Flat tyre on a lifting axle?

UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUMS THE UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUM (INTERACTIVE)
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Own Account Driver:

FarnboroughBoy11:

switchlogic:

FarnboroughBoy11:

lankyphil:
Out of curiosity, Say you have a blowout or puncture on the motorway. you pull over and find it’s on a lifting axle. Would you be allowed to run to the nearest services with the axle raised if it didn’t put you over your axle weights?*

*No fuel related bonuses here so run with midlift down all the time before someone comments…

Why do you run with the mid lift down all the time■■?
Talk about throwing money down the drain.
You must spin up your drive wheels all the time when it’s wet.
And not to mention giving other trucks a false impression that you are heavy when you’re not.
My gaffer would give me a disciplinary if I came back into the yard empty with the mid lift down and quite rightly so. Ridiculous ridiculous ridiculous!!!

It’s the most unprofessional sight on the road when you see a tractor unit running solo along the motorway with his mid lift down. I don’t know why but its that sort of thing that really bugs me :laughing:

Blimey, maybe you should have let him answer your question before tearing him apart.

I wasn’t meaning to tear anyone apart, I was just saying its pointless and defies the whole point of the invention of the mid lift. Might as well just run double drives.

The tag or mid axle on a 6x2 doesn’t always lift sometimes it’s an extra option that hasn’t been specced to save money on the original cost of the unit.

I’m surprised it’s even an option tbh, just thank how many sets of tyres it will go throughout its working life just because the axel doesn’t lift. £1000’s worth!

22

lankyphil:
Out of curiosity, Say you have a blowout or puncture on the motorway. you pull over and find it’s on a lifting axle. Would you be allowed to run to the nearest services with the axle raised if it didn’t put you over your axle weights?*

*No fuel related bonuses here so run with midlift down all the time before someone comments…

I must assume you havn’t been driving lorries for very long.
You really shouldn’t drive with the lift axle down until the weight until the weight justifies it.

23

Surprised CARRYQUICK has’ny been in wie both feet. Eddie.

24

The only Ivecos I’ve driven didn’t have a mid lift, I suppose they do make them though, but like FB I find it offends my sensibilities when I see an empty truck or even worse a unit only with the lift down.

Happysack you may be able to answer this; I’m sure I read on here recently that Stobbies like you to run with it down even when empty, why is that?

25

Not just the fuel wastage, the tyre bills as well!! What annoys me is that you say ‘no fuel bonus here’ so that’s why you do it to spite your boss? So you need to be paid ‘bonuses’ to be a professional driver?

If any of our drivers had that attitude, I’d chin them!

26

Rentadent:
Unless you’re loaded and the sensors won’t allow it then just lift it and carry on.
Even if it put the drive axle overweight briefly it would make more sense to get the tyre changed at a services or in a decent lay-by than on the hard shoulder, if you weren’t chancing being overweight then I’d run back to the yard or the tyre place with it up.
A transport company would be happy for you to do that, a logistics company would have you sitting at the side of the road.

Cheers mate.

FarnboroughBoy11:
Why do you run with the mid lift down all the time■■?
Talk about throwing money down the drain.
You must spin up your drive wheels all the time when it’s wet.
And not to mention giving other trucks a false impression that you are heavy when you’re not.
My gaffer would give me a disciplinary if I came back into the yard empty with the mid lift down and quite rightly so. Ridiculous ridiculous ridiculous!!!

It’s the most unprofessional sight on the road when you see a tractor unit running solo along the motorway with his mid lift down. I don’t know why but its that sort of thing that really bugs me :laughing:

I drive a Scania, which, when you put the midlift up, ■■■■■ it’s arse in the air. Which means the whole cab is tilted forward which quite often makes my mug slide off the coffee machine on the dash, my dinner plate slide of the steering wheel, my curtains which have frills on the frills slide forward so that they almost touch the windscreen :sunglasses:

With it lifted, it can overload the steering axle too. I’ve weighed out with a steering axle at 7200 before, dropped the axle and it’s gone down to 6900. Not too sure of the reasons, think it’s something to do with the truck being canted forward.

Not sure why they do this, is it something to do with having a steering midlift… I digress. Also, I find it can bugger up the gearbox computer (3 pedal opticruise), it thinks it’s got a heavier load on than it has so uses too many gears etc.

Don’t spin my wheels up much, due to having extreme finesse in my right foot… :confused: And using the weight transfer switch when it’s wet too. And I’m on Tesco chilled, so the trailer is always loaded, even if it’s just with cardboard in cages, but normally have plastic trays on the headboard which tend give enough weight to stop spinning up too.

FarnboroughBoy11:

switchlogic:
Blimey, maybe you should have let him answer your question before tearing him apart.

I wasn’t meaning to tear anyone apart, I was just saying its pointless and defies the whole point of the invention of the mid lift. Might as well just run double drives.

:slight_smile: No worries.

Pansie Division:
Not just the fuel wastage, the tyre bills as well!! What annoys me is that you say ‘no fuel bonus here’ so that’s why you do it to spite your boss? So you need to be paid ‘bonuses’ to be a professional driver?

If any of our drivers had that attitude, I’d chin them!

Nope. See my reasons above. The no fuel bonus bit was to stop the “you’re wasting diesel comments”.

the maoster:
Happysack you may be able to answer this; I’m sure I read on here recently that Stobbies like you to run with it down even when empty, why is that?

Yes they do. Axle up on a Scania adds 2/3 inches to running height is the main reason, or that’s the last reason I was told…

27

Talking to a fitter at work they were trying to find a way of having a 5 minute time delay before ours lift as there has been problems with the lift axle brakes binding as on some trucks they hardly get used.

28

the maoster:
The only Ivecos I’ve driven didn’t have a mid lift, I suppose they do make them though, but like FB I find it offends my sensibilities when I see an empty truck or even worse a unit only with the lift down.

Happysack you may be able to answer this; I’m sure I read on here recently that Stobbies like you to run with it down even when empty, why is that?

Never been told anything like that, although as someone else mentioned, it may be to do with the extra 3 inch height on Scania mid lifts.

Amazing how many things we are allegedly told what to/not to do…I never hear a thing. I’m a mushroom.

29

m1cks:
Talking to a fitter at work they were trying to find a way of having a 5 minute time delay before ours lift as there has been problems with the lift axle brakes binding as on some trucks they hardly get used.

They’re “used” every time you press the brake the brake pedal, however the wheel might not be going round at the time.

30

lankyphil:

Rentadent:
Unless you’re loaded and the sensors won’t allow it then just lift it and carry on.
Even if it put the drive axle overweight briefly it would make more sense to get the tyre changed at a services or in a decent lay-by than on the hard shoulder, if you weren’t chancing being overweight then I’d run back to the yard or the tyre place with it up.
A transport company would be happy for you to do that, a logistics company would have you sitting at the side of the road.

Cheers mate.

FarnboroughBoy11:
Why do you run with the mid lift down all the time■■?
Talk about throwing money down the drain.
You must spin up your drive wheels all the time when it’s wet.
And not to mention giving other trucks a false impression that you are heavy when you’re not.
My gaffer would give me a disciplinary if I came back into the yard empty with the mid lift down and quite rightly so. Ridiculous ridiculous ridiculous!!!

It’s the most unprofessional sight on the road when you see a tractor unit running solo along the motorway with his mid lift down. I don’t know why but its that sort of thing that really bugs me :laughing:

I drive a Scania, which, when you put the midlift up, ■■■■■ it’s arse in the air. Which means the whole cab is tilted forward which quite often makes my mug slide off the coffee machine on the dash, my dinner plate slide of the steering wheel, my curtains which have frills on the frills slide forward so that they almost touch the windscreen :sunglasses:

With it lifted, it can overload the steering axle too. I’ve weighed out with a steering axle at 7200 before, dropped the axle and it’s gone down to 6900. Not too sure of the reasons, think it’s something to do with the truck being canted forward.

Not sure why they do this, is it something to do with having a steering midlift… I digress. Also, I find it can bugger up the gearbox computer (3 pedal opticruise), it thinks it’s got a heavier load on than it has so uses too many gears etc.

Don’t spin my wheels up much, due to having extreme finesse in my right foot… :confused: And using the weight transfer switch when it’s wet too. And I’m on Tesco chilled, so the trailer is always loaded, even if it’s just with cardboard in cages, but normally have plastic trays on the headboard which tend give enough weight to stop spinning up too.

FarnboroughBoy11:

switchlogic:
Blimey, maybe you should have let him answer your question before tearing him apart.

I wasn’t meaning to tear anyone apart, I was just saying its pointless and defies the whole point of the invention of the mid lift. Might as well just run double drives.

:slight_smile: No worries.

Pansie Division:
Not just the fuel wastage, the tyre bills as well!! What annoys me is that you say ‘no fuel bonus here’ so that’s why you do it to spite your boss? So you need to be paid ‘bonuses’ to be a professional driver?

If any of our drivers had that attitude, I’d chin them!

Nope. See my reasons above. The no fuel bonus bit was to stop the “you’re wasting diesel comments”.

the maoster:
Happysack you may be able to answer this; I’m sure I read on here recently that Stobbies like you to run with it down even when empty, why is that?

Yes they do. Axle up on a Scania adds 2/3 inches to running height is the main reason, or that’s the last reason I was told…

Good post sir :sunglasses:

I got told in the induction that it doesn’t matter if you run with the lift axle up or down, something to do with the company not running the contract for the tyres so they just get used and abused. Don’t ask what the reasons were 'cos I can’t for the life of me remember. It was something along the lines of, they’re not ours so we don’t care.

Personally I find the ride a bit more comfortable with the lift axle raised, only with a light load of cardboard though, en-route to the shop it’s always down.

31

Anyway getting back to original post, I would lift it up if it will go up, regardless of weight and drive to where I wanted to go. If questioned on it, then it obviously only happened 5 miles ago and I didn’t want to block the hard shoulder, roundabout, a road etc etc

32

Regarding the comments about extra ride height when the lift axle is up.
Learn to operate your lorry. :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:
FFS. :laughing:

33

limeyphil:
Regarding the comments about extra ride height when the lift axle is up.
Learn to operate your lorry. :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:
FFS. :laughing:

please explain, Phil. I know I know nothing, but please enlighten me.

34

happysack:

limeyphil:
Regarding the comments about extra ride height when the lift axle is up.
Learn to operate your lorry. :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:
FFS. :laughing:

please explain, Phil. I know I know nothing, but please enlighten me.

I wish i could explain it. I could show you in less than 2 minutes.
The best thing to do would be pick up the manual, Have a read and experiment. You’ll find they adjust the height better with the handbrake off.
My written explanation would probably be full of words like “the wotsit, thingy, and the doings”. :laughing:

35

Daft Craig at tossco goole says it’s not three inches anymore. :sunglasses: it’s 4.5" :laughing: driver trainer! :open_mouth: :unamused: :bulb: this guy follows drivers around goole waiting to make a mistake! :grimacing: :grimacing: :grimacing:

36

Threre’s been some great post on this thread, had me chuckling :laughing: .
I would like to say that in the past I drove a Premium with mid lift, we were plated for 44 ton but quite a number of our jobs were lightweight, empty plastic bottles, cardboard etc, I used to find that on a windy day once onto a twin track piece of road the truck handled better with the mid lift down, seemed to keep a better straight line, it seemed to ocsilate between the trailer and unit when up in such conditions, though when on a 1 up 1 down or in town i’d lift it up for drive axle grip when pulling away.

On another related topic to mid lifts, just got a new Scania with a mid lift not 2nd steer with lift, unlike the Volvo I had, which would lift the axle at slow speeds regardless of the weight on board, allowing you to save your mid lift tyres and stress on the mid axle, this thing wont do it, cant see the point in having got rid off the 2nd steer to leave your tyres on the concrete off a customers premises, though that is my only gripe :wink:

37

lankyphil:
With it lifted, it can overload the steering axle too. I’ve weighed out with a steering axle at 7200 before, dropped the axle and it’s gone down to 6900. Not too sure of the reasons, think it’s something to do with the truck being canted forward.

Not sure why they do this, is it something to do with having a steering midlift… I digress. Also, I find it can bugger up the gearbox computer (3 pedal opticruise), it thinks it’s got a heavier load on than it has so uses too many gears etc.

Don’t spin my wheels up much, due to having extreme finesse in my right foot… :confused: And using the weight transfer switch when it’s wet too. And I’m on Tesco chilled, so the trailer is always loaded, even if it’s just with cardboard in cages, but normally have plastic trays on the headboard which tend give enough weight to stop spinning up too.

Yes they do. Axle up on a Scania adds 2/3 inches to running height is the main reason, or that’s the last reason I was told…

If you are overloaded on the front axle then yes of course the mid lift would be dropped so i agree on that bit.

if you drive it in manual then you wouldnt have this problem and it is going through all the gears when you’re light because you are not putting your foot down (which isnt a problem by the way) but if you are steadily accelerating at a normal pace of an unladen truck then it will block change for you and skip gears.

You can have all the finesse in your right foot as much as you want but starting on a greasy incline with the mid lift down when empty will spin your wheels and not mention when coming on boost to accelerate up said incline.

And if thats the real reason from them then i am appalled. Know your dimensions, know the tools you are working with, know your lorry. We have different trailer heights on straight frames, subbies trailers and double deckers so i am always running with a different combination of dimensions in regards to trailer height. I am always dropping my air and mid lift to get under a bridge if need be.

Im not meaning to have a pop at you or anyone but i just think transport is so cut throat and money has and always will be squeezed to the penny and the driver plays a massive part on cost and running with the mid lift down when empty just takes the ■■■■. All the old boys from the 70s and 80s wouldnt do it i dont think, has the industry gone down the pan because of scenarios like this??, the way i see it and from my understanding my opinion is that drivers are less professional and incompetent now days and is a big factor of why transport is FUBAR :slight_smile:

38

Just think if you had it lifted in the first place it wouldn’t have got a puncture :grimacing:

39

switchlogic:
I’d drive it back to the yard sod the next services!

Same here !!!

40

Driveroneuk:

m1cks:
Talking to a fitter at work they were trying to find a way of having a 5 minute time delay before ours lift as there has been problems with the lift axle brakes binding as on some trucks they hardly get used.

They’re “used” every time you press the brake the brake pedal, however the wheel might not be going round at the time.

Not necessarily with EBS. The ECU will know the wheel isn’t turning and that the axle is up.

Regarding them not getting used you may find with the right laptop software there are reprogrammable parameters that can be altered so the axle lifts at a set wheel speed you can set higher to increase the odds of the calipers getting a work out.

On the general point about midlifts I have trucks with and without the raise option. On the slipping issue, yes traction is poorer with the fixed ones. Mostly though you’ll get an ASR light flicker now and again in the wet, if light on the pin, rather than a full blown wheelspin. It certainly isn’t helpful off the tarmac.

In terms of money savings they’re really not as significant on tyre and fuel as I think many are imagining. There is also some smallish weight penalty to the lifting gear. Would probably be worse without mid-steer or tag though.

Would add that if I was driving a truck and it can be raised I would personally do so.