Very thought provoking article here…
libertarianview.co.uk/curren … able-doubt
Extract…
COUNT ONE — VERDICT: GUILTY
“The woman said she was aged seven or eight when she queued to get an autograph from Harris at a community centre in Hampshire in 1968 or 1969. When she reached the front of the queue, Harris had touched her inappropriately with his “big hairy hands”, she told the jury.
The court heard that no evidence could be found that Mr Harris had been at the community centre. He also showed his hands to the jury and denied they were hairy.”
When they say that no evidence could be found that Mr Harris had been at the community centre, they don’t mean a cursory glance turned nothing up. They searched local newspaper archives between January 1967 and May 1974, council records and even conducted letter drops appealing for witnesses. Nothing, not a single piece of independent evidence that he was ever there!
It is hard to see how the uncorroborated recollection of an event alleged to have happened 45 years ago, when the witness was eight, can constitute proof beyond reasonable doubt.
Harry Monk:
Very thought provoking article here…
libertarianview.co.uk/curren … able-doubt
Extract…
COUNT ONE — VERDICT: GUILTY
“The woman said she was aged seven or eight when she queued to get an autograph from Harris at a community centre in Hampshire in 1968 or 1969. When she reached the front of the queue, Harris had touched her inappropriately with his “big hairy hands”, she told the jury.
The court heard that no evidence could be found that Mr Harris had been at the community centre. He also showed his hands to the jury and denied they were hairy.”
When they say that no evidence could be found that Mr Harris had been at the community centre, they don’t mean a cursory glance turned nothing up. They searched local newspaper archives between January 1967 and May 1974, council records and even conducted letter drops appealing for witnesses. Nothing, not a single piece of independent evidence that he was ever there!
It is hard to see how the uncorroborated recollection of an event alleged to have happened 45 years ago, when the witness was eight, can constitute proof beyond reasonable doubt.
Not only that, I also read about a woman unable to sleep in darkness, she has to sleep on the sofa with the lamp and TV on and she attributes this to Rolf Harris pinching her bum in 1978 (or whenever)
Funny how it took well over 30yrs for her to reveal the ‘true’ reasons behind it.
They tried the same stuff on DLT and Freddie Starr and nothing came of it, funny how the sordid accusations were front page news, but the story of their innocence was on page 28.
There’s a rumour that the cast of the black and white minstrel show are all up on race hate charges next, well the white ones are anyway…
newmercman:
There’s a rumour that the cast of the black and white minstrel show are all up on race hate charges next, well the white ones are anyway…
Only after they’ve nicked the entire cast of this clip first. 
youtube.com/watch?v=_MYOonR_2ao
newmercman:
Not only that, I also read about a woman unable to sleep in darkness, she has to sleep on the sofa with the lamp and TV on and she attributes this to Rolf Harris pinching her bum in 1978 (or whenever)
Seems a bit far-fetched to me too. I went to school at a time when corporal punishment was still widespread and teachers would regularly assault pupils with a variety of objects, including heavy leather belts. It doesn’t happen now, but as they say, the past is a foreign country. If having your arse thrashed with a leather strap by a middle-aged pervert doesn’t lead to lifelong trauma then it’s hard to understand how having it briefly touched does, especially when the practice was considered so unremarkable that it formed a staple joke in Carry On films, Are You Being Served etc.
I can’t help wondering if it’s possibly about the free money that seems to be on offer to the “victims” here?
Agreed Harry, plus it works both ways as just imagine the number of teenage lads who were subjected to quite serious ’ ■■■■■■ abuse’ from much older women working in factories and mill’s etc but if they dared to complain to the bosses would just be ridiculed even more. Most folk who knew Rolf Harris admit that he was very ‘touchy feely’ in his manner but surely that doesn’t constitute assault unless applied to certain areas of the body, if it does then there must be hundreds of folk quaking in their shoes? 
Pete.
Harry Monk:
I can’t help wondering if it’s possibly about the free money that seems to be on offer to the “victims” here?
Or maybe the ‘free money’ on offer to encourage the ‘victims’ to help with the ‘charges’ is just another part of a different establishment agenda.In which firstly it’s all about the ‘age gap’ not the actual age of the ‘victims’ and the establishment then using all means at it’s disposal to fit up the so called ‘suspects’.With examples like turning the idea of someone who obviously fancied 18 + year old birds into someone who supposedly molests 7 year olds.Or sending Jeremy Forest to jail for years for something that the law and society probably wouldn’t have even bothered about ‘if’ he’d have been under 20 or at least under 18.
Which leaves that question of who really believes that the establishment was sniffing around the 15 year old Diana Spencer household to fix up Charles with her sister.
I regularly got a thrashing at school (surprisingly enough) a bit ironic really as it was mostly for fighting. Their thinking being “It’s wrong to fight so I’m now going to give you six of the best across the back of the legs to show you that violence is wrong”
That was at junior school as well, even the dinner ladies would slap you on the arse for playing up. At senior school it was different, I went to an all boys grammar and the class system was in full swing there. As the son of a lorry driver off a SE London council estate I didn’t quite fit in with all the posh kids from Kent. Needless to say there were fisticuffs involved and the first time (within a month of starting) I was on the receiving end of a right hander, my retaliation was a little bit better than the first punch thrown so I was up before the head, I got a thrashing and was suspended for a fortnight. The other (posh) kid got off with no punishment at all.
Now we had a teacher there who was a proper raving iron, he ran the “Railway Club” which used to go all over the place on train journeys. A recurring theme was a trip to a swimming pool or the seaside and individual changing rooms were not a big feature of those trips. Everybody at that school knew that this teacher was messing about with some of the boys, yet they did nothing about it. He even had a gang of boys that used to hang around at his house at weekends and stay overnight.
Talk about double standards, a yobbo like me was dealt with in a zero tolerance way, yet a teacher who was quite openly messing around with teenage boys was all brushed under the carpet!
He later got nicked and locked up, but that was around 20yrs after I left the school.
That kind of stuff was going on at schools and church groups all over the country, but it was all man/boy stuff, it was far worse than a bit of slap and tickle and yet very few have had their collars felt over it. Seems to me that the likes of Rolf Harris are only getting nicked because they were ‘messing about’ with girls and not boys.
Carryfast why do you harp on about Jeremy Forest? He was a teacher poking a pupil from his school. Are you saying that’s acceptable?
newmercman:
I regularly got a thrashing at school (surprisingly enough) a bit ironic really as it was mostly for fighting. Their thinking being “It’s wrong to fight so I’m now going to give you six of the best across the back of the legs to show you that violence is wrong”
That was at junior school as well, even the dinner ladies would slap you on the arse for playing up. At senior school it was different, I went to an all boys grammar and the class system was in full swing there. As the son of a lorry driver off a SE London council estate I didn’t quite fit in with all the posh kids from Kent. Needless to say there were fisticuffs involved and the first time (within a month of starting) I was on the receiving end of a right hander, my retaliation was a little bit better than the first punch thrown so I was up before the head, I got a thrashing and was suspended for a fortnight. The other (posh) kid got off with no punishment at all.
Now we had a teacher there who was a proper raving iron, he ran the “Railway Club” which used to go all over the place on train journeys. A recurring theme was a trip to a swimming pool or the seaside and individual changing rooms were not a big feature of those trips. Everybody at that school knew that this teacher was messing about with some of the boys, yet they did nothing about it. He even had a gang of boys that used to hang around at his house at weekends and stay overnight.
Talk about double standards, a yobbo like me was dealt with in a zero tolerance way, yet a teacher who was quite openly messing around with teenage boys was all brushed under the carpet!
He later got nicked and locked up, but that was around 20yrs after I left the school.
That kind of stuff was going on at schools and church groups all over the country, but it was all man/boy stuff, it was far worse than a bit of slap and tickle and yet very few have had their collars felt over it. Seems to me that the likes of Rolf Harris are only getting nicked because they were ‘messing about’ with girls and not boys.
What seems to be happening is a combination of an anti age gap agenda in the case of heterosexual relationships together with a policy of those on the wrong bus looking after their own.
Having been unlucky enough to be sent to an all boys secondary school I’ve always had my doubts as to how and why such a system was arrived at,at decision making level.
While at that time,at least in the working class comprehensives for the 11 + failures like me ,it was more about who was lucky enough to be getting the young available girls in the time left to look for them.Not how old those looking for them happened to be and in which we probably would have been competing with our teachers for the girls in their charge if only we’d have been lucky enough to have been in a mixed school. While ironically in the 1970’s at least the teachers would probably have had more chance of pulling the girls in their charge than anyone of their own age.No doubt helped by the environment in which the establishment wanted a teenaged bride for Charles and obviously pushed that agenda at that time rather than the anti age gap one now.
However it seems obvious that those who arranged the former would eventually start branding the latter as the perverts.While looking after each other.
bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-20251939
thetruthisnow.com/headlines/ … ed-by-mi5/
newmercman:
At senior school it was different, I went to an all boys grammar and the class system was in full swing there. As the son of a lorry driver off a SE London council estate I didn’t quite fit in with all the posh kids from Kent.
Very similar to my own experiences, except that I grew up on a council estate in NW Kent and went to a grammar school in SE London. Still, it was made clear that poverty wasn’t welcome at their school. 
When I look back at some of the teachers, and the way they used to summon the same children to pull their trousers down, bend over and prepare for an arse-thrashing, week after week, I see it as it actually was.
Most of them seemed to prefer blond boys, luckily I have mousy hair although I did have my bum thrashed by “Sir” for doing absolutely nothing at all on many occasions, as did everybody else. Where do I sue? 
The Duke of Edinburgh was interested Princess Elizabeth when she was 14 years old.He wont be getting his collar felt.Prince Charles had to have a young bird as the future Queen had to be a virgin at that time.
Cotswoldcrunch:
Carryfast why do you harp on about Jeremy Forest? He was a teacher poking a pupil from his school. Are you saying that’s acceptable?
The reason why I’ve referred to the Jeremy Forrest case is because I think his ‘penalty’,as opposed to his ‘conviction’,was based on an ageist agenda which had more to do with his age not the girl’s.IE are you saying that if it had been a bloke of her own/close age would have received the same penalty in the same circumstances ?.I think the same ageist agenda is what is behind at least some of the ‘issues’ in the cases of the celebrity trials like DLT and Jim Davidson.IE establishment,and as a result societal outlooks,have changed massively regarding age gap heterosexual relationships.
As I’ve said elsewhere,having known a serving copper who’d knocked up a relative when she was 15 and contrary to him being sent to the nick,he ended up with a good wife and family and she ended up with a good husband and father to her children,I think the ‘penalty’ in the Forrest case was harsh and not justice.
As for the rules regarding teacher and pupil relationships,such as the one between Clive and Jess Richards.
westbriton.co.uk/Marriage-dr … story.html
They are yet more pc bs that didn’t exist in the days being referred to here.While the two tier age of consent laws,based on the so called ‘position of trust’ issue,is just a Trojan horse,as part of an agenda,to eventually bring the UK into line with US federal law.In which there’s effectively one law,regarding the age of consent and/or penalties,in the case of under 18’s and another for over 18’s.Which will probably inevitably be increased in the long term to the point where it effectively outlaws age gap relationships.Which,make no mistake,is one of the main aims of the agenda behind many of the celebrity trials.
Looks like somebody knew something…
youtu.be/EkzxGr4Yx8U
I remember in the 70s at school, we used to sneak up on the girls in our form and unclip their bras, or put our hands round their front shouting waheyy, or a pencil prodded up their arse when they bent down. If it was today we would be expelled, put on a ■■■■■■ assault charge, be all over the local paper and sent to an institution for corrective counselling.
If I was rich and famous that last statement would probably have me sued and eventually jailed by the same girls today 
.
I am not counting the kiddy fiddlers here but as someone said how can Rolf Harris or, DLT, Jim Davidson, Ken Barlow, Freddie Starr and the like be judged on something that happened in a much different era to todays PC/BS society.
By the way unfortunately the girls at my school did NOT look like the “schoolgirls” on that youtube George Cole video somebody put on , I would have loved to have gone to that school 
robroy:
I remember in the 70s at school, we used to sneak up on the girls in our form and unclip their bras, or put our hands round their front shouting waheyy, or a pencil prodded up their arse when they bent down. If it was today we would be expelled, put on a ■■■■■■ assault charge, be all over the local paper and sent to an institution for corrective counselling.
If I was rich and famous that last statement would probably have me sued and eventually jailed by the same girls today .
I am not counting the kiddy fiddlers here but as someone said how can Rolf Harris or, DLT, Jim Davidson, Ken Barlow, Freddie Starr and the like be judged on something that happened in a much different era to todays PC/BS society.
By the way unfortunately the girls at my school did NOT look like the “schoolgirls” on that youtube George Cole video somebody put on , I would have loved to have gone to that school
Trust me if you’d have had the misfortune to be sent to an all boys school the idea of being in a place full of birds where you could unclip some bras and check out their measurements with the hand test would have been like heaven. Although as I’ve said what I remember of the times it would have involved a fight with the teachers as to who got at them first.
Which might explain why some rumoured plans to sell off the local all girls school and then merge it with ours was cancelled. 
It looks Rolf might be able to change his plea to that of insanity and walk away, after reading today that Fatty Veltz has said he molested her too, surely there could no more concrete proof that the man is insane and not in control of his faculties than to have a desire to interfere with her
I hope the powers that be recover the dossier that the late Geoffrey Dickens MP had compiled on all the weirdo’s. How strange that Leon Brittan was Home Secretary at the time. 
mazzer:
It looks Rolf might be able to change his plea to that of insanity and walk away, after reading today that Fatty Veltz has said he molested her too, surely there could no more concrete proof that the man is insane and not in control of his faculties than to have a desire to interfere with her
Linda Nolan is also in the papers saying that she was got at too.Reading between the lines of her complaints as usual it’s all about the age thing with comments along the lines of it’s disgusting to think that the first bloke who ever kissed her was a an ‘old man’ of 44 blah blah.Then the usual bs that she didn’t say anything because he was a celebrity.When the fact is,at the time,no one would have given a zb about his age and it’s that change in establishment and societal outlooks which is the main agenda that’s pushing the issues in such cases.
