I thought that within 6 hours of working or putting your tacho/digi card in you have to have shown a rest period.
So for example, 6am start, get to drop at 9am and told you will have to wait a few hours before getting tipped. If your still sat there at 12pm on poa you have to show a rest period so you put it on break for 45mins.
You get tipped during you 45 minute rest period so you have so far worked 6 hours.
Leave at 12:45 and head for collection, get there at 5pm so you have worked 4hours 15 mins of your 2nd 6 hour period put on poa as waiting to be loaded. Your nearing the end of the 6 hour period so bang it on break, get loaded and use last hour driving somewhere to park up for the night.
Thats a 13 hour day (excluding unpaid breaks)
Will probably be very obvious to many but where am i going wrong? Is this 6 hour period some ■■■■■ I have made up or misread?
The rest break before 6 hours comes under the WTD not Tacho.
I personaaly very rarely use POA, I stick it on break instead…they both count the same towards your working time anyway (i.e. Zero hours…only other work and driving is counted towards working time)
That way you very rarely fall foul of the WTD rules.
If you dont get paid your breaks use POA , if like me you are paid from start to finish without any hours deducted for breaks then use BREAK
Someone else may be able to explain it clearer though
I’m struggling to work out when you finished, but a 15hr day means a reduced rest of 9hrs which you can only do ( trying to work it out without reading old posts as one day it might sink in) two ( bet it’s three) times in between weekly rest period, the rest of the time you must have at least 11 hours of rest within the 24hr period from when your shift started.
hope thats right
Many people assume it’s a rolling 6 hrs. It’s not. As toowise said there are tacho rules, which are number 1, then this piddly wtd. Assuming you are on a local shunting job and your driving hrs don’t clock up quick, wtd goes like this. Show half hour after 6 hrs work. Then a further 15 mins after 9 hrs work. That leaves you 5:15 duty left. So no need to worry about a further 6 hrs period
Firstly you should understand that nowhere in the regulations does it say you can work 15 hours per shift.
Daily Rest
Within 24 hours from the start of shift you should have completed a daily rest period of 11 hours. This effectively gives you a maximum spread-over of 13 hours from start of shift to the end of the shift.
Three times between weekly rest periods the daily rest period can be reduced to no less than 9 hours.
So no more than three times between weekly rest periods you should have completed a daily rest period of 9 hours within 24 hours from the start of shift. This effectively gives you a spread-over of 15 hours from the start of the shift to end of the shift.
WTD Breaks
No worker should exceed 6 hours working time without a break of at-least 15 minutes.
If your working time is more than 6 hours but not more than 9 hours you should have a total of at-least 30 minutes break.
If your working time exceeds 9 hours you should have a total of at-least 45 minutes.
These breaks can be split into separate breaks of at-least 15 minutes each.
WTD breaks also count as driving breaks where appropriate and vice versa.
In your example you have a 45 minute break at or before 6 hours, so you can drive for another 4½ hours and it also means you can work for another 6 hours before needing another break (driving time permitting), after arriving at your collection you’ve had another break which must have been 45 minutes to reset the driving time again.
You don’t say what time you finished but if it was after 19:00 you’ve used up one of your three reduced daily rest periods.
You cannot legally do 13 hours working time during a shift without a reduced daily rest period and if you are having a reduced daily rest period which could give you up-to a 15 hour spread-over you cannot do 15 hours working time because you would need breaks during that time.
By the way I assume you use POA instead of break because you don’t get paid for breaks?
I would use break rather than POA,using POA can confuse the issue by resetting your driving time to zero,this will cause you lots of grief if you haven’t noted your previous driving time
RACHACE:
So my 4.5 hour driving time does not have to be used within the WTD 6 hour period?
Also the 15 hour shift allows me to take the minimum rest period of 9 hours within any 24 hour period?
In one of your first posts here you say you’ve had class2 for 5 years! How did you manage mate? Anyhow! WTD as above Upto 6 hours on shift 15 minute rest and Upto 9 hours 30 minutes!
Normal shift length is 13 hours with 11 hours daily rest to complete 24 hours!
Extended shift to 15 hours Upto 3 in a working week each with a 9 hour daily rest period!
I’ve already lost the will to live explaining this!
It’s a shambles!
RACHACE:
So my 4.5 hour driving time does not have to be used within the WTD 6 hour period?
No.
If you have a break of 15 minutes before exceeding 6 hours it will also count as the first part of a 45 minute driving break.
RACHACE:
Also the 15 hour shift allows me to take the minimum rest period of 9 hours within any 24 hour period?
A shift if more than 13 hours from start to end will mean you are having a reduced daily rest period whether you want it or not because a shift of more than 13 hours does not allow you to have 11 hours rest period during the 24 hour period from start of the shift.
RACHACE:
I am struggling with working out a 15 hour day.
I thought that within 6 hours of working or putting your tacho/digi card in you have to have shown a rest period.
So for example, 6am start, get to drop at 9am and told you will have to wait a few hours before getting tipped. If your still sat there at 12pm on poa you have to show a rest period so you put it on break for 45mins.
You get tipped during you 45 minute rest period so you have so far worked 6 hours.
Leave at 12:45 and head for collection, get there at 5pm so you have worked 4hours 15 mins of your 2nd 6 hour period put on poa as waiting to be loaded. Your nearing the end of the 6 hour period so bang it on break, get loaded and use last hour driving somewhere to park up for the night.
Thats a 13 hour day (excluding unpaid breaks)
Will probably be very obvious to many but where am i going wrong? Is this 6 hour period some [zb] I have made up or misread?
Kind Regards
Simple Simon
For your example above…As soon as told i was gonna be waiting a couple of hours i would have stuck tacho on break for 15 mins satisfying wtd regs , Then 30 mins before of during tip i would stick tacho on again for 30 min break which resets driving time and wtd.
Thanks all that have commented, especially tachograph.
To the bloke who asked how I have managed considering I have been a class 2 driver for near 5 years.
I know it sounds daft mate but I never had to worry about my driver hours or wtd as every day would be a maximum of 11 hours, now I’m with the big boys I’m going to have to use my hours in the most efficient way possible to earn the most I can in that week and keep my boss off my back.
RACHACE:
Thanks all that have commented, especially tachograph.
To the bloke who asked how I have managed considering I have been a class 2 driver for near 5 years.
I know it sounds daft mate but I never had to worry about my driver hours or wtd as every day would be a maximum of 11 hours, now I’m with the big boys I’m going to have to use my hours in the most efficient way possible to earn the most I can in that week and keep my boss off my back.
Thanks again
if you are really worried, spend 20 odd quid and buy yourself an hour guard, its the best money i ever spent 3 years ago, tells you everything you want to know on the screen,(unless you forget to press the buttons lol) and you will never go wrong, makes life so much easier
I’d say the big mistake here is working for a firm that doesn’t pay for POA.
Some firms don’t recognise POA, meaning you are considererd “on duty other work” when stuck in traffic jams, tip queues, and the like.
It’s a better system though, because at the end of a 15 hour shift where you’ve taken 2x45 minutes of breaks, you’ll get net paid 13.5 hours rather than 10 hours which is what you’d get if the 3.5 hours stuck on the M25 or in a palletline-style tip queue is unpaid.
What’s more, if you only get paid for 10 hours out of the 15 worked, your firm will expect you to work 5 days on the spin like that, calling it 50 hours but actually being near 75 right? They’ve only got to drop you 4 hours in week two on this basis to keep it legal, but at what cost to you?
Then there’s the firms that expect you to be on the back with a pump truck whilst booking the 45.
At least with agency work you can pick and choose which outfits are not worth working for. It’s a bit more complicated if you’ve just signed up for a full time job, and found all that small print crap in your T&C’s! One of the many reasons I left a full time job for agency in the first place!
I finish wednesday of a monday-friday shift, pull my tacho out, and say I’m not working the rest of the week. I’ve done 45 hours, and won’t do 75. As it is, I’m nodding like a dog driving around the M25 near heathrow come 7am thursday morning coming home from some midlands depot!
