Reduced Daily Rest

I would suggest that we are looking at this from the wrong direction.

Whilst there is not anything specific as to whose decision it is as to whether 9 hours or 11 hours is appropriate, there are specific responsibilities under the Health and Safety at Work Act, which requires every employee to consider the safety of themselves or others. Surely being instructed to commence work when not having had sufficient (worthwhile) rest would not be considered lawful?

There is also the HSE booklet, Driving at Work, which covers this, and many other, considerations. Whilst it is only guidance, it is certainly ‘fuel’ for any argument.

As regards LAW on the subject per se. Whilst there is a ‘stated case’ on the subject of driving when unfit through tiredness, it is some years old and without access to PNLD, I can’t readily find it. (Note to self - blag my mate’s access code from him. :open_mouth: )

However, what I can find HERE, on the CPS website is a reference to it as in…

There are decided cases that provide some guidance as to the driving that courts will regard as dangerous and the following examples are typical of what we are likely to regard as dangerous driving:
· racing or competitive driving;
· speed, which is highly inappropriate for the prevailing road or traffic conditions;
· aggressive driving, such as sudden lane changes, cutting into a line of vehicles or driving much too close to the vehicle in front;
· disregard of traffic lights and other road signs, which, on an objective analysis, would appear to be deliberate;
· disregard of warnings from fellow passengers;
· overtaking which could not have been carried out safely;
· driving a vehicle with a load which presents a danger to other road users;
· where the driver is suffering from impaired ability such as having an arm or leg in plaster, or impaired eyesight;
· driving when too tired to stay awake;
· driving a vehicle knowing it has a dangerous defect;
· using a hand-held mobile phone or other hand-held electronic equipment when the driver was avoidably and dangerously distracted by that use;
· reading a newspaper/map;
· talking to and looking at a passenger where the driver was avoidably and dangerously distracted by that;
· selecting and lighting a cigarette or similar in circumstances when the driver was avoidably and dangerously distracted by that.

It is not necessary to consider what the driver thought about the possible consequences of his actions: simply whether or not a competent and careful driver would have observed, appreciated and guarded against obvious and material dangers.

Add to that the new offence of Corporate Manslaughter, and it is then a short hop and a skip to argue that if an employer ‘procured’ an employee to work whilst unfit in such circumstances, and it resulted in a death, then perhaps they need to develop a taste for porridge. :wink:

Maybe what i should clarify first is the fact that i dont even want nights out (ive done my share over the years) Whilst there are drivers on our company who beg for extra nights out, and there are more than enough drivers to carry out the work, i feel that if theyre going to be akward to me, in trying to give me extra nights out i dont want, then i can be just as akward. I am sure i read somewher on a Vosa Tacho Leaflet somewhere that it is a drivers right as to whether to reduce or not, and so i would justify myself that if they gave me that particular job, i could at least quote the fact that im taking an 11 hr rest and not 9. I still believe that there is a tight schedule in the running time to maidstone, but couldnt know for certain until ive at least tried the journey for myself. The parking will be in Stroud at the customers premises, where we will drop an empty trailer, park up and then pick up the pre-loaded one in the morning. These trailers are fridges, so no problem there, not that im worried, cos it aint my diesel, and it aint my goods, so unless the company supply the relevant security devices, you can all help yourself, so long as i dont get hurt.
Am i being akward, i suppose so, but when they tell me to do that job, i will at least have the courtesy to tell them my feelings about it, and let them judge and do what they will. We employed a fleet engineer a few months ago, and he in turn assisted the T/M and agreed that it was madness to give a driver nights out when he didnt want them, and also madness not to give nights out to those who did, but i did persevere and agreed to 1 night out a week, he however has since been sacked.

if they want you to do nights out and ask you say to them “i cant but i think… is looking for nights out.”

obviously you will need to see if the others want nights out or not or if they have enough hours to do the jobs but if i was a gaffer i wouldnt have a problem with that, but i would if you just said no straight away.

keep smiling mate, i’m sure all will be good in the end (unless you drive a truck for a living! :laughing: :laughing: )