’ or ‘I am on holiday.’ It wouldn’t be, ‘Well I am off on Monday then on leave Tuesday to Friday then another couple of days off Saturday and Sunday.’ 
delboytwo:
i am basing all my posts on Rog example of a 4 on and 2 off shift
Sun & mon off
Tue, wed, thu & fri annual leave
Sat & sun off
trucknetuk.com/phpBB/viewtopic.p … =0#p533007
and in the shift Rog use the driver would be back at work on Monday as that would be when he works as the 4 on 2 off shift cycle starts and that’s all i have being trying to get across
if you look it does straddle two weeks that all i have being trying to explain
Only because ROG isn’t very good at examples, the first Sunday was surplus to requirements in that bit. The whole week from Monday to Sunday contains no work so is 48 hours.
delboytwo:
there are a load of possible ways of look at it with the regs but if you read just this bit
Week: is defined as the period between 00.00 hours Monday and 24.00 hours on the
following Sunday.
You mean the bit you are routinely ignoring?
delboytwo:
Note: You should only input 48 hours for one week of leave that starts / finishes 00.00 on
Monday morning. Any other period of 7 consecutive days (e.g. Wednesday to Tuesday)
should be worked out on a daily basis).
and then look at the example
Yep, books his scheduled working days as leave and does no work between 00:00 Monday and 24:00 Sunday? That would indeed be a weeks leave which begins at 00:00 Monday.
You really aren’t reading or understanding this bit properly, it’s only a bit of advice not a part of the actual regulations. What it says is that if the leave results in a period of 7 days which cover a calendar week then that is a whole weeks leave of 48 hours. However if the leave results in a period of 7 days which begins in one calendar week and ends in another then the leave days are counted as 8 hours each. That applies irrespective of how many days of their annual leave the employee had to book to get that period of 7 days.
Note: You should only input 48 hours for one week of leave that starts / finishes 00.00 on
Monday morning. Any other period of 7 consecutive days (e.g. Wednesday to Tuesday)
should be worked out on a daily basis).
i have being going on for ever and a day about it
[/quote]
Have you? Didn’t notice.
ROG:
I made the difference between 48 and 32 as 16 hours which could be significant in some cases.
But not in the case of your 4 on 2 off driver in your original question. For most of his rota he will be clocking 50 hours a week, 5 days in most weeks with 9 hours driving and 1 hour other work each day as you detailed. Even if he has to book 48 hours he is 2 hours up on the deal.
When you posted about being canny and saving hours you are forgetting that regardless of which way it has to be booked most drivers will not be losing up to 16 hours but will be actually saving as in their normal working week they are likely to be doing 48 hours or more…
as you say you don’t worry about WTD so why should i
just a point i have and done the shift in question and when i put a request for leave and only have 4 days off the leave would only be counted as days even though all week was off the input system would only count the days that i actually would have worked that week and cos the days were 4 the company never did me for it and as the time sheet was given to me to sign for the hours worked and if i had been a way all week cos the shift took Tues as my start day
and my supervisor said this is the best way to have holiday cos you could in fact have 5 weeks leave off but only use 20 days holidays
and when you input the working week you have letter for each thing you do
IE working day was WD day off was DO and leave was L and B/H was for bank holidays S for sick day anf M for days that do not count for WTD
and at the bottom the totals were there how many hour worked how many hours left in the reference period
just like to add lets say you book the 4 days holiday and the WTD guy booked it as a week 10 weeks weeks later you as you boss how many days holiday have i left the boss say 15 you have have a week all ready cos you booked it as a week not days how would you stand on that
just to add
if you work a 5 day week you get 20 leave or 4 weeks
if you book a week leave you would have 15 days left
if you book 4 days and count as a week you would have 3 weeks left
if you book 4 days and count it as days you have 16 days left
i know which i would want
Del what you book for the WTD has little bearing on what you book with your employer for holiday.
If you normally got paid for 12 hours per day would you expect only to be paid for 8 hours on days that you booked 8 hours for the WTD because I’d certainly expect to be paid the correct daily holiday rate for the 12 hours.
delboytwo:
as you say you don’t worry about WTD so why should i
just a point i have and done the shift in question and when i put a request for leave and only have 4 days off the leave would only be counted as days even though all week was off the input system would only count the days that i actually would have worked that week and cos the days were 4 the company never did me for it and as the time sheet was given to me to sign for the hours worked and if i had been a way all week cos the shift took Tues as my start day
Just because the company system couldn’t deal correctly with the WTD doesn’t make the way they did it right. The way companies do things isn’t always correct, some still say you must have 30 minutes break before 6 hours for the WTD for example.
delboytwo:
and my supervisor said this is the best way to have holiday cos you could in fact have 5 weeks leave off but only use 20 days holidays
That’s nothing whatsoever to do with the WTD, that is simply one of the benefits of a days on/days off system over a Monday - Friday one.
it looks like we will never agree or and by the way i could post more and more links and cut and paste all day but i think the glues got to me
Coffeeholic:
delboytwo:
yes cos you are doing something that i want to do 
and that is work and i am very jealous of you 
Don’t be mate, I have put my notice in and won’t be there much longer.
not being nosey why, well i am really
delboytwo:
Coffeeholic:
delboytwo:
yes cos you are doing something that i want to do and that is work and i am very jealous of you
Don’t be mate, I have put my notice in and won’t be there much longer.
not being nosey why, well i am really
Personal reasons, not work ones. It looks like I will be moving away from the area and it will be too far to commute.
ok mate sorry to here that i did know from some of your posts that you liked the job very much here’s hoping that you fined something quick when you move not like me, today its being one year without work and still not fined anything not for that fact of trying up to 300 letters and 100 apps in this year alone plus cold calls to many of them its just so depressing out there for a driver i go flipping burgers but tryed that and there did not evern get an interview,
delboytwo:
ok mate sorry to here that i did know from some of your posts that you liked the job very much
Best job I’ve ever had.
delboytwo:
here’s hoping that you fined something quick when you move
I have one definite job offer, but not decided yet whether to take it, and one other offer depending on a couple of other factors so I think I will be OK.
delboytwo:
not like me, today its being one year without work and still not fined anything not for that fact of trying up to 300 letters and 100 apps in this year alone plus cold calls to many of them its just so depressing out there for a driver i go flipping burgers but tryed that and there did not evern get an interview,
Sorry to hear that, hope you get sorted soon.
Sorry to hear this Neil, but at least it seems like you’ve got something lined up 
Don’t give up Del you never know what’s round the corner, in my experience jobs like most things in life have a habit of cropping up out of the blue when you least expect it, so keep trying and in the mean time you’ve got plenty of people here to argue with
Good luck to you all
thanks guys for the kind works of support much appreciated
i think if i did not have trucknet i think my life would be very boring and as you say a good argument lets of some steam