Hi all,
this is a pcv question but think it may apply to this forum forgive if im wrong just need some help, i have looked all over for a answer but cannot find one.
if i drive a domestic week sunday restday then mon-fri can i drive eu on the saturday as overtime?
also do i require time off before starting eu rules e.g do i need a friday off before doing eu on the saturday to break up driving between domestic and eu?
all help would be grateful as i have read lots of vosa leaflets and im not getting any clear messages.
thanks
harrid18:
if i drive a domestic week sunday restday then mon-fri can i drive eu on the saturday as overtime?
Yes - every other week so it conforms to the EU weekly rest rules
Your domestic record sheet will count as the record for EU regs other hours
harrid18:
also do i require time off before starting eu rules e.g do i need a friday off before doing eu on the saturday to break up driving between domestic and eu?
9 hours off between the domestic and EU is fine
thank you very much for the help, its puts things into place for me.
i will just have to be careful with the hours and breaks in the week before and the week im working overtime, and make sure its not over my 90 limit and i have my printout for the 2 weeks ive worked.
just another quick question,
if i did the domestic mon - fri and saturday overtime tacho would my weekly rest be reduced for that week? would i then need to extended rest the following week when i was back on domestic to compensate the overtime the week previous? would i need 2days off together?
harrid18:
just another quick question,
if i did the domestic mon - fri and saturday overtime tacho would my weekly rest be reduced for that week? would i then need to extended rest the following week when i was back on domestic to compensate the overtime the week previous? would i need 2days off together?
Yes because EU has precedent over domestic.
Any EU hours done in a week makes the whole week EU hours.
No EU drivers hours records need to be produced for any fixed week in which no EU regs driving was done
Most would be able to get away with this 
if they worked in a factory for example
Mon to fri = work factory
sat = EU regs driving
Sun off
mon to sun = work factory
Repeat …
But in your case the domestic records are available so perhaps not a good idea
ROG:
harrid18:
if i drive a domestic week sunday restday then mon-fri can i drive eu on the saturday as overtime?
Yes - every other week so it conforms to the EU weekly rest rules
Your domestic record sheet will count as the record for EU regs other hours
harrid18:
also do i require time off before starting eu rules e.g do i need a friday off before doing eu on the saturday to break up driving between domestic and eu?
9 hours off between the domestic and EU is fine
As the driver would come under the working time 1998 he would have to have 11 hours off in the 24 hours he worked before starting on EU drivers hours.
10.–(1) An adult worker is entitled to a rest period of not less than eleven consecutive hours in each 24-hour period during which he works for his employer
Entitled to is not the same as must have
ROG:
Entitled to is not the same as must have
so based on that then, I only need 15 minutes break regardless of the time worked.
Breaks
7.–(1) No mobile worker shall work for more than six hours without a break.
(2) Where a mobile worker’s working time exceeds six hours but does not exceed nine hours, the worker shall be entitled to a break lasting at least 30 minutes and interrupting that time.
(3) Where a mobile worker’s working time exceeds nine hours, the worker shall be entitled to a break lasting at least 45 minutes and interrupting that period.
(4) Each break may be made up of separate periods of not less than 15 minutes each…
(5) An employer shall take all reasonable steps, in keeping with the need to protect the health and safety of the mobile worker, to ensure that the limits specified above are complied with in the case of each mobile worker employed by him.
delboytwo:
ROG:
harrid18:
also do i require time off before starting eu rules e.g do i need a friday off before doing eu on the saturday to break up driving between domestic and eu?
9 hours off between the domestic and EU is fine
As the driver would come under the working time 1998 he would have to have 11 hours off in the 24 hours he worked before starting on EU drivers hours.
10.–(1) An adult worker is entitled to a rest period of not less than eleven consecutive hours in each 24-hour period during which he works for his employer
The Working Time Regulations 1998 - Article 17
Entitlements under other provisions
- Where during any period a worker is entitled to a rest period, rest break or annual leave both under a provision of these Regulations and under a separate provision (including a provision of his contract), he may not exercise the two rights separately, but may, in taking a rest period, break or leave during that period, take advantage of whichever right is, in any particular respect, the more favourable.
delboytwo:
ROG:
Entitled to is not the same as must have
so based on that then, I only need 15 minutes break regardless of the time worked.
Breaks
7.–(1) No mobile worker shall work for more than six hours without a break.
(2) Where a mobile worker’s working time exceeds six hours but does not exceed nine hours, the worker shall be entitled to a break lasting at least 30 minutes and interrupting that time.
(3) Where a mobile worker’s working time exceeds nine hours, the worker shall be entitled to a break lasting at least 45 minutes and interrupting that period.
(4) Each break may be made up of separate periods of not less than 15 minutes each…
(5) An employer shall take all reasonable steps, in keeping with the need to protect the health and safety of the mobile worker, to ensure that the limits specified above are complied with in the case of each mobile worker employed by him.
The Road Transport (Working Time) Regulations 2005 - article 7
(5) An employer shall take all reasonable steps, in keeping with the need to protect the health and safety of the mobile worker, to ensure that the limits specified above are complied with in the case of each mobile worker employed by him.
The other thing is the normal WTD can be opted out of which makes any discussion on those breaks irrelevant
ROG:
The other thing is the normal WTD can be opted out of which makes any discussion on those breaks irrelevant
You can only opt out of the hours limit not the rest read it you will see.
to clarify the above statement.
5.–(1) The limit specified in regulation 4(1) shall not apply in relation to a worker who has agreed with his employer in writing that it should not apply in his case, provided that the employer complies with the requirements of paragraph (4).
4.–(1) Subject to regulation 5, a worker’s working time, including overtime, in any reference period which is applicable in his case shall not exceed an average of 48 hours for each seven days.
so base on this if you come under working time 1998 you still after follow the rest.
The Working Time Regulations 1998 - Regulation 23
Collective and workforce agreements
-
A collective agreement or a workforce agreement may–
-
modify or exclude the application of regulations 6(1) to (3) and (7), 10(1), 11(1) and (2) and 12(1), and
-
for objective or technical reasons or reasons concerning the organization of work, modify the application of regulation 4(3) and (4) by the substitution, for each reference to 17 weeks, of a different period, being a period not exceeding 52 weeks,
in relation to particular workers or groups of workers.
As the normal WTD is across the UK for most employees then why is there no legal action taken for those that take less than the entitled amount of rest? = easy, no law has been broken if the employee chooses to take less and employers could only be brought to task under unfair dismissal rules/employment tribunal
Employment contracts can also over ride where the employee has a clause to cover in certain situations
Can you image a nurse saying they cannot cover because they have not had 11 hours off !!!