Domestic and EU rules mixed?

ASK THE EXPERTS SAFETY, LAW AND WORKING TIME DIRECTIVE FORUM (INTE
1

When driving on Domestic hours rules and one day of the week driving under EU rules the EU rules for the whole week must take precedence.

My question is how many weekends are effected by EU weekly rest set around the single day I drive on EU rules?

For example,
I drive 6 days a week every week on domestic rules but if then I’m then asked to drive a vehicle on EU rules for a day or 2 then back on domestic rules, am I legal to drive on those 1 or 2 days considering I’ve had no recent regular weekend rest?

What then should be my next few weekend rest periods?

2

J-BONE:
When driving on Domestic hours rules and one day of the week driving under EU rules the EU rules for the whole week must take precedence.

My question is how many weekends are effected by EU weekly rest set around the single day I drive on EU rules?
If you only do 1 days work in-scope of EU regulations it will only affect the 1 weekly rest period for that week

For example,
I drive 6 days a week every week on domestic rules but if then I’m then asked to drive a vehicle on EU rules for a day or 2 then back on domestic rules, am I legal to drive on those 1 or 2 days considering I’ve had no recent regular weekend rest?

What then should be my next few weekend rest periods?

If you drive in-scope of EU regulations on any day you must comply with the EU regulations daily rest requirement on the days that you drive in-scope of EU regulations.

In any week that you drive in-scope of EU regulations, even if it’s just 1 day, you must comply with the EU regulations weekly rest requirement.

Any work, including driving, done on domestic regulations counts as other work for the EU regulations.

Example.
Lets say you start work at 08:00 Monday on domestic regulations and stay on domestic regulations until and including Friday, on Saturday you work in-scope of EU regulations, because the work done on domestic regulations counts as other work for the EU regulations you must start a weekly rest period no later than 08:00 Sunday (144 hours from when you started on Monday).

Example.
Lets say you start work at 08:00 Monday on domestic regulations then work in-scope of EU regulations on Wednesday and Thursday, then you go back on domestic regulations on Friday and Saturday, again because you’ve worked in-scope of EU regulations you must start a weekly rest period no later than 08:00 Sunday (144 hours from when you started on Monday).

Example.
You work all week Monday to Sunday in week 1 on domestic regulations and finish work at 18:00 Sunday evening, you then start work at 06:00 Monday (week2) on domestic regulations, you work on domestic regulations most of the week but drive in-scope of EU regulations on one day.
You should start a weekly rest period no later than 144 hours from when you started work on Monday, so you would need to start a weekly rest period no later than 06:00 Sunday (week 2).
The fact that you worked 7 consecutive days in week 1 is irrelevant because you never drove in-scope of EU regulations.

In any week that you do not drive in-scope of EU regulations you do not have to have a weekly rest period, but if you do any work in-scope of EU regulations in a week you should have a weekly rest period for that week, if you do any work in-scope of EU regulations in 2 consecutive weeks you should comply with the weekly rest requirements i.e. have at-least 1 regular and 1 reduced weekly rest period in the 2 weeks.

3

Thank you for your reply and examples. I also scratch my head when some drivers say that on EU rules they can drive Mon to Friday and drive 2 out of every 3 Saturdays on a regular basis, kind of- 2 Saturdays on and 1 off, 2 Saturdays on and 1 off, 2 Saturdays on 1 off etc etc

In this case would a drivers lack of regular weekly rest catch up with him and become an infringement problem ?

4

J-BONE:
Thank you for your reply and examples. I also scratch my head when some drivers say that on EU rules they can drive Mon to Friday and drive 2 out of every 3 Saturdays on a regular basis, kind of- 2 Saturdays on and 1 off, 2 Saturdays on and 1 off, 2 Saturdays on 1 off etc etc

In this case would a drivers lack of regular weekly rest catch up with him and become an infringement problem ?

Unless they could have a 45 hour weekly rest period at-least every second week that’s not likely to be legal.

There are circumstances where you can have reduced weekly rest periods on 2 consecutive weekends but not on a regular basis, .

5

Here is another question on EU rules which I’ve heard conflicting opinions about.

If say I have driven for 4 hours and at the same time I’ve reached my 6 hour working time how much break do I need?

and

After that break how long can I drive for before my next break and how long should that be for?

6

J-BONE:
Here is another question on EU rules which I’ve heard conflicting opinions about.

If say I have driven for 4 hours and at the same time I’ve reached my 6 hour working time how much break do I need?

You need a 15 minute break for the 6 hour rule, but generally it would be pointless having a 15 minute break when you’re going to need another 30 minute break after another 30 minutes driving so you might as well have the whole 45 minute break and reset the driving time.
But there are circumstances where you might want to have a 15 minute break for the 6 hour rule then have another 30 minute break later but before exceeding 4.5 hours driving.

J-BONE:
After that break how long can I drive for before my next break and how long should that be for?

That depends, if you have the 45 minute break at 6 hours working time you can then drive for another 4.5 hours because your driving time would be reset, but if you have a 15 minute break for the 6 hour rule you would need another 30 minute break before exceeding 4.5 hours driving time.

7

tachograph:

J-BONE:
When driving on Domestic hours rules and one day of the week driving under EU rules the EU rules for the whole week must take precedence.

My question is how many weekends are effected by EU weekly rest set around the single day I drive on EU rules?
If you only do 1 days work in-scope of EU regulations it will only affect the 1 weekly rest period for that week

For example,
I drive 6 days a week every week on domestic rules but if then I’m then asked to drive a vehicle on EU rules for a day or 2 then back on domestic rules, am I legal to drive on those 1 or 2 days considering I’ve had no recent regular weekend rest?

What then should be my next few weekend rest periods?

If you drive in-scope of EU regulations on any day you must comply with the EU regulations daily rest requirement on the days that you drive in-scope of EU regulations.

In any week that you drive in-scope of EU regulations, even if it’s just 1 day, you must comply with the EU regulations weekly rest requirement.

Any work, including driving, done on domestic regulations counts as other work for the EU regulations.

Example.
Lets say you start work at 08:00 Monday on domestic regulations and stay on domestic regulations until and including Friday, on Saturday you work in-scope of EU regulations, because the work done on domestic regulations counts as other work for the EU regulations you must start a weekly rest period no later than 08:00 Sunday (144 hours from when you started on Monday).

Example.
Lets say you start work at 08:00 Monday on domestic regulations then work in-scope of EU regulations on Wednesday and Thursday, then you go back on domestic regulations on Friday and Saturday, again because you’ve worked in-scope of EU regulations you must start a weekly rest period no later than 08:00 Sunday (144 hours from when you started on Monday).

Example.
You work all week Monday to Sunday in week 1 on domestic regulations and finish work at 18:00 Sunday evening, you then start work at 06:00 Monday (week2) on domestic regulations, you work on domestic regulations most of the week but drive in-scope of EU regulations on one day.
You should start a weekly rest period no later than 144 hours from when you started work on Monday, so you would need to start a weekly rest period no later than 06:00 Sunday (week 2).
The fact that you worked 7 consecutive days in week 1 is irrelevant because you never drove in-scope of EU regulations.

In any week that you do not drive in-scope of EU regulations you do not have to have a weekly rest period, but if you do any work in-scope of EU regulations in a week you should have a weekly rest period for that week, if you do any work in-scope of EU regulations in 2 consecutive weeks you should comply with the weekly rest requirements i.e. have at-least 1 regular and 1 reduced weekly rest period in the 2 weeks.

Hi tacho,

Does your 144 definitely start when you start non EU regs work in the fixed week?

IE, work 0800-2000 in a warehouse sun - sat, couldn’t you do a EU shift on Sunday after? So long as you finish and started a weekly rest at 2359 at the latest, so that fixed week has a weekly rest. I know you’d need to record the warehouse hours from Monday, but isn’t that just so they know if you’ve had a weekly rest in that fixed week?

8

From what I can see a driver could be on domestic regs or doing a non driving job every day for months then do EU regs driving on a Monday without falling foul of the 144 hour rule but not sure if that is also correct if the first EU regs day is a Sunday - seems odd to have two different rules just because of the first day driving under EU regs …

9

ROG:
From what I can see a driver could be on domestic regs or doing a non driving job every day for months then do EU regs driving on a Monday without falling foul of the 144 hour rule but not sure if that is also correct if the first EU regs day is a Sunday - seems odd to have two different rules just because of the first day driving under EU regs …

Exactly

10

stevieboy308:
Hi tacho,

Does your 144 definitely start when you start non EU regs work in the fixed week?

IE, work 0800-2000 in a warehouse sun - sat, couldn’t you do a EU shift on Sunday after? So long as you finish and started a weekly rest at 2359 at the latest, so that fixed week has a weekly rest. I know you’d need to record the warehouse hours from Monday, but isn’t that just so they know if you’ve had a weekly rest in that fixed week?

Any other work done in the same week as driving in-scope of EU regulations cannot be counted as rest for the EU regulations, therefore if you worked in a warehouse Sunday to the following Saturday then drove in-scope of EU regulations you would not be complying with the EU rules because the 144 hours would start when you start work in the warehouse on the previous Monday (the first day of the drivers week).

3. Mixed EU/AETR and Great Britain domestic driving

If you work partly under EU/ AETR rules and partly under GB domestic rules during a day or a week, the following points must be considered (the EU rules take precedence over the GB domestic rules):

  • the time you spend driving or on duty under EU/ AETR rules cannot count as a break or rest period under GB domestic rules

  • driving and other duty under GB domestic rules (including non-driving work in another employment) count as other work but not as a break or rest period under EU/ AETR rules

However if you worked in a warehouse Monday to Sunday then worked in-scope of EU regulations on Monday the 144 hours would begin when you start work on Monday, that’s because you don’t need a weekly rest period in any week that you do not drive in-scope of EU regulations, obviously you would need a daily rest period before starting the in-scope work but that’s all you need.

I agree that it seems daft that you can work none stop for weeks then go straight onto HGV driving in-scope of EU regulations on Monday but that’s just the way it is.

11

Fair enough, cheers fella

12

Another one Guys is- If I mainly drive on EU rules but i.e. on a Wednesday drive a transit van, will the Wednesday be worked out on domestic hours rules or classed as other work?

13

J-BONE:
Another one Guys is- If I mainly drive on EU rules but i.e. on a Wednesday drive a transit van, will the Wednesday be worked out on domestic hours rules or classed as other work?

Domestic hours for that day as no EU regs driving done but counts as other work for the EU regs

14

Cheers,