Just a general question, not really related today’s work.,
What was best ? Peaje all the way ? Big guns big costs ? Straight coach style driving ?
Or slow gentle roads more Tyres crap fuel returns ?
I know that nowadays there isn’t that choice, owing to weight limits etc…
Any opinions welcome both tear arse drivers or scenic ones, also same question to old operators and owner drivers ?
Although having never done international going by what I saw on regular private trips in the day more trucks used the non motorway routes in France and Italy at least for obvious reasons.While ironically they seemed to be happier to totally ignore non motorway speed limits as opposed to the ridiculous motorway limits.On that note it wasn’t unusual to see trucks using the French RN’s at UK type motorway speeds for example.While others rightly often used the un tolled at that time Belgian and German motorway routes.
Carryfast:
Although having never done international going by what I saw on regular private trips in the day more trucks used the non motorway routes in France and Italy at least for obvious reasons.While ironically they seemed to be happier to totally ignore non motorway speed limits as opposed to the ridiculous motorway limits.On that note it wasn’t unusual to see trucks using the French RN’s at UK type motorway speeds for example.While others rightly often used the un tolled at that time Belgian and German motorway routes.
obvious reasons apertaining to the fact that they never built a baghouse on a motorway?? 
dieseldog999:
Carryfast:
Although having never done international going by what I saw on regular private trips in the day more trucks used the non motorway routes in France and Italy at least for obvious reasons.While ironically they seemed to be happier to totally ignore non motorway speed limits as opposed to the ridiculous motorway limits.On that note it wasn’t unusual to see trucks using the French RN’s at UK type motorway speeds for example.While others rightly often used the un tolled at that time Belgian and German motorway routes.obvious reasons apertaining to the fact that they never built a baghouse on a motorway??
Tolls. IE unlike the traffic calmed over regulated modern day roads of France why would anyone spend loads of money to use the autoroutes when trucks were running at 65 mph + on the RN’s. 
Tubbysboy:
Just a general question, not really related today’s work.,What was best ? Peaje all the way ? Big guns big costs ? Straight coach style driving ?
Or slow gentle roads more Tyres crap fuel returns ?
I know that nowadays there isn’t that choice, owing to weight limits etc…
Any opinions welcome both tear arse drivers or scenic ones, also same question to old operators and owner drivers ?
Danny,
I’ve never known you, or your old chap Tubby in years long ago, to use any road anywhere where it was not possible to keep the throttle firmly embedded in the floor !!!
And that pretty much refers to whatever you were driving at the time be it truck, car, motorbike, Tesco trolley etc etc.
Another thing, dunno if the same rules still apply now ?, but i could never understand why if you were running Camion Exceptional in France, you were restricted to using the A/National roads which run through the various towns/ villages rather that the main Autoroutes/ toll roads ■■
Such was the wisdom of the Frog…
Steve…
Carryfast you never ran the SS roads in Italy unless you had lots of time, it was Autostrada all the way if possible, it was possible to use the Autostrada for free, or so I’m told [emoji13] [emoji13]
newmercman:
Carryfast you never ran the SS roads in Italy unless you had lots of time, it was Autostrada all the way if possible, it was possible to use the Autostrada for free, or so I’m told [emoji13] [emoji13]
To be fair in the case of Italy I was referring more to the domestic traffic rather than international and domestic in France.On that note they weren’t running those rhd rear steer contraptions to spend most of their miles on the numerous motorway options running the length and width of the country.While no surprise that situation never existed so much in Sardinia with,unlike the main land,more trucks using the Sardinian ‘autostradas’ than single carriage SS roads. 
In which case absolutely those heavy lumbering heaps maintained nothing like the speeds found on the French RN’s.Although ironically they both presented a similar hazard regards overtaking with a car.Usually lots of long heavy slow moving drawbars in Italy with few places to safely overtake them.As opposed to 90 mph + speeds needed to create a decent speed differential on the RN’s creating the situation of 180 - 200 mph closing speeds when traffic was overtaking fast moving trucks in both directions.Especially in the case of those gutless high geared 4 cylinder Citroen and Renault heaps so loved by the Frogs that took all day to reach sufficient speed usually all done on the wrong side of the road and sometimes leaving just the option of someone having to take to the verge and risk hitting a tree or a head on. 
Happy days.
I used to run the national roads in France whenever time allowed, to answer the OP it was six of one, half a dozen of the other when it came to costs, you used similar fuel in total as the mileage was often less than the Autoroutes, wear and tear is subjective, if you’re hard on a lorry then you’re hard on a lorry and if you drive it properly then the choice of route had no effect. Of course back then due to le petit cafe, we never had the time constraints of running legal, so the choice was there. I ran the RNs for the simple reason that it was more enjoyable than following the big blue line on a map and the food was better, I could get from Calais to Cenis/Frejus for a whopping FF6, but if I was in a hurry then it was the super slab every time.
Italy was different, I once ran to Ancona on the SS9 Via Emilia and the SS16, I fancied it because I heard about the famous Via Emilia and although I’m glad I did it, I would never do it again, it took forever!
Years ago we used to argue about the best route in an artic from Calais to Tours. You could either take the motorway all the way, via Amiens and Paris; or you could go cross country using the ‘nationals’ via Abbeville, Rouen, Evereux, Chartres, and Vendome (a lot of that route is duel carriageway now, but it wasn’t then). The latter route had no tolls, but involved lots of roundabouts and villages with a few hills. At the time we were on North Africa work so the loads were fairly light (garments / textiles). Other drivers and I did all sorts of sums, factoring in wear and tear. In the end there was really almost nothing in it AT THOSE WEIGHTS. The Rouen route was stuffed with excellent Les Routiers opportunities. I loved that option - it was much more interesting to drive and I knew every bump and twist of it. However, when I was doing general haulage, I was very aware that fully-freighted all those traffic lights and town streets made a significant difference to fuel-consumption, tyre wear and driveline wear so I usually went on the autoroute when heavy. Cheers, Robert
Hello All. We used to run down the Italian coast from Livorno Through to Napoli, after the two Northern drops ( Aviano and Vicenza) avoiding the booths on the Autostradas. A fastish route, beautiful views, oh! and lots of ladies standing by bonfires. Autostrada over to Bari, then Brindisi and back, then weekended in Naples. Once tipped, find the fruit farm for collection then Motorway dash back to London or Dublin. There was no Autoroute from the bottom of Mt. Blanc to Macon. Also before Aosta had a Vet inspector we ran to the Menton - Ventimiglia border. A long way round if your first drop was Aviano close to the Yugo border. Jim.
M&C steve:
Tubbysboy:
Just a general question, not really related today’s work.,What was best ? Peaje all the way ? Big guns big costs ? Straight coach style driving ?
Or slow gentle roads more Tyres crap fuel returns ?
I know that nowadays there isn’t that choice, owing to weight limits etc…
Any opinions welcome both tear arse drivers or scenic ones, also same question to old operators and owner drivers ?
Danny,
I’ve never known you, or your old chap Tubby in years long ago, to use any road anywhere where it was not possible to keep the throttle firmly embedded in the floor !!!
And that pretty much refers to whatever you were driving at the time be it truck, car, motorbike, Tesco trolley etc etc.
Another thing, dunno if the same rules still apply now ?, but i could never understand why if you were running Camion Exceptional in France, you were restricted to using the A/National roads which run through the various towns/ villages rather that the main Autoroutes/ toll roads ■■
Such was the wisdom of the Frog…
Steve…
Steve,
You are correct, the old man never even knew there were national roads !! When I had my own lorries I hardly ever used them either, as generally in too much of a hurry…
I may be wrong, but I think the reason convoi exceptional have to run on nationals is because the can’t fit through the Peaje booths…
robert1952:
Years ago we used to argue about the best route in an artic from Calais to Tours. You could either take the motorway all the way, via Amiens and Paris; or you could go cross country using the ‘nationals’ via Abbeville, Rouen, Evereux, Chartres, and Vendome (a lot of that route is duel carriageway now, but it wasn’t then). The latter route had no tolls, but involved lots of roundabouts and villages with a few hills. At the time we were on North Africa work so the loads were fairly light (garments / textiles). Other drivers and I did all sorts of sums, factoring in wear and tear. In the end there was really almost nothing in it AT THOSE WEIGHTS. The Rouen route was stuffed with excellent Les Routiers opportunities. I loved that option - it was much more interesting to drive and I knew every bump and twist of it. However, when I was doing general haulage, I was very aware that fully-freighted all those traffic lights and town streets made a significant difference to fuel-consumption, tyre wear and driveline wear so I usually went on the autoroute when heavy. Cheers, Robert
Robert
That route was part of me thinking when asking the question, I used to use it when driving for mckellars but never truly understood why when heavy we were sent that way.
As you say a nice interesting drive and good food. But a proper pain in the rear if late on a Saturday night and trying to get to Calais,
Carryfast:
dieseldog999:
Carryfast:
Although having never done international going by what I saw on regular private trips in the day more trucks used the non motorway routes in France and Italy at least for obvious reasons.While ironically they seemed to be happier to totally ignore non motorway speed limits as opposed to the ridiculous motorway limits.On that note it wasn’t unusual to see trucks using the French RN’s at UK type motorway speeds for example.While others rightly often used the un tolled at that time Belgian and German motorway routes.obvious reasons apertaining to the fact that they never built a baghouse on a motorway??
Tolls. IE unlike the traffic calmed over regulated modern day roads of France why would anyone spend loads of money to use the autoroutes when trucks were running at 65 mph + on the RN’s.
nah…tolls dont come into it as there factored into the trip expenses…its baghouses,pubs,and grub that was always the deciding factor…if your on trip money,then its flat to the mat anyway with your pocket deciding what to drive on…always a more refreshing drive with a full tummy and empty gonads…plus you could aways dry your washing at one of the ladies bonfires for the 4 mins you would have stopped…
Tubbysboy:
robert1952:
Years ago we used to argue about the best route in an artic from Calais to Tours. You could either take the motorway all the way, via Amiens and Paris; or you could go cross country using the ‘nationals’ via Abbeville, Rouen, Evereux, Chartres, and Vendome (a lot of that route is duel carriageway now, but it wasn’t then). The latter route had no tolls, but involved lots of roundabouts and villages with a few hills. At the time we were on North Africa work so the loads were fairly light (garments / textiles). Other drivers and I did all sorts of sums, factoring in wear and tear. In the end there was really almost nothing in it AT THOSE WEIGHTS. The Rouen route was stuffed with excellent Les Routiers opportunities. I loved that option - it was much more interesting to drive and I knew every bump and twist of it. However, when I was doing general haulage, I was very aware that fully-freighted all those traffic lights and town streets made a significant difference to fuel-consumption, tyre wear and driveline wear so I usually went on the autoroute when heavy. Cheers, RobertRobert
That route was part of me thinking when asking the question, I used to use it when driving for mckellars but never truly understood why when heavy we were sent that way.
As you say a nice interesting drive and good food. But a proper pain in the rear if late on a Saturday night and trying to get to Calais,
You’re right about Saturdays! IIRC it used, on average to take about 30 mins longer than the autoroute, but if you hit bad traffic on the Periferique or the 104 ring road you could easily waste your peage wonger sitting in traffic! Cheers, Robert
dieseldog999:
nah…tolls dont come into it as there factored into the trip expenses
‘Trip expenses’ still have to be paid out of the total rate for the job.I can only go by what my own eyes saw and in general trucks both domestic and international either avoided the French Autoroutes by using the RN’s or they went through Belgium and Germany at least if transiting France.Bearing in mind that the Paris Macon route was arguably more aggro to get to the Italian border crossings,especially during the holiday season,than using the RN’s via Reims.While running to Spain was a similar situation of many trucks using the western channel crossings and the RN’s through Normandy and South Western France.Eventually resulting in the frogs ‘encouraging’ truck traffic to use the autoroutes through ‘traffic calming’ together with more autoroutes being built and the Germans and even eventually the Belgians going for road tolling of commercial traffic because their roads were being smashed at a faster rate than they could afford to repair them.
As for Italy as I said that was more a case of mainly domestic truck traffic avoiding the motorways not international but probably for similar reasons as in France in large part being avoidance of tolls.
robert1952:
Tubbysboy:
robert1952:
Years ago we used to argue about the best route in an artic from Calais to Tours. You could either take the motorway all the way, via Amiens and Paris; or you could go cross country using the ‘nationals’ via Abbeville, Rouen, Evereux, Chartres, and Vendome (a lot of that route is duel carriageway now, but it wasn’t then). The latter route had no tolls, but involved lots of roundabouts and villages with a few hills. At the time we were on North Africa work so the loads were fairly light (garments / textiles). Other drivers and I did all sorts of sums, factoring in wear and tear. In the end there was really almost nothing in it AT THOSE WEIGHTS. The Rouen route was stuffed with excellent Les Routiers opportunities. I loved that option - it was much more interesting to drive and I knew every bump and twist of it. However, when I was doing general haulage, I was very aware that fully-freighted all those traffic lights and town streets made a significant difference to fuel-consumption, tyre wear and driveline wear so I usually went on the autoroute when heavy. Cheers, RobertRobert
That route was part of me thinking when asking the question, I used to use it when driving for mckellars but never truly understood why when heavy we were sent that way.
As you say a nice interesting drive and good food. But a proper pain in the rear if late on a Saturday night and trying to get to Calais,
You’re right about Saturdays! IIRC it used, on average to take about 30 mins longer than the autoroute, but if you hit bad traffic on the Periferique or the 104 ring road you could easily waste your peage wonger sitting in traffic! Cheers, Robert
Realistically before the A26,A31,A5 etc routes were put in the A6 Calais-Lyon route was often an over loaded traffic clogged nightmare especially around Paris and at Auxerre and Beaune at least during much of the Summer which I can remember avoiding wherever possible.The above links obviously being a game changer like many of the new links put in for traffic heading for Spain.Although even then with a car I still often used/use the Belgian and German routes to Italy rather than France.Where the speed issue has almost made the place a no go area.Almost now to the point where it’s as bad as America IE 120 mph + potential roads with strictly enforced sub 90 mph limits. 
This is a good thread, as it depends on time and the weight of the load.
To list the pros and cons of using the toll road to the RNS, this is what i think of it :
Using the RN, lots of roundabouts with camper vans, caravans, tourists getting lost and dithering, with slow and large agricultural machinery, then you have the wide loads to get stuck behind .
The good thing is more choice of good places to stop and have a good meal , with the Rouitiers and decent truckstops , the chance to go off route and follow the alternative route which are marked up with yellow signs , that take you away from the pinch points and busy intersections .
There was a scenic route i used from Caen which took you through valley gorges , with river rafting and nice camping sites .
The positive points of using the toll are, the tarmac surface is very quiet, it feels like the lorry is floating along, less wear and tear, but checkpoints with the Douanes and Gendarmarie at most peages 24 hours a day .
The toll service stations also offer good value for money meals, and drivers get a discount, by filling in a form at the till, they then post you a loyalty card, in places such as Autogrille .
The RN have weight limits that force you to use the toll roads, so you hop and off the toll, to save money, but lose time doing this .
To get to Italy, i went through weight limits , and never had any bother from the law, once again, stunning scenery from Lons de Saunier to Oyannax .
I saw plenty of EE trucks on this route .
with great reluctance and trepidation I have to ask…so whats your point? if you were in a hurry it was autoroutes and flat to the mat…if you wanted to have the opperchancity of some what more relaxing times,getting grubbed up or amusing yourself with a frolic or 3,then the rn was the nicer option…the op is only asking for opinions. id go for a mixture of both.
Here in Spain all the old nationals are pretty much bypassed now with free new autovias ( thanks Brussels)
Shame really as some of the old places are all shut and abandoned, last week I went down the old n340 to castellon, and torreblanca is like a ghost town, the sol hotel finished and several more closed. It’s been a fair few years since I was down that way and found it a bit sad really.
Even the worst of them all, Gran buffet in Cambrils has gone. I never did like the place, but still seems slightly wrong ?
newmercman:
Carryfast you never ran the SS roads in Italy unless you had lots of time, it was Autostrada all the way if possible, it was possible to use the Autostrada for free, or so I’m told [emoji13] [emoji13]
Nmm you weren’t one of those people who hung around Modena services looking for a Greek heading the other way we’re you?