A mate of mine was arrested before Christmas on suspicion of theft of a canoe that he found in a hedge & put on eBay, the police questioned him & said they were going to caution him for theft by finding , they also asked about other stuff he sold on eBay (which was not stolen ) they bailed him until 16th Jan so they could do further investigating, they havnt done a thing, not contacted any of the people he gave them names of regarding other stuff.
They also searched his house.
he turned up for bail to be told the officer was not available to deal with it as he had gone off shift at 4pm, the time he made the bail for, he asked if anyone was going to deal with him or if he was going to be rebailed , they said no but could he come back tomorrow if its convenient , he told them it wasn’t , to which they said we will have to get the officer to call you , he’s since had some missed calls from unknown number he assumes to be him & an answer message asking to call him , as far as he’s concerned he turned up for bail & wasn’t given a rebail date to return ,he logged his attendance with the 101 number who were disgusted by the officers actions or lack of,he also made a complaint ,I’ve told him he needs a solicitor.
Anybody know a bit about the law?
i dont get this theft by finding thing , we has a load of stuff dumped at the back of our house , under it was some silver , now i cleared up the rubbish at cost to me , but i had to had the stuff worth $ in , by rights i should of had it to cover costs
Theft by finding is simple, you know the stuff isn’t yours therefore it’s dishonestly in your possession. You have to take ‘reasonable steps’ to locate or alert the owner.
Theft is; Dishonestly appropriate (have) property belonging to another with the intent to permanently deprive.
you need to tick each of those 5 boxes for the offence of theft to be complete.
Dishonestly - you know the canoe is not yours not withstanding the fact it’s in a hedge
Appropriate - you have the item in your possession
Property - It’s a canoe, a tangable item therefore is property
Belonging to another - It’s not yours therefore it’s someone else’s
Intent to permanently deprive - You took no steps to locate or alert the owner - you intended keeping it
The OP’s ‘friend’ has ticked all 5 boxes thus the offence of theft is complete and they were quite rightly arrested for it.
Although it has to be said, I am suspicious of ‘my friend said…’ type scenarios as it’s quite possible the ‘friend’ has embelished, exagerated or slanted the facts to suit their agenda, or even downright lied about it.
well your mate was stupid!! what he should of done was reported what he had found, then if no one claimed it in so many days it would of become his to legally sell, now he could end up with a criminal coviction for handling stolen property which would not go down well with any future employer, wether you find something under a hedge or on the street it is someone property and as such unless you go through the proper system you leave yourself wide open
Theft is to ‘permantley deprive’.
Even if you took stuff out of a skip, its still theft.
Theft by finding?, you find a wallet with money in it, you keep the money=theft by finding.
The canoe didn’t sell so when they came to him about he still had it, he gave it back & explained how he came about it, he pulled it from the under growth & rubble, it had been there for quiet some time ,it wasn’t on or near any property , he co-operated with them & then they arrested him & said its theft by finding , when he went back he wasn’t going to accept the caution but they weren’t there deal with him anyway … I’ve just spoken with him & he said at around 1130 last night he heard a knock on his door , he got up & looked out the window to see the police walking away from his house …
kemaro:
, when he went back he wasn’t going to accept the caution but they weren’t there deal with him anyway … I’ve just spoken with him & he said at around 1130 last night he heard a knock on his door , he got up & looked out the window to see the police walking away from his house …
Basically yes he still is under caution even though he has answerd bail & conditions set out at the time of de arrest, there isnt much you can do with theft by finding its a offence "in the eyes of the ecilop “police” unless the copper is a complete ■■■■ i carnt see a summons given unless he has a good old past record for theft etc then they may give intent for court procedings to him,
the saying possesion is 9/10th of the law is a load of cobblers
He’s not a thief , he’s never stolen a thing , he’s not been in trouble before, its just a genuine case of picked up what he thought was an old abandoned canoe but it seems the police want to do him for it, a caution for theft by finding is as good as admitting you stole it & will be on your police record , he didn’t steal it so why should he accept it …they should of been there to deal with it on the 16th or had something in place for a rebail …surely
I am not saying he is a bad person, he’s just fallen foul of the law.
In the eyes of the law, he is a thief.
I’m sure we have all picked up things and kept them.
I reckon the CPS won’t even run with it.
How did plod know about the canoe? was it stolen in a burgalary?
It was seen on eBay then reported as stolen, police had a copy of the eBay page , he found it a couple miles from where he lives , they also had all his eBay info & questioned him on other items which included a boat he sold previously, which wasn’t stolen but they wanted to know how he got that so he told them from a farmer & gave hue name & number, they said they’d check it out but havnt yet ,
He said he’s not accepting the caution so they will have to charge him with theft and produce a case for court , but since turning up for bail he has not spoken to the officer
If he saw the police walking away from his door, he should have knocked on the window, or opened the window and told them to hang on a minute, that may have sorted out the bail conditions. At court, i would ask if the owner of the canoe has been found, and how come it ended up in a hedge, under rubble and grass or whatever, and not claimed by the owner, unless they saw it on fleabay, then reported it. Unfortunately, as the law stands it is theft by finding, same as anything else, and the best thing is to go to court, explain the circumstances, get a fine, end of, only outcome is a record, but it will also show theft by finding, which is not so bad anyway…good luck to him.
Apparently It was seen on eBay then reported as stolen , technically he hasn’t breached his bail conditions as he turned up at the specified date & time at the station , it was there he was told the officer had finished his shift at 4 ,even though it was that officer that made the bail date for 430 back in December , he asked if it was going to be dealt with or if he was going to be rebailed for a later date & they just shrugged their shoulders & said the officer would have to call him , he then left under no conditions & no date to return …he is going to speak to citizens advise in the morning , &e cant afford a solicitor & works so not entitled to legal aid …
kemaro:
The canoe didn’t sell …he still had it,… he pulled it from the under growth & rubble, it had been there for quiet some time ,it wasn’t on or near any property ,
So the canoe, was in space… just floating … How could it not be on any property ■■?
He is guilty.
Guilty of being Naive.
Guilty of theft ‘by finding’
Was it originally his ? did he purchase the canoe ? or make the canoe himself ? NO
He found it.
It is not crime of the century, but could come back to haunt him in a future CRB type check…
He needs proper legal advice, and VERY quickly.
Us Trucknet lot, are not lawyers, the guy is in trouble and needs this sorted ASAP
He has a solicitor , the police have said that the canoe , with a value of £20 was on the outskirts of the outer boundry of the property, a police term for it being in a hedge , anyway they are going to charge him as he would not accept caution, a case will be made for cps so , solicitor said it is not in the public interest to pursue
kemaro:
anyway they are going to charge him as he would not accept caution, a case will be made for cps so , solicitor said it is not in the public interest to pursue
Ummm, very interesting. He didn’t accept the caution, (which presumably the police would have preferred) and now it seems prosecution isn’t in the public interest…
I’m definately no lawyer, but MAYBE in not accepting the caution he will get off
