Hi,
So I’ve had Monday through Thursday off, Worked Friday, Had a Drivers cpc day (7 Hours) on Saturday, worked Sunday and Monday.
Wanted to work Tuesday. Wednesday, Thursday and Friday as well followed by Sat and Sun off.
Company say that Dcpc day is classed as other work. Is this true? The course was paid for by me and wa done on my day of, was not paid to attend…
As it stands Im being asked to take a Tuesday off(24h rest).
Thanks…
This has just been clarified in one of the mags… if you pay then its part of your weekly rest or daily… if the firm pays then its other work so counts as duty time.
vosa classes it as other work ,so its possible a 7 hour course could put you into an infringement
Jenson Button:
This has just been clarified in one of the mags… if you pay then its part of your weekly rest or daily… if the firm pays then its other work so counts as duty time.
It’s OK to name the mag, or provide a link to the story.
I’d be very interested to read it please. 
dieseldave:
Jenson Button:
This has just been clarified in one of the mags… if you pay then its part of your weekly rest or daily… if the firm pays then its other work so counts as duty time.It’s OK to name the mag, or provide a link to the story.
I’d be very interested to read it please.
Me too !!
There has been much discussion on this and I saw a letter on this site from either a MP or the DfT which confused the issue even further because it mentioned voluntary and compulsory in the same paragraph I think
What I believe to be the case is this -
DCPC is complusory training so no matter who how why or where it is done then it cannot count as rest
Geebee45 quoted the relevant parts of the rules which governed this issue and what he pointed out made perfect logic and legal sense to me
One thing …
As the driver is not actually working but just waiting for the course to end if sitting in a classroom then I wonder if POA can be used ?
I wonder how VOSA would know what you did on your day off ?
Would they check with DVLA and see when any dcpc hours were uploaded ?
Would the upload dates be the same as the course dates because they could be uploaded a few days later than the course
delboytwo:
dieseldave:
Jenson Button:
This has just been clarified in one of the mags… if you pay then its part of your weekly rest or daily… if the firm pays then its other work so counts as duty time.It’s OK to name the mag, or provide a link to the story.
I’d be very interested to read it please.
It should be noted that the advice from VOSA makes it plain that the question of who is paying for the training is irrelevant: the distinction is whether or not the driver is being paid a wage to attend and whether his employer has ordered him to attend. If the answer to either question is yes, then the training should be recorded as ‘other work’
Surely this can’t be right :-/
dar1976:
delboytwo:
dieseldave:
Jenson Button:
This has just been clarified in one of the mags… if you pay then its part of your weekly rest or daily… if the firm pays then its other work so counts as duty time.It’s OK to name the mag, or provide a link to the story.
I’d be very interested to read it please.
It should be noted that the advice from VOSA makes it plain that the question of who is paying for the training is irrelevant: the distinction is whether or not the driver is being paid a wage to attend and whether his employer has ordered him to attend. If the answer to either question is yes, then the training should be recorded as ‘other work’
Surely this can’t be right :-/
My guess is that it depends on who in VOSA gave out the advice.
It’s all very well saying that “VOSA” gave out this advice, but IMHO it’s quite worrying when we don’t have a person’s name from within VOSA as being responsible for the advice.
I’d have thought that something as important as this ‘clarification’ would have been properly publiscised, which would then benefit the training industry and drivers alike.
IMHO, it would be a good idea if VOSA contacted the awarding bodies (SQA, JAUPT etc etc) and gave this advice officially.
delboytwo:
dieseldave:
Jenson Button:
This has just been clarified in one of the mags… if you pay then its part of your weekly rest or daily… if the firm pays then its other work so counts as duty time.It’s OK to name the mag, or provide a link to the story.
I’d be very interested to read it please.
Hi Del,
Thanks for the link. 
It also surpises me that they have shown the Gloucester test station which is no longer there and has not been for some time !!
That article should be taken with a piNch of salt because it does not address the other issue where the employer pays for the course but does not pay for the time that the driver is on it
I think an Email to my MP might get a definitive response …
It should be noted that the advice from VOSA makes it plain that the question of who is paying for the training is irrelevant: the distinction is whether or not the driver is being paid a wage to attend and whether his employer has ordered him to attend. If the answer to either question is yes, then the training should be recorded as ‘other work’
Thanks for the replys…
Still seems a bit of a grey area even if the above qoute is enforcable…
In grey area matters my company will do whatever is in their best interest, In this case it was in their interest for me not to work on Tuesday, and if it was in their interet to have me work they would have done, and my days DCPC training would have not been an issue…
Whats really ■■■■■■ me off is that I booked, payed for and attended the course in my “free” time so I would’nt lose a shift…
So now payed for the course and a day light in wages…
STEVECB1300:
So now payed for the course and a day light in wages…
How nice of the EU to do that to you 
clariffied in moter transport by vosa if you are gettin paid by the your employer to attenend the corse it is classed as other work if you are not gettin paid then you can count it as a rest period vosa check up with dvla to see if you have attended any course as every course you attend is logged with dvla ie wen you done it n how many hours you have done
I had this argument before its says somewhere and I cant remember where (maybe in GV262 ? tacho rules ) that if you do any training connected with your job then it is classed as other work paid or unpaid this bit were you attend at your own free will is balls it is compulsary because if you dont do it you will lose your livelyhood found it GV262 page 16 highlighted top ofpage
“A rest is an uninterrupted period where a driver may freely dispose of his time. Time spent working in other employment or under OBLIGATION or INSTRUCTION, regardless of the occupation type, cannot be counted as rest, including work where you are self-employed.”
found the letter from vosa with the name of the person and phone number so for those of you who want to can ring her up and check
Sally Cranney - VOSA wrote:
Corporate Office
2nd Floor
Berkeley House
Croydon Street
BRISTOL
BS5 0DA
DX:744430
Tel: 0117 954 3475
Fax: 0117 954 3209
01 February 2012
From: Sally Cranney
VOSA.Corporateoffice@vosa.gsi.gov.uk
Mr M****** S********
By email
Dear M******
Thank you for your email of 7 December addressed to the Department for Transport. It has been passed to me to respond as the Vehicle and Operator Services Agency (VOSA) is responsible for enforcing drivers’ hours legislation. I am sorry for the delay in responding to your correspondence.
The drivers’ hours legislation states that a weekly rest period is a period during which drivers may freely dispose of their time. It is therefore the compulsory or voluntary
nature of CPC training which determines whether or not it should be counted as working time.
Driver CPC training should be treated as working time if the driver is instructed to attend the training as part of their employment. If, however, a driver organises their own training and attends that training during their rest period or day off, then it is counted as rest like any other voluntary activity.
If an employer organises non-compulsory training for drivers which takes place at weekends and where attendance is unpaid, it does not count as working time.
I trust you find this information helpful.
Yours sincerely,
Sally Cranney
An executive agency of the Department for Transport
as the op organised his own training then he is perfectly entitled to book as rest, this argument has been going on since the dcpc started, to be honest its up to the driver to obtain the dqc card and not the employer but some are paying part or all of the coarse, that’s not a problem, the only problem occurs when the employer pays you for attending then that has to classed as OTHER WORK,
wildfire:
the only problem occurs when the employer pays you for attending then that has to classed as OTHER WORK,
does “pays you for attending” include pays for the course fees only ?
if the employer pays the course fees, but does not pay the person on the course any wage for attending, is this still other work ?
ThirtyTwo:
wildfire:
the only problem occurs when the employer pays you for attending then that has to classed as OTHER WORK,does “pays you for attending” include pays for the course fees only ?
if the employer pays the course fees, but does not pay the person on the course any wage for attending, is this still other work ?
Hi ThirtyTwo,
This is from the link kindly provided by delboytwo above…
I’ve inserted one line space and a little formatting to make it read even clearer. 
It should be noted that the advice from VOSA makes it plain that the question of who is paying for the training is irrelevant:
the distinction is whether or not the driver is being paid a wage to attend and whether his employer has ordered him to attend. If the answer to either question is yes, then the training should be recorded as ‘other work’