I’m looking for some advice please…I’m new here so please bear with me!
My wife bought an ex met police 26T Iveco Stralis Horsebox (62 plate) last year and she took it for it’s DVSA test in November where it failed as the third axle was showing no braking. The garage then “took the lines off” somewhere and plugged them into the 3rd axle (rear) and it passed and so the garage then put everything back to the way it was and said they needed to fix the problem as there was no braking on the 3rd axle. Nearly 2 months later they are still scratching their head, so I checked with Iveco and they said as there is no load to the vehicle then the 3rd axle won’t show any braking as it needs about 10T+ load to make it activate. They also said that it would be fine to drive and the garage should have known nothing needed doing and that they were sure there is a special condition for horse boxes that can’t be laden to the required weight to be exempt if the “load sensing valves” can’t be activated due the vehicle being unladen and it not being possible to use a load simulator on a Horsebox.
Is this correct? If not, what are the rules please?
We are just lost with it all as the bill keeps going up and we are getting nowhere and now I am wondering if they have been scratching their heads unnecessarily.
Quickie- as the garage where the rules specifically show your vehicle is exempt and show where it says its okay for your 3rd axle not to show any braking effort. If that is what they have told you, the assume they can back it up so that should cost you nothing.
Is it fair to say you have a current test in the vehicle, but the test was only achieved by doing ‘something’ when it was re-submitted? If they. knew that was what was required, then why didn’t;t they do it the first time? ~did you ask them to do a pre-MOT check or just as them to present it for test?
We in our innocence just turned up at the testing centre and took the failure on the chin, however the test centre is within an hgv garage and they said they would sort it, so they switched some pipes (bypassing the load sensing valves), which in Section 71 of the HGV Testing Manual is allowable and advised (which we should have read beforehand!) and the lorry then passed. They then switched the pipes back to where they originally were, but told us they needed to find our why the 3rd axle brakes weren’t working and fix it. We not being mechanics didn’t know at the time that the load sensing valves only activate the braking system with 10T+ loaded on the rear axles, but it would appear the garage still don’t know as I am still waiting for them to call me back so I can explain this, all I was told today was they are still investigating it by the receptionist so I told her to tell them to stop investigating and call me as I think I may have the answer!!
Sadly not, the garage asked us to leave the initial test results with them and we haven’t seen the ones with the LSV disconnected as not been back to the garage since due to Christmas and my in-laws having dementia and trying to get them in a home before Christmas.
Sorry to hear about your family issues. There is a simple way around the problem of " little or no effort axle 3" for next year with such a vehicle providing there is not anything actually wrong with the vehicle . The fact that you have a ‘pass’ tends to support that there are no issues. If you wish, you could do this soon to set your mind at rest. Buy a couple or three or so old but clean non- hazardous 1000litre IBCs with taps (Intermediate Bulk Containers). Drag them into the back of the body and secure one (optional) at the front of the body and two (or more) over and just behind the rearmost axle with ratchet straps. Then fill each with water. You now have two tonnes imposed on the rear ‘bogie’. Take the vehicle for a good long road test using the brakes frequently, and then to an ATF a few days before the test and have a roller brake test carried out. This should give you readings good enough to pass the test. If not either something is wrong or more likely you need more weight - another two IBCs. Dispose of the water in Dobbin’s drinking trough or however takes your fancy and is legal, then store the IBCs until next needed. Disposal does depend upon what was in the IBCs originally.
Quite honestly the garage should have known that a three axle rigid with a single tyred rearmost axle would be likely to cause a problem if it cannot be presented loaded. In which case they should have carried out a Roller Brake Test before presenting the vehicle for MOT. Of course if that option was offered and you declined then that is down to you.
You can recoup the cost of the IBCs by hiring them out to those in a similar position. Even 7.5 tonne horesboxes can benefit from one IBC secured in the back.
That is exactly what they said “little or no effort from axle 3”.
Sadly my wife, who has had lorries before, just turned up at the testing centre as the Horsebox was an ex met police one (built by Babcock MacNeillies) and only 62 plate and we had used it for 4-5 months to move our horses around and it all seemed absolutely fine, so she just rocked up with me as chief navigator, butty and coffee fetcher. She’s driven HGVs and articulated lorries before and she was happy so so I was!
It came as a surprise that it failed with “little or no effort from axle 3”, but the lorry garage next door said they would sort it by by passing the LSV (or as they described it to me “shifting some pipes around”) and it would pass, which it did. It was only once it passed that they said they needed to investigate why the 3rd axle wasn’t working fully and after 2 weeks they still didn’t have the foggiest as to why so I got Christmas out of the way, the in laws in a home and started to do my own research and having spoken to Iveco and the local builder’s merchants who used Iveco Stralis they both said I would need minimum 10 tonne load over the rear axles to trigger the LSV to work…and I may be an ex prop but even I can’t drag 10 x 1 tonne bags of sand up a horse ramp and into a lorry.
The roller brake test wasn’t offered to us prior to the official test.
Good idea though with IBCs I may get some from a farm sale if they come up.
So, I’m just wondering if I’ve wasted a load of time since it was retested and passed and a heap of cash on some investigative work that didn’t actually need doing!
Out of interest, how many horses was this horsebox designed to carry/ are you expecting it to carry? 26 tonnes seems like an awfully high plated weight for a horsebox given that a thoroughbred horse weighs around 500kg so I’m wondering if removing the third axle altogether and re-plating might be a better approach.
So the garage took steps to pass the test and then returned the vehicle to the way it was?
You have a valid test and a commitment from the garage to find out the score
You appear to have done just that. Tell the garage you will collect the vehicle and pay for the test.
And that’s it. If they are conducting tests they have an obligation to know exactly what is required.
The subsequent work is not required and should not be paid for
For it to fail on “little or no effort” would need the figures to be less than 5 % of the allowable axle weight for that axle . In your case that would be around 350 kg. I have in front of me RBT prints out for a three axle tractor unit, the first of which records a total effort of 150kg for the the middle axle ( essentially a similar situation)and a fail at a routine roller brake test. A couple of days later the trailer was reloaded with an extra 4 tonnes imposed on the tractor unit, the readings for the same axle were then 2000kg. No work whatsoever was done to the tractor unit.
The figures for the roller brake tests should be stored in the RB testing machine’s history. |Ask them to reprint the figures.
The garage do have a duty to ensure that they are not allowing a dangerous vehicle to go on the road. You will have to come to an amicable arrangement with them regarding their investigations. Since you clearly have and needed a vehicle capable of carrying several animals. I would suggest presenting it to them with as many animals as is practicable inside. The DVSA will nor allow the same at MOT
You cant be the only party to have experienced this problem. I would ask around on the horsey forums. When I do football related work I often see the police horse transports and they are more like coaches in outline than lorries or what we take to be horseboxes.
It might just be worth taking it to an Iveco main dealer to get it checked out.
Its obviously been tested successfully on at least seven occasions over the years, and it’s possible that a fault has developed in the system. Something doesn’t seem right when it’s not giving locks when on the brake tester in an unladen condition, and I think that the suggestion that the drive axle needs to be loaded to 10t before the rear axle brakes will work, seems also wrong.
Is it an original build vehicle or a conversion? as some conversions, particularly if they mix steel and air suspension at the rear can be a real bag of trouble.
On the iveco in the dash menus, you should be able to get the rear axle weights displayed, if it less than 10t you could be on to something, then do as cav551 says and get enough weight in (above the rear axles or behind them) there and take it for a roller test, to see if that cures the problem.
I have a 3 axle 26 tonne that if you don’t tell them no park break on axle 3 before the brake test it will default to expecting park brake on all 3 axles. Could it be as simple as that?
Hi, I’m thinking about buying one of these exact boxes. I can see from some online research that there were around 3 or 4 built in this format. Is yours one with the very short overhang and rear steer?