ok from what i always thought was if you are working anytime between 12 midnight and 4am you can only work the max of 10 hours in that 24 hour period.
is there anyway you can extend the 10 hours or is it 10 hours max ■■
pump:
ok from what i always thought was if you are working anytime between 12 midnight and 4am you can only work the max of 10 hours in that 24 hour period.is there anyway you can extend the 10 hours or is it 10 hours max ■■
With a workplace agreement in place the 10 hour night time working limit becomes obsolete.
By the way, it’s 10 hours working time so it’s 10 hours plus breaks and POA.
what is the workplace agreement ?
pump:
what is the workplace agreement ?
ask your boss or TM they should tell you or try Google
or here /
pump:
what is the workplace agreement ?
where the majority of drivers in agreement with the management agree that the RTD 10 hour night rule can be ignored - it is then ratified in writing
A workplace agreement is an agreement that the workforce have voted on to opt out of the night time working limit.
The Road Transport (Working Time) Regulations 2005 - SCHEDULE 1/Regulation 1
why is it in driving hours rules then if you can just opt out of it?
pump:
why is it in driving hours rules then if you can just opt out of it?
It’s not in the EU drivers regulations, it’s part of the working time regulations.
If you can opt out of something, then no one is ever going to opt-in are they?
Imagine taking a job where the gaffer says “If you don’t sign the opt-out, you won’t get the job” or “sign this Swedish derogation” if you are on agency…
I’ve worked nights for near 25 years, and I’d say over 99% of those shifts were over 10 hours in length, then and now.
Is there anyone here on a flat 8 hour night shift, for which they get paid a full night shift allowance? 8pm-4am would be needed to qualify I believe… Gotta cross the 4 hours of midnight-4am with your shift, so 6pm-2am doesn’t count as ‘nights’, neither does 1am-9am…
It would be damned good value if you think about it, which of course is why it’s as rare as unicorn crap. 
ah ok i get you now. was not 100%sure. i drive a tanker and like to start around 3am when i can.
so i should contact the manager and ask him for a workplace agreement? i know the other lads wont have a issue with the start time.
should i get this in writing or is there a form i have to download?
Winseer:
Gotta cross the 4 hours of midnight-4am with your shift, so 6pm-2am doesn’t count as ‘nights’, neither does 1am-9am…
That’s not correct, if you do any work at-all between 00:00 and 04:00 you are classed as a night worker, so for instance if you work from 20:30 to 04:30 you’re a night worker and subject to the night time work limit.
We’ve kind of met halfway, between 24.00 - 04.00 we do a max of a 12 hour shift.
pump:
ah ok i get you now. was not 100%sure. i drive a tanker and like to start around 3am when i can.so i should contact the manager and ask him for a workplace agreement? i know the other lads wont have a issue with the start time.
should i get this in writing or is there a form i have to download?
I assume you mean that the other drivers will be happy to opt out of the night time limit, you cannot opt out by yourself it has to be a group, a group would be all the drivers at your depot.
The opt out does have to be in writing and lasts for a maximum of five years if my memory serves me correctly.
tachograph:
The opt out does have to be in writing and lasts for a maximum of five years if my memory serves me correctly.
I’m not convinced on that one Tachograph I think it’s negotiable.
bald bloke:
tachograph:
The opt out does have to be in writing and lasts for a maximum of five years if my memory serves me correctly.I’m not convinced on that one Tachograph I think it’s negotiable.
It is negotiable with a maximum lifespan not exceeding five years.
tachograph:
bald bloke:
tachograph:
The opt out does have to be in writing and lasts for a maximum of five years if my memory serves me correctly.I’m not convinced on that one Tachograph I think it’s negotiable.
It is negotiable with a maximum lifespan not exceeding five years.
Yep fair play good call.
Winseer:
If you can opt out of something, then no one is ever going to opt-in are they?Imagine taking a job where the gaffer says “If you don’t sign the opt-out, you won’t get the job” or “sign this Swedish derogation” if you are on agency…
I’ve worked nights for near 25 years, and I’d say over 99% of those shifts were over 10 hours in length, then and now.
Is there anyone here on a flat 8 hour night shift, for which they get paid a full night shift allowance? 8pm-4am would be needed to qualify I believe… Gotta cross the 4 hours of midnight-4am with your shift, so 6pm-2am doesn’t count as ‘nights’, neither does 1am-9am…
It would be damned good value if you think about it, which of course is why it’s as rare as unicorn crap.
we operate under the 10 hour night rule which is mainly trunking from depot to depot, don’t forget there is the gaffers get out of jail free card which is you can still technically work a 15 hour shift with 5 hours of POA on top of it
Winseer:
If you can opt out of something, then no one is ever going to opt-in are they?Imagine taking a job where the gaffer says “If you don’t sign the opt-out, you won’t get the job” or “sign this Swedish derogation” if you are on agency…
I’ve worked nights for near 25 years, and I’d say over 99% of those shifts were over 10 hours in length, then and now.
Is there anyone here on a flat 8 hour night shift, for which they get paid a full night shift allowance? 8pm-4am would be needed to qualify I believe… Gotta cross the 4 hours of midnight-4am with your shift, so 6pm-2am doesn’t count as ‘nights’, neither does 1am-9am…
It would be damned good value if you think about it, which of course is why it’s as rare as unicorn crap.
Wrong - If a mobile worker does any work between midnight and 4am (or 1am and 5am if he’s on the buses) then he is subject to the night work limit of 10 hours (unless there is a relevant workplace agreement in place).
You don’t “sign the opt-out” on starting at a new job - it is agreed between the workforce and the employer (either by union etc representatives, elected workforce representatives or, for places with fewer than 20 workers, by a simple majority vote). As stated by others, such a workplace agreement is only valid for a maximum of 5 years (or shorter period if that was agreed at the time) and then it has to be agreed all over again. The existence (or not) of such an agreement is something to find out about during interviews etc, when you are deciding whether to take the job - in much the same way as you would ask about salary, sick pay and holiday arrangements.
The really sad thing is that this limit is intended to protect the workers’ health, yet in time honoured tradition the truck drivers insist on being allowed to work as many hours as possible in order to keep their hours (on pitiful hourly rates) up. Talk about the race to the bottom…
tachograph:
Winseer:
Gotta cross the 4 hours of midnight-4am with your shift, so 6pm-2am doesn’t count as ‘nights’, neither does 1am-9am…That’s not correct, if you do any work at-all between 00:00 and 04:00 you are classed as a night worker, so for instance if you work from 20:30 to 04:30 you’re a night worker and subject to the night time work limit.
Tell that to the supermarkets. 17:00-01:00 is “days” if you’re not careful to make sure it finishes after 3am to make sure you qualify for “nights”.
Another example would be the Royal Mail shifts that finish at 01:50hrs - they are classed as “lates” regardless of how long the shift is.
Start times after midnight are often classed as “Early Starts”, and paid at a rate somewhat below full-blown nights.
Because everyone has a different definition of what consitututes “night shift” for the purposes of actually paying a premium rate, the whole notion of “limited to 10 hours if you work nights” becomes meaningless…
I can only imagine yards “enforcing” their drivers to “not work over 10 hours on nights” IF the particular firm is very reluctant indeed to pay overtime over and above 8 hours.
In this case, the 10 hour limit is being used as a “cap on earnings” of course…
Imagine palletliner work where you got paid a salary - and were guaranteed to be booking off by 10 hours into a night shift!!!
£500pw (normal palletliner pay) for 5x10hours MAX would be a pretty fair wage. In practice, you’ll be working at LEAST 10 hours per shift, and more often 12-15 hours. I’m talking of Kent firms that run into places like Fradley Park, Burton, & Brum airport here. There are probably some depots around the country that run into the hubs that are less than an hour’s drive out - but of course I am not familiar with any of them.
Unless you have a relevant agreement, workers are limited to 10 hours work (i.e.
working time) over the 24 hour period. As with the other working time limits under
this legislation, breaks and periods of availability are not included in the 10 hour limit.
The 24 hour period is very important, and should not be confused with 10 hours night
work per shift. The 10 hours should be calculated on a rolling basis therefore when
carrying out night work on consecutive shifts a mobile worker’s start time could be
dictated by how much working time they completed in the previous shift.