Rowley010:
If it happens again I might just pull into services wherever I am just before my time hits 60 hours and phone the office and say right your going to have send the van out with a driver to bring my truck back as I’m at my max working time for the week. They can hardly then tell me to go over can they. They will then more than likely have to pay for parking at the services as it will go over 2 hours. That will make them think twice about putting me on a Friday run where I have to run in Saturday without telling me to give me chance to check how high my hours are for that week.
As long you do not drive the van back as that is also working time
Not obliged by any law, contract or directive to sign anything you don’t want to.
No one has been prosecuted over WTD rulings and I seriously doubt anyone ever will be.
No O licences taken away from yards for blatantly having their drivers “go over” on a regular basis? No drivers dismissed on “too many WTD infringements”?
Sometimes “Driver Prosecution” isn’t actually the worst thing that can happen.
Alternatively, we could get Brexit done and dusted, and kick all these daft EU laws into touch in due course.
Aren’t all those daft EU laws just being copied into UK law by and large. I wouldn’t expect much to change about drivers hours.
I put it on POA or break all the time when I’m sat doing nothing. Just some weeks when you get given 5 or 6 drops every day and maxing your 15s and 13s you might not get much non working time in apart from your 45s. It’s fine until Friday. But then when you get put on a run where your not home without being asked about this ridiculous compulsory overtime that’s when it messes you up when you’ve already done a week with high hours.
But the planners don’t care do they. All they care about is getting the loads out and delivered on time and then not running back empty. If any of that means a driver going over hours they aren’t bothered.
Rowley010:
If it happens again I might just pull into services wherever I am just before my time hits 60 hours and phone the office and say right your going to have send the van out with a driver to bring my truck back as I’m at my max working time for the week. They can hardly then tell me to go over can they. They will then more than likely have to pay for parking at the services as it will go over 2 hours. That will make them think twice about putting me on a Friday run where I have to run in Saturday without telling me to give me chance to check how high my hours are for that week.
As long you do not drive the van back as that is also working time
In theory what am I supposed to do then? Weekended at some services? Or get them to pick me up and bring a driver for my truck?
You need to return to base before running out of weekly time. It’s not rocket science and it’s not your problem if the powers that be introduce laws you are legally required to comply with regardless of however small the risk of being caught is. It’s not unknown for the plods/vosa to have occasional purges on issues that until then they have seemed to be completely unconcerned with. Almost as if they’re lulling people into a false sense of security…then bang! Sometimes I get the impression that these operations are more like a fundraiser…
Rowley010:
If it happens again I might just pull into services wherever I am just before my time hits 60 hours and phone the office and say right your going to have send the van out with a driver to bring my truck back as I’m at my max working time for the week. They can hardly then tell me to go over can they. They will then more than likely have to pay for parking at the services as it will go over 2 hours. That will make them think twice about putting me on a Friday run where I have to run in Saturday without telling me to give me chance to check how high my hours are for that week.
As long you do not drive the van back as that is also working time
In theory what am I supposed to do then? Weekended at some services? Or get them to pick me up and bring a driver for my truck?
As a passenger you can book POA or BREAK which do not count as working time
It is usually the supermarkets who want to ensure WTD are carried out, they want their contractors to follow it and that is why clocking machines were introduced for clocking on and off at break times. It isn’t just about wages, in fact some all singing and dancing clock machines have nothing to do with payroll, its WTD for supermarkets. It is the company’s responsibility to track WTD not the driver. When they know you will or have gone over it they have to show they are complying, hence an infringement been issued. If a union rep is on a site and knows that an employee is over their time, he can send them home. A driver should keep a check on his WTD hours daily as far as breaks go but it is the companies responsibility to track his weekly and fortnightly WTD.
Not obliged by any law, contract or directive to sign anything you don’t want to.
No one has been prosecuted over WTD rulings and I seriously doubt anyone ever will be.
No O licences taken away from yards for blatantly having their drivers “go over” on a regular basis? No drivers dismissed on “too many WTD infringements”?
Sometimes “Driver Prosecution” isn’t actually the worst thing that can happen.
Alternatively, we could get Brexit done and dusted, and kick all these daft EU laws into touch in due course.
Aren’t all those daft EU laws just being copied into UK law by and large. I wouldn’t expect much to change about drivers hours.
Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
Yes, it’s possible that “adherence to WTD laws will be quietly brushed under the carpet”. I’d even say that it’s more likely to be glossed over by the hauliers themselves rather than “repealed” as politicians reckon they are going to do with each and every appended law taken on from the EU at this point.
The question we should all be asking though - is WHO works 60 bloody hours, and then has the rest of their day wasted for no pay at all when they park up and ask someone to come and get them?
What’s breakdown recovery time like when it’s your last shift of the week? - Same answer!
The fact still remains that there are drivers going out of their way to go over 48 hours, because oddly enough - 48 comes a whole shift before 60. If you hit 48 hours on shift 4 - you should REFUSE to work any more shifts in that week. FFS even if you were being paid double bubble for that 5th shift’s hours - you’re still going to get into hot water if you keep doing it week in, week out. The “fall asleep” danger alone should be enough to put you off!
UKtramp:
It is usually the supermarkets who want to ensure WTD are carried out, they want their contractors to follow it and that is why clocking machines were introduced for clocking on and off at break times. It isn’t just about wages, in fact some all singing and dancing clock machines have nothing to do with payroll, its WTD for supermarkets. It is the company’s responsibility to track WTD not the driver. When they know you will or have gone over it they have to show they are complying, hence an infringement been issued. If a union rep is on a site and knows that an employee is over their time, he can send them home. A driver should keep a check on his WTD hours daily as far as breaks go but it is the companies responsibility to track his weekly and fortnightly WTD.
A horrifying step that. Amazing how a “law-enforced break that must be taken” quickly turned into “we don’t pay you for breaks - ever” in the transport industry.
WTD was the same: All it did - was take away our overtime.
We don’t get “extra” for alligning to WTD rules, or any other EU rule come to that.
There are still hauliers out there who think it’s jolly OK to have a contracted driver on more than a 48 hour week as basic! WTF? How can you be given more hours as basic than the average maximum over a reference period? - Because the break hours don’t count. POA don’t count. Travel to and from work don’t count. Stood-down time in the canteen don’t count. TImes you get called at home, and get hung on the phone for an hour - don’t count.
The “thin end of the wedge” a few years on - is now a redwood pine firmly placed some furlong or so inside one’s sphincter in the driving world.
Why can`t you do a print out either daily or weekly,you can keep a check on what your doing yourself,instead of relying on a Management monthly.
At the end of the day its as much your responsibility as managements to control your hours,after all your the one doing the job they only summise that the job can be done legally because the computer says it can.
Rowley010:
I put it on POA or break all the time when I’m sat doing nothing. Just some weeks when you get given 5 or 6 drops every day and maxing your 15s and 13s you might not get much non working time in apart from your 45s. It’s fine until Friday. But then when you get put on a run where your not home without being asked about this ridiculous compulsory overtime that’s when it messes you up when you’ve already done a week with high hours.
But the planners don’t care do they. All they care about is getting the loads out and delivered on time and then not running back empty. If any of that means a driver going over hours they aren’t bothered.
No drivers dismissed on “too many WTD infringements”?
