Political discussions...

As a recommendation for a book…no…
I am currently reading Rory Stewart’s “Politics On The Edge”.

I have heard him on the podcast he does with Alastair Campbell, as well as having been aware of him in his career with the Tories, including standing for leader. It seems to be much more than an auto-hagiography (is that a word?) and looks, admittedly through only one set of eyes, at the Tory party, Parliament, and the country as a whole.

Whether or not anyone agrees with his particular politics he is taking a look at where we are as a nation, as an (ex) MP who came into the HoC after a life outside of the journo/politico mess.
Well worth a few hours read.

quote Zac.‘‘There are far more interesting, and more genuine, politics going on right now, such as the new “workers rights act”, and how this could actually make it harder for new pass drivers to get a start in our industry.’’

I saw something on the news (BBC btw😄) about this, but not looked at it in any great depth yet.

Got to say full marks to them btw (for once) if this is a genuine entity rather than a damage limitation/pr stunt, (jury out,.still.dont trust them)

Workers rights have declined so much over the years…but mainly because of workers own faults, and their servile "Take anything that is dished out with no question or resistance’’ attitude…especially in this industry.:roll_eyes:

I saw a few employers on the news last night belly aching about it, my initial thoughts were ‘If you treated your people fairly in the first place, there would ne no need’'…so suck it up.

I personally have been on both sides of the fence but when I employed drivers I did not f.them about,.and I treated them like grown ups, to which they reacted accordinglly and I had little to no probs with them…and that is what employers fail to see, they reap what they sow.

I heard the zero contract sh was being scrapped, and ‘fire and re.hire’ on an inferior contract scam, nothing wrong with that.
I’ve yet to look at the rest of it, but fairness to working people is fine in my book…but I’m sure as hell betting nothing will change in this cluster ■■■■ of an industry…in fact drivers being drivers would even be stupid enough to sign another ‘opt out’ agreement if asked.:roll_eyes::joy:

So how do you reckon it will affect new starters in this job
Genuine question btw…I aint got an argument lined up.:joy:

Nowt wrong with giving new employees more protections like minority groups have had from day one for years, rather than having to serve 2 years before gaining full employment rights.

Did I also hear that SSP is to be paid from day 1 now?
I know SSP is derisory rate, but the increase will be better than nowt.

I’m just waiting (in vain) for a new ‘Driver’s rights’ bill, …the right to park overnight at all times with basic facilities to start with.

All those empty promises last time by the Tories when it was highlighted on MSN.
This party is meant to be primarily for workers apparentlly…(sorry I’m just stifling a laugh😂) …so I’ll keep waiting
Under no illusions btw.:roll_eyes:

Personally, I believe many employers, certainly in this game, will become more reluctant to give newbies a chance. I don’t think it will be too hard for you to picture this based on your experience in running a transport operation.

Newbie comes to you desperate to get a start, you’re in an upbeat mood and think “Yeah, we all need someone to give us a chance, to get that experience.” Based on how he presents, you decide to give the guy a chance.

First week out he bashes the wagon, perhaps multiple times. Following week he’s mouthing off at one of your long-standing customers, not following instructions on the client’s site. Customer phones you up to complain about the new lad. “What’s the matter Rob? Could you not find any proper drivers?”

You have a word in the ear of the new lad, expecting a bit of “Sorry boss, I’ll do better next time”, but instead you get a whole load of “entitled” BS and “neebody telt me nowt, it’s not my fault”.

He’s harming your small but formerly well-respected business that you’ve bust a gut to get up and running, putting in countless hours, effort and hard cash into the company.

Now you’re regretting your decision to give the guy his first chance, you might now find it hard to get shot of him, but you still have to let him back into one of your wagons. You’re having disturbed sleep at night, worrying what bucket-nut is going to do next, your stress-related ulcer starts playing up, and you’re beating yourself up thinking “I’m too nice for my own good, this is what I get for giving someone an oportunity”

Next day some other newbie turn up at your site, because newbie 1 has been talking online, claiming you’re happy to take on new passes.

What are you likely to do with newbie 2?

I don’t think the proposed law is so strong as to put off employers that much.
It is up for discussion, but there will be a 9 month period when new employees are on trial.
At the moment there is a 2 year period, but if an employer can’t evaluate someone in 9 months then are they actually looking at them?

Quote- “We are also bringing in a new statutory probation period for companies’ new hires. This will allow for a proper assessment of an employee’s suitability for a role as well as reassuring employees that they have rights from day one. We will consult on the length of the period; the government’s preference is 9 months.” What does the Employment Rights Bill mean for you? - GOV.UK

As I read it, in the first 9 months you will not sacked for supporting the wrong football team, but will be sacked for crashing trucks or being rude to clients.

More rights for workers, but not a free ticket for idiots.

As ever though the devil will be in the detail.

I’m reminded of a FB thread earlier this week: short version is that a driver wrote off a vehicle, inside the two year period, then still within this two year period, had “an episode” where he apparently lost consciousness while driving, crashed, writing off the second vehicle, almost killed himself and other road users.

The father of this driver, full of fury, posted online this week that his son been sacked.

Half the respondents to the thread are saying this is unfair dismissal, he should take the company to court and sue them, ACAS will help :roll_eyes:

I’m willing to bet this haulier would be put off by the proposed new laws.

That says more about F-book than the law though, surely?

Currently, if a driver is asked to summat “a bit dodgy” and refuses to fly too close to breaking the law or if actually worrying about being tired they can be sacked, up to two years into a job, with little/no reason given.

On some newbie threads many of us base advice on how long someone has been in a job, because a bad boss has too much leverage.

Hopefully the legislation will drag the bad employers up to the level of the decent ones.

Ok, it’s a long time since I employed somebody, but does the (was it 3 months?) probationary period not apply now?
Also worker’s rights or not, if somebody is bloody useless and/or totally incompetent and incapable of doing the job, surely an employer is in his rights to dismiss him…do these new regs actually prevent him from doing that?

Edit : Forget I asked :smiley:…just read Franglais’ post.

Current rules allow for six different categories of “fair dismissal”, one is redundancy and one is retirement, so really there’s only four options. Lack of capability is one of the four, so having “vehicle incidents” is a valid reason for dismissal, and this guy fits that bill sufficiently.

It’s the fact that numb-nuts on FB think that it is unfair to sack someone after they have trashed two vehicles, and may have revealed they have a medical condition that will remove their entitlement. I find that greatly concerning, and I would expect the same concern from a potential employer.

True, I am not an employer, but I look after transport operations for operators who contract with me, so I’m the one that looks after the drivers activities, so my concerns are no less than an employers concerns would be.

From personal experience, I was TM where there was a newish driver (less than six months time in) who caused about £10,000 damage to a one-year old truck. He’d mounted the kerb with his offside wheels, hit a metal handrail by some steps, and crashed into the low wall beyond it, smashing all the lights on that side and destroying the air dam and other plastic parts, as well as the lower part of the driver door - which as a seperate panel was now hanging off.

All he did was stick his head into the weighbridge and say he’d “had a bump”, then drove the vehicle to it’s pre-arranged inspection. I got the inspection report online the next morning, having been told nothing about this “bump” which he had not reported to the management.

Speaking to one of the directors later I found out that was not the extent of his lack of capability: “Hmmm… Maybe we should have sacked him when he ran out of fuel…” A few weeks earlier, he’d ignored the warning lights on the dash, driven past at least three fuel stations suitable for HGVs, and whilst in the process of overtaking another truck had ran out of fuel in the outside lane of a duel carriageway.

Some of the guys from the yard went out to rescue him with a load of jerrycans full of diesel. Far from looking embarassed or ashamed, he laughed “Haha, that’s why I got sacked from my last job”

When he was told he was being dismissed he complained that no one had told him he needed to report the accident and it wasn’t his fault that he’d ran out of fuel because he “just didn’t notice” the lit up dashboard.

I’m not in favour of legal changes that might delay an operator being able to get rid of a driver like that.

Talk about a convoluted reply above, when the new protections for new workers are in force an employer will still be able to sack an incompetent worker. Potential employers have nothing to worry about on that front, the changes are not being brought in to protect a useless f***wit employee who can’t do the job, they are being brought in from day 1 of employment to have the right not to be unfairly dismissed.

I daresay Novara Media is not viewed by many people here? I do dip into it sometimes.

Anyway they have looked at (another) interview Johnson did recently (he is selling a book, did you guess?) for “Diary of a CEO” podcast. Since it was a two hour interview there was ample opportunity for inserting a foot into the mouth, and Johnson obliged.
No need to watch all the two hours, as NM have looked at and commented on a bit of it.
I find that I do agree with the criticism of the way things are run as “old boy clubs”.

Aaaand purely in the interests of balance it’s important to show that hypocrisy and outright lies know no political hues.

So what is your point on droning on about, and raking all this old stuff up constantly?
I keep teling you most people already realise and agree the guy aint 100% genuine and tells lies…so where exactly are you going with this?
I know I tend to bang on about a lot of samey stuff, but at least it is about current problems and issues…
This thing with BJ that can be only be described as ‘current’ because he is hawking out his book.

All you are doing is inadvertently helping him sell it.
I mean if only one member on here has gained an interest because of your obsession with him, you have done just that !..
In fact you know what?.. I may even buy it myself, because anything that greatly annoys people like yourself is going to be attractive for me…
So cheers well done, …
In fact I’m going to get right on Amazon now ONLY because of this thread, and the attraction YOU have generated, and I will even send you proof of purchase.:joy:
So thanks for drawing it to my attention.

You drone on and on about Johnson and the Tories when there are an abundance of real important and current issues going on with this present govt…but you pretend they aint happening.

I put a vid on here about the UK being hailed as a dumping ground for illegal trash, all you felt fit to post was some half arsed and smart arsed vid, ironically and groundlessly implying that I had the same dubious ‘qualities’ as yourself,…(which incidentally I have metaphorically marked down as an insult,:smile: ) of being servile and brainwshed to an Orwellian degree…in a 'Hey kettle,.I’m pot…your’re black…BLACK ? :scream:There ya go you can also call me racist again ! :joy:
Anyhoo thanks again for the book review.:+1:

I didn’t recognise him there in a cheap suit and economy glasses.
Must be an old vid.:joy:

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Lol, and there’s more… Minister of Transport has put her foot in it, £1 billion of foreign investment now in jeopardy.

Why?
What happened?

So the political ditching is still going on
Fact nobody cares
Fact it’s always been the same
Fact they are and have always been before you were born being in for what they can get
Fact there is nothing that can be done about it we are just ants filling there pockets, they have control
Fact your thoughts or opinions mean nothing to anybody, unity rules and only changes minority things just to let people think they make a difference

Google must be delighted with certain people taking in by hearsay
One expert thinks he’s an expert carryfast, the other thinks he’s expert called the other fellow W

Then you have the expert x transport manager who thinks he’s a independent self employed expert on everything about anything and working for everyone and has some great fantasy storys

Love to here the conversation in a pub environment, hang on let me Google that before i answer you

Don’t hang back princesses keep the mature conversation up, if you had any respect before for yourself its well past being worried about that
What is a concern is to see people going from senceabilty to utter stupidity and thinking there opinion means something, have a think about that

I know it’s a new website that’s changed but never expected to see the likes of this take over the whole website

If the truth be told its more than likely a personal vendetta between the two people trying to be carryfast and mr W

Well thanks for the input…not easy to follow, but I think I get the jist,.and I’m sure you tried your best.

Not sure which one of them you refer to is me, but let’s suffice to say I am an expert in everything.:sunglasses:
Cheers.

:joy::joy:

Sorry what part of the world are you from i didn’t know you couldn’t read English my apologies