gingerfold:
The ghost of AEC is apparent in both positive comments about the Volvo and DAF after sales support. Dafaid in this country was set up and run by former AEC people and Volvo also recruited former AEC service engineers for its support service. Of the home manufacturers AEC was way out in front of its competitors for breakdown response times and after sales support, a service that was inevitably trashed with the dead hand of Leyland in control.
Morning all, graham, its really all about “people”. The Importers gave people , (who with a UK manufacturer), would probably never had a chance, the opportunity to get out and “do it”, and they did. DAFaid was a classic example, and it became the operational standard for Europe! In later years I think that Volvo reduced their keenness, may have been the influx of Leyland people!!
Cheerio for now.
gingerfold:
The ghost of AEC is apparent in both positive comments about the Volvo and DAF after sales support. Dafaid in this country was set up and run by former AEC people and Volvo also recruited former AEC service engineers for its support service. Of the home manufacturers AEC was way out in front of its competitors for breakdown response times and after sales support, a service that was inevitably trashed with the dead hand of Leyland in control.
There must have been a time when Leyland offered competitive after-sales service, otherwise it would not have become a successful concern in the first place. I guess my definition of “in the first place” means 1945! Was it a case of vehicles travelling progressively further from their base, and Leyland failing to keep pace with progress, or was it a case of actual deterioration in the service offered?
[zb]
anorak:
gingerfold:
The ghost of AEC is apparent in both positive comments about the Volvo and DAF after sales support. Dafaid in this country was set up and run by former AEC people and Volvo also recruited former AEC service engineers for its support service. Of the home manufacturers AEC was way out in front of its competitors for breakdown response times and after sales support, a service that was inevitably trashed with the dead hand of Leyland in control.
There must have been a time when Leyland offered competitive after-sales service, otherwise it would not have become a successful concern in the first place. I guess my definition of “in the first place” means 1945! Was it a case of vehicles travelling progressively further from their base, and Leyland failing to keep pace with progress, or was it a case of actual deterioration in the service offered?
Before the war we never ran Leyland vehicles, but talking to my dad before he died he told me of the difference between Leyland and AEC on the bus side. Eddie Howe ran buses between 1926 to about 1969 operating the OK service between Bishop Auckland and Newcastle Upon Tyne, in conjuction with Emersons (OK Motor Services Ltd). Howe’s garage was just yards away from ours and our families had been friends, in fact My grandfather taught Eddie Hoe to drive.
Orriginally running RIO busses he started rnning AEC’s in the thirties and with the exception of one Leyland ran 100% AEC till the sixties when he bought three Bedfords. Running hourly between Bishp Auckland the Newcastle frm 7 in the morning till 11-30 at night, seven days a week, busses achieved ncredible mileages. The, AEC’s without exception gave him exceptional service,he never in all those years experienced a break down, even in some cases operating vehicles until they were 12 years old. The one Leyland he boughtnew in about 1937 was completly unrelable and broke down regularly giving him such bad service that he replaced it with a new AEC within two years, so when were Leyland as good as AEC?
I believe Leyland’s reputation stemmed from the early days 30’s/40’s, I once had an old book on Heavy Oil Engines and most of the pictures and diagrams were of Leyland and AEC engines with other companies covering the lighter engines, not a foreigner in site but you wouldn’t expect it from the period the book was written. There is no doubt both these manufacturers along with Foden and a few others had very good sales and reputations overseas, they may just have sat back on their laurels when the Sixties and Seventies approached and the rest is history and many explanations exist as to why.
Regarding Volvo, I presently work with a mate who was once a Volvo workshop foreman in the Northeast, he said they did give excellent after service (in those early days) but alas they couldn’t keep it up, it was becoming expensive, many things were done to try and keep the sometimes less than agreeable owner happy, working long hours, robbing parts from newer vehicles and fitting parts without charge when they clearly should have (Warranty only covered certain items) also at various times new brooms were brought in to tweek the economy and sicken the workforce. Today these Dealerships are shadows of their former selves.
As for AEC, during my time as a young fitter we always seemed to quickly go out and retrieve a stricken motor for repair or attend to it on the roadside or once it got to the workshop, I can’t recall now if there was any 24hr call out the older guys did, we may well of, if we didn’t that would have been the one thing we didn’t do that our foreign competitors did. I can recall one morning a fitter telling us of the job he and another had done the day before way down the country, driving straight down, changing a clutch and back up home, taking turns to drive every so many hours as they were just too knackered to stay at the wheel too long, couple of hours kip and back to work that morning. So British companies did have some sort of allegiance to their customers, of course that’s all out the window today.
Getting back to GUY (this is the GUY thread init!) I recently watched my copy of the World in Action programme Limits of the Law and have to say the GUY Big J, that mainly features in the programme, did look and go well, it was a Caledonian H reg RR powered model and with the spread axle 40ft flat on it (proper roped too)was the epitome of what I found the best about the British commercial scene of those days and the fact that a driver could go from Scotland to Southampton in a shift (not legally of course) speaks more of how our road systems were then rather than the drivers and motors, not a cone to be seen so no holdups, try doing that today!
Claim to fame ,uncle Doug says today he had the 2nd big j 8 wheeler in production but only has pictures of the 6 wheelers!
From the few shots I saw of the Big J 8 wheeler I think they were always single drive using the same hub reduction axle as that used on the tractor units.maybe they did use a double drive but I never saw one.Cheers Bewick.
Mr Bewick ,We ran a GUY 8 wheel d/drive diff lock tipper 150 gardener 6 speed box ,Freg , done us proud it was rolled over back on its feet and oided fueled and back to work ,not over powered but done the job ,a bit of usless info , Cheers Barry
b.waddy:
Mr Bewick ,We ran a GUY 8 wheel d/drive diff lock tipper 150 gardener 6 speed box ,Freg , done us proud it was rolled over back on its feet and oided fueled and back to work ,not over powered but done the job ,a bit of usless info , Cheers Barry
Hiya Baz,so what kind of diffs were in the 8 wheeler,Guy’s own or some other make ? annoying question I agree 
Cheers Mr.Bewick.
The 6 wheeler double d had guy diffs similar to eaton and you could alter 1 gear in the 1st diff to give higher overall ratios of both axles ,the 8 wheeler was a single drive and trailing axle .
Two Eight Wheelers here, one single drive the other double for drawbar use but I would think it was mainly for export with the NTK 350 ■■■■■■■ and 13 speed box, no mention of the drive axles unfortunately, this was up to 1971. Franky.
Hi Mr . Bewick , our driver ran a wheel bearing off the rear axle with a load of tarmac on thought he was doing right ran it back to the quarry, but it had weld it to the beam ,It took us aweek to sort it out ,Had to cut half an inch off the beam ,grind the beam as nnear as poss ,so we relined fitted new bearings oilseal welleid it all back to place ,but could only get one nut on the shaft, so tacked it on ran it for 6 months the got rid , THE good old days they say , Cheers Barry
Frankydobo:
Two Eight Wheelers here, one single drive the other double for drawbar use but I would think it was mainly for export with the NTK 350 ■■■■■■■ and 13 speed box, no mention of the drive axles unfortunately, this was up to 1971. Franky.
0
Interesting info Franky thanks,I wonder if they coupled a pair of the Guy diffs together for the double drive option,they were very reliable axles that Guy used in the Big J I cannot recall any problems with the 6 Big J’s we ran with regards to their axle.Cheers Bewick.
The BMC dealer that I worked for in Reading became a Guy sub agent and we serviced several local Big J’s. Most had AEC engines and they were pretty reliable. The gearbox was a little strange in that to check the oil level you had to take the level plug out and let the oil drain to the level then replace the plug and add one pint through the filler which was higher up the casing, something to do with lubrication problems I recall! One Big J4 tipper did have a SLIGHT problem though, the owner’s decided to tip the body up and replace the hinge bar bolts but alas they knocked them all out before replacing any and the body slid off the chassis and bent the rams!!! 
Pete.
Bonjour Saviem, if you can wait a few days I will dig out some details on the volume of Gardner units that were supplied to Guy for their bus chassis,( in comparison to the truck side), you may be quite surprised at the volumes. ( N.B. Guy Victory ‘J’ chassis in PSV Format ). I used to visit Victory ‘J’ customers in Kenya, Malawi, South Africa,Jamaica and Hong Kong on a regular basis. (By the way, if you’ve never seen a Multi-storey car park for Double Deckers then try Hong Kong! )
On a slightly different tack I have to point “Valkyrie” in the right direction concerning his comments about the RR Eagle engines that were used by South Yorks PTE in the Dennis Dominators. The reason SYPTE stopped using Gardner engines, for a period, was due to a fall out with Leyland, their radiator supplier and ourselves, due to overheating problems in service. We advocated coolant additives be used to combat the water quality and the problem of depleting anti-freeze levels due to not topping up with pre-treated mixtures. SYPTE were not prepared, at that time, to accept our suggestions and all three of us were struck off their “Christmas card list!” Hence their change to RR and the Dennis chassis.
For anyone who knows the RR Eagle engine they have wet liners fitted which required a coolant additive to be used at all times!!!, as per the similarly equipped ■■■■■■■ engines. The downside of running the RR Eagle was that SYPTE lost two seats worth of capacity due to rear axle loadings being at capacity.( I make no comment about the weight of the LXB engine and the positive benefit to the customer that this affords). One problem which was endemic throughout their life, at SYPTE, was that of cracking sumps, which Rolls seemingly never resolved, according to shopfloor staff at some garages. I know of no such problems with truck spec engines
Having been involved directly with Rolls during my period at Seddon Atkinson and later via Perkins when they owned Gardner my view on the RR Eagle / TX derivative was that they were a sound unit albeit they had no outstanding features that made them first choice in the market.
Frankydobo:
Two Eight Wheelers here, one single drive the other double for drawbar use but I would think it was mainly for export with the NTK 350 ■■■■■■■ and 13 speed box, no mention of the drive axles unfortunately, this was up to 1971. Franky.
0
Now you’ve done it, the Leatherhead Loon will be along now the +300hp Guy has been exposed 
A tenner says he’ll come up with an alternative and that Guy should have put a bigger cab on it 
Yes, he’ll want a big Yankee style cab fitted.
Incidentally, the Guy rear axle was a used in the RR powered Marathon options.
Morning all, yes that Big j prototype will excite our friend from the Fire Engine world, bet he will want a 110in Aerodyne to go on top of it, plus a 110in extension to the chassis…and a rear steer lift fifth axle.
Wonder what happened to that prototype, I recall reading about it, but nothing more…anybody know?
5valve, welcome back, how is the hip? My sciatica is chronic, but I am past my sell by date now! Now before Bewick asks THE question…do you know how many Gardner 240s Guy took■■?
No , I would not be surprised by the number for PSVs, but I bet some on here would, Guy was a big Gardner customer.
Cheerio for now.
newmercman:
Frankydobo:
Two Eight Wheelers here, one single drive the other double for drawbar use but I would think it was mainly for export with the NTK 350 ■■■■■■■ and 13 speed box, no mention of the drive axles unfortunately, this was up to 1971. Franky.
0
Now you’ve done it, the Leatherhead Loon will be along now the +300hp Guy has been exposed
A tenner says he’ll come up with an alternative and that Guy should have put a bigger cab on it
My tenner says that he’ll slag the British haulage industry off for buying the 146bhp 6 speed version in the top photo instead. If they had had the foresight to buy the 350 Big J, British engineers would still continue to stride over the world, swarf spilling out of their turnups.
The CM archives have an article on the 350 Big J, but I cannot find it yet. I did find this, though:
archive.commercialmotor.com/arti … nd-new-guy
A Rolls 265 Big J in 1970. Guy do seem to have been quite a forward-looking firm, offering such powerful engines at that early date. The only thing to let them down seems to have been the cabs. If they had used the Ergo cab, would their vehicles have been considered “Best Ergo”?
Edit- senior moment there; the 350 8x4 was on the preceding pages:
archive.commercialmotor.com/page … er-1970/52
archive.commercialmotor.com/page … er-1970/53
[zb]
anorak:
newmercman:
Frankydobo:
Two Eight Wheelers here, one single drive the other double for drawbar use but I would think it was mainly for export with the NTK 350 ■■■■■■■ and 13 speed box, no mention of the drive axles unfortunately, this was up to 1971. Franky.
0
Now you’ve done it, the Leatherhead Loon will be along now the +300hp Guy has been exposed
A tenner says he’ll come up with an alternative and that Guy should have put a bigger cab on it
My tenner says that he’ll slag the British haulage industry off for buying the 146bhp 6 speed version in the top photo instead. If they had had the foresight to buy the 350 Big J, British engineers would still continue to stride over the world, swarf spilling out of their turnups.
The CM archives have an article on the 350 Big J, but I cannot find it yet. I did find this, though:
archive.commercialmotor.com/arti … nd-new-guy
A Rolls 265 Big J in 1970. Guy do seem to have been quite a forward-looking firm, offering such powerful engines at that early date. The only thing to let them down seems to have been the cabs. If they had used the Ergo cab, would their vehicles have been considered “Best Ergo”?
Edit- senior moment there; the 350 8x4 was on the preceding pages:
archive.commercialmotor.com/page … er-1970/52
archive.commercialmotor.com/page … er-1970/53
R.K.Crisp ran Big Js and some had the 335bhp ■■■■■■■ in on a “K” plate they were fitted with a jake brake as well but I think they may have been a cancelled export order as they had sleeper cab and a double skinned roof on some. that jake brake made a beautiful sound in the tunnels
cheers Johnnie
Salvation cometh 