My DCPC trainer told me that the course fee would be rising as we neared the deadline, his angle on it was that because the take-up has been slow so far, the training company has been losing money on DCPC courses for as long as they have been running them and will need to re-coup their investment when the cut-off date looms sufficiently closely for people to start doing something about it.
As far as Im concerned being a CPC Holder, its just another money making exercise for Knobs that probabley dont know the far end of a ■■■■ about the haulage game, Jobs for the boys In my opinion, making it hard for the employers & the drivers, Wages in this game are poor for the work & effort that goes into it, I concider Im , like a lot more involed are proffesionals in our field & we all learnt the hard way, the proper way to say the least, Regards Larry.
Lawrence Dunbar:
As far as Im concerned being a CPC Holder, its just another money making exercise for Knobs that probabley dont know the far end of a ■■■■ about the haulage game, Jobs for the boys In my opinion, making it hard for the employers & the drivers, Wages in this game are poor for the work & effort that goes into it, I concider Im , like a lot more involed are proffesionals in our field & we all learnt the hard way, the proper way to say the least, Regards Larry.
Just like me Larry,when I read about all this new legislation that is and has been(since 1968)imposed on the industry I often wonder how we managed to operate.The Dept of transport,or what ever they call themselves from time to time think they can legislate for everything but they convieniently forget that common sense is also needed and that item,IMO,is sadly lacking in to-days “modern industry” I am sorry to say.Cheers Dennis.
I Agree with what you say Deniss, I pleased im retired & out of it, I think if I was still running a haulage business today I would be in jail for GBH, for assaulting all the rsoles that are trying to stop people in the haulage game making a living, & keeping a lot of good drivers employed, Regards Larry.
I don’t believe the government will extend the deadline. It is not in the makeup of legislators to show a modicum of common sense…well not where money from a “Cash-cow” to boost the treasury is concerned anyway.
As for Q2. As there are often many questions asked on this forum I would be surprised if all drivers know everything about the current transport legislation that affects their jobs. So hopefully it may help those who are lacking in that knowledge but are reluctant to ask in the workplace for fear of being considered stupid.
That said. Like many of the older retired drivers I’m pleased I’m out of it.
Lawrence Dunbar:
I Agree with what you say Deniss, I pleased im retired & out of it, I think if I was still running a haulage business today I would be in jail for GBH, for assaulting all the rsoles that are trying to stop people in the haulage game making a living, & keeping a lot of good drivers employed, Regards Larry.
At twenty to eleven on a friday night you don’t question wether your name is Dennis with two “ss”'s or two “nn”'s eh! Unless you want your lights punching out ( a few large or 'ish Glenmorangies don’t help!) Although it maybe be outside the Labour Club and will depend on who’s “next to the beck” at the bar so we’ll have had to carry you back into the bar Larry eh! Cheers Dennis.
I have been in the transport industry for some 45 years now as man and boy. I am now employed as an instructor by the MOD and have been so for the last 15 years. I was recently approached by a civilian company to deliver DCPC training in my spare time, something that I was very keen to do. Firstly I would be able to qualify for my own DCPC so that it would enable me to continue to use my LGV as and when I wanted to. Secondly I thought that it would be good opportunity to deliver worthwhile instruction to a group of people that really wanted to learn, after all I am a driver and can relate to a drivers view of the training good or bad ! However I declined the offer mainly because of my wife’s failing health as I would not be able to commit to such an undertaking with the dedication that it would require. But reading these pages on this thread I think that I am best out of it, as for my own DCPC it will not happen and I will in 2014 join the ranks (and there will be plenty therein) of drivers no longer qualified to drive LGVs commercially. 
Regards Tony H.
Harry Monk:
My DCPC trainer told me that the course fee would be rising as we neared the deadline, his angle on it was that because the take-up has been slow so far, the training company has been losing money on DCPC courses for as long as they have been running them and will need to re-coup their investment when the cut-off date looms sufficiently closely for people to start doing something about it.
Unfortunately Harry
That is the attitude of many of the trainers or their employers, rather than being in it for the long haul, they are hoping that within 5 years they can order the Aston Martin and buy the Villa in Tuscany.
The ones who lease a Vauxhall Astra on a three year term will survive as the DCPC does not suddenly end on 10th September 2014. It simply starts again, hence the name “Periodic.”
Hopefully with the second wave, common sense will be part of the curriculum and the drivers will learn something of value as the trainers put their efforts into “marketing the business” to employers with a real result at the end of it. We have got this ridiculous situation where drivers have to be “trained”, but in what, many choose the course and the only important criteria at the moment is price.
The basics are;
eco-safe and fuel efficient driving
defensive driving techniques
first aid
health and safety
drivers’ hours rules
using tachographs
I have seen one course offering;
Understanding Traffic Signs
Vehicle Characteristics
Routine Maintenance
Know your Braking Distances
Speed Limits
Drink Driving
Risk Assessments
Apart from drink driving I have been trained on all those subjects and was given a free certificate.
And a badge
KER’CHING! 
So far I’ve done ‘drivers hours and tacho regs’, and ‘fuel efficient driving & customer service’, both of which I did get something out of and the trainers were good. I’m also booked on a first aid day and am looking at one entitled ‘how to keep your licence’, which should hopefully both be useful. After that I’ll be struggling to find a final one so that may have to wait until nearer the time.
Personally I don’t believe the DCPC will go away, and I think it’s very unlikely the cut-off will be extended. It’s an EU thing and VOSA will be champing at the bit to start checking on drivers and getting money out of them. The whole course will have cost me £250 which I’ll be off-setting against my tax so I figure £200 to let me carry on driving until 2019 isn’t too bad, & I will be looking at retiring before the next one is due.
I voted no to both questions.
I do not think there will be an extension to the deadline, unless it becomes clear that there are not going to be enough qualified drivers when sep 2014 rolls around. If that is the case then the rules will be relaxed until enough drivers qualify. The trucks will not stop, the country can’t do without them.
I did my first set of seven hours “training” yesterday and learned nothing. A complete waste of my time and my money that did nothing to improve my knowledge or my driving. 
Yesterday I attended a national DCPC conference where Beverley Bell was speaking on the subject of DCPC. There were around 150 people attended
She basically confirmed that she is meeting with the head guy from VOSA to discuss enforcement. She ‘suggested’ after the deadline a driver that has no DQC at a stop will be given a £30 penalty and their details passed to the traffic commissioner. The TC will more than likely then invite them in for a meeting and remove their vocational licence until they then complete the DCPC. No DCPC no return of licence.
She also confirmed at the same time the TC would lean very heavily on the operator to get the driver through the DCPC and that she intended to start pushing operators relatively soon starting by writing to all operators to ask them what they are doing about the DCPC. Those that don’t reply will be called in for a chat. the letter will be asking operators to explain in detail their plans to get the DCPC sorted.
She confirmed the TC’s back the DCPC 100% and deadlines will not change or be relaxed.
If any of you have ever seen Mrs bell ‘presenting’ - she is pretty good and certainly came across strongly in support of DCPC but indicating operators need to get it sorted and not leave it to drivers.
Earlier in the morning a guy from Alert LGV training had stood up with the microphone and had a right dig at the head honcho from the DSA and said the DCPC is not working and should be scrapped. (he did get a round of applause but not from me). When Mrs Bell came on she basically said whoever that guy was should take his negative attitude and leave the industry. DCPC is here to stay - support it and help make it work or get out. (which got an even bigger round of applause). The 2 guys from Alert left the room not much later.
The conference confirmed there are no immediate plans to change much regarding the DCPC. there is a new online system due anytime. All training centres will have to register all courses live on the new system and keep it updated - this will mean unnanounced inspections will be easier for JAUPT and DSA but - there are only 18 JAUPT auditors and 8 DSA auditors = not a lot. They also confirmed there are ‘a few’ training centres under surveilance for crap training
Strange figure they gave out was that 4% of the approved centres are delivering 50% of the courses. I read this as meaning at least 1 or 2 consortiums are doing the bulk of the business. They also said over 23% of registered centres hadn’t delivered any training this year - so probably gone bust already
They were actively asking trainers to grass on poor trainers and even ‘suggested’ trainers carry out ‘secret shopping’ on other trainers then grass them up if no good. (get the trainers to do the DSAs job). The DSA people seemed very keen to raise standards.
A lot more was said - when I remember what it was I’ll let you know
shep532:
Yesterday I attended a national DCPC conference where Beverley Bell was speaking on the subject of DCPC. There were around 150 people attendedShe basically confirmed that she is meeting with the head guy from VOSA to discuss enforcement. She ‘suggested’ after the deadline a driver that has no DQC at a stop will be given a £30 penalty and their details passed to the traffic commissioner. The TC will more than likely then invite them in for a meeting and remove their vocational licence until they then complete the DCPC. No DCPC no return of licence.
She also confirmed at the same time the TC would lean very heavily on the operator to get the driver through the DCPC and that she intended to start pushing operators relatively soon starting by writing to all operators to ask them what they are doing about the DCPC. Those that don’t reply will be called in for a chat. the letter will be asking operators to explain in detail their plans to get the DCPC sorted.
She confirmed the TC’s back the DCPC 100% and deadlines will not change or be relaxed.
If any of you have ever seen Mrs bell ‘presenting’ - she is pretty good and certainly came across strongly in support of DCPC but indicating operators need to get it sorted and not leave it to drivers.
Earlier in the morning a guy from Alert LGV training had stood up with the microphone and had a right dig at the head honcho from the DSA and said the DCPC is not working and should be scrapped. (he did get a round of applause but not from me). When Mrs Bell came on she basically said whoever that guy was should take his negative attitude and leave the industry. DCPC is here to stay - support it and help make it work or get out. (which got an even bigger round of applause). The 2 guys from Alert left the room not much later.
The conference confirmed there are no immediate plans to change much regarding the DCPC. there is a new online system due anytime. All training centres will have to register all courses live on the new system and keep it updated - this will mean unnanounced inspections will be easier for JAUPT and DSA but - there are only 18 JAUPT auditors and 8 DSA auditors = not a lot. They also confirmed there are ‘a few’ training centres under surveilance for crap training
Strange figure they gave out was that 4% of the approved centres are delivering 50% of the courses. I read this as meaning at least 1 or 2 consortiums are doing the bulk of the business. They also said over 23% of registered centres hadn’t delivered any training this year - so probably gone bust already
They were actively asking trainers to grass on poor trainers and even ‘suggested’ trainers carry out ‘secret shopping’ on other trainers then grass them up if no good. (get the trainers to do the DSAs job). The DSA people seemed very keen to raise standards.
A lot more was said - when I remember what it was I’ll let you know
Thanks for the insight, it shows how out of touch with Driver opinion and reality these people are.
I notice you say a “few centres are under surveillance for providing crap training”. Bearing in mind that the course has to last seven hours where you can, if you like, get the qualification just for turning up. How does the description “crap training” not apply to the whole DCPC scheme?
If the DSA want to raise standards, the DCPC as it currently is, is not fit for purpose.
If they want to raise money then I think that may be closer to the truth.
shep532:
Earlier in the morning a guy from Alert LGV training had stood up with the microphone and had a right dig at the head honcho from the DSA and said the DCPC is not working and should be scrapped. (he did get a round of applause but not from me). When Mrs Bell came on she basically said whoever that guy was should take his negative attitude and leave the industry. DCPC is here to stay - support it and help make it work or get out. (which got an even bigger round of applause). The 2 guys from Alert left the room not much later.
So basically the conference was set-up to only hear from people who approved of and supported the DCPC 
Even when a bloke from a training who would be in a position to make money from the DCPC criticises it he’s told he’s just being negative and should get out of the industry.
How exactly does that bode well for training standards in the road transport industry or individual drivers?
tachograph:
shep532:
Earlier in the morning a guy from Alert LGV training had stood up with the microphone and had a right dig at the head honcho from the DSA and said the DCPC is not working and should be scrapped. (he did get a round of applause but not from me). When Mrs Bell came on she basically said whoever that guy was should take his negative attitude and leave the industry. DCPC is here to stay - support it and help make it work or get out. (which got an even bigger round of applause). The 2 guys from Alert left the room not much later.So basically the conference was set-up to only hear from people who approved of and supported the DCPC
Even when a bloke from a training who would be in a position to make money from the DCPC criticises it he’s told he’s just being negative and should get out of the industry.
How exactly does that bode well for training standards in the road transport industry or individual drivers?
I think it is much more possible that Ms Bell does read Trucknet and she was probably engrossed in the long thread about OCRS and Blazing Saddles. Surely you remember ALERT and the agency, and the trainers and the rest.
For once I do agree with BB, and would have applauded her myself
shep532:
Yesterday I attended a national DCPC conference where Beverley Bell was speaking on the subject of DCPC. There were around 150 people attendedShe basically confirmed that she is meeting with the head guy from VOSA to discuss enforcement. She ‘suggested’ after the deadline a driver that has no DQC at a stop will be given a £30 penalty and their details passed to the traffic commissioner. The TC will more than likely then invite them in for a meeting and remove their vocational licence until they then complete the DCPC. No DCPC no return of licence.
She also confirmed at the same time the TC would lean very heavily on the operator to get the driver through the DCPC and that she intended to start pushing operators relatively soon starting by writing to all operators to ask them what they are doing about the DCPC. Those that don’t reply will be called in for a chat. the letter will be asking operators to explain in detail their plans to get the DCPC sorted.
She confirmed the TC’s back the DCPC 100% and deadlines will not change or be relaxed.
If any of you have ever seen Mrs bell ‘presenting’ - she is pretty good and certainly came across strongly in support of DCPC but indicating operators need to get it sorted and not leave it to drivers.
A lot more was said - when I remember what it was I’ll let you know
This is one bit that was said Shep, whether it is to be taken verbatim or not is not clear.
She cautioned those drivers, and operators, who behave like ‘arrogant teenagers’ when it comes to the Driver CPC and Periodic Training. She said training and continuous personal development is now the norm in the modern business world. And adopting a negative attitude and pretending they ‘know it all’, would not make the Driver CPC go away. Drawing on her considerable experience at Public Inquiry she told delegates that many drivers, and operators, are actually too frightened to admit they don’t have a good grasp of correct operating procedures, transport legislation and drivers’ hours rules. She said when questioned they often resort to ‘teenage bluff’ tactics in an attempt to hide their shortcomings.
Driving home her message, she said that come the September 9th 2014 deadline, if drivers are found to be driving professionally without a driver qualification card, the TCs would suspend their vocational entitlements until they have completed the required amount of Periodic Training. If they are subsequently caught driving while suspended they will loose their licence. She added: 'This is only half the story. The operator, their employer, is equally responsible. Ignore the Driver CPC and they may well be called to Public Inquiry. The reality will be real trucks that should be delivering real loads on real roads, are no longer able to operate.
I am still reading the rest of the document.
Wheel Nut:
tachograph:
Even when a bloke from a training who would be in a position to make money from the DCPC criticises it he’s told he’s just being negative and should get out of the industry.How exactly does that bode well for training standards in the road transport industry or individual drivers?
I think it is much more possible that Ms Bell does read Trucknet and she was probably engrossed in the long thread about OCRS and Blazing Saddles. Surely you remember ALERT and the agency, and the trainers and the rest.
For once I do agree with BB, and would have applauded her myself
I remember a thread about the OCRS but have no idea what it has to do with this thread, but maybe I’m thinking of the wrong thread.
Regardless of OCRS, Blazing Saddles (whatever that is) or ALERT the simple fact is that Beverley Bell apparently made it clear that she’s only interested in views that do not conflict with her views.
Why would you or anyone else want to applaud such a dogmatic attitude towards the DCPC? 
Mrs Bell has possibly got a wide ranging experience of the standards that bring people before her at PI or disciplinary interview. her opinion seems to be that there is generally a need for the training and I think she was trying to get the point across that the DCPC is here - it is staying and those involved in it need to make it work. She certainly indicated that she would be targeting operators and managers looking at their Continuing professional development (which a lot of managers don’t do and rely on a qualification from tens of years ago)
I think the problem with the speech mr Alert gave was that it was a “It doesn’t work so scrap it” speech and when asked why it doesn’t work he gave an answer along the lines of “Because it’s rubbish”. There is also the fact that Mr Alert and his boys have been brought up on trucknet a good few times for their service levels. This is the company promising loads of agency work if a driver takes their OCRS DCPC course … but from what i hear there is no work and they are just trying to sell their DCPC course - but I don’t know for sure.
The DCPC has quite a lot in common with the euro. It was originally sold as a cure for everything but is so fatally flawed that it is an expensive liability only liked by those that have a vested interest in it.
I keep reading about how it will raise driving standards but how will this happen when the courses do not include any driving?
It is the equivalent of an NVQ in shelf stacking and will have no impact on improving driving standards.
The only real way that standards can be raised is by having a repeat driving test every few years that could be failed, along with a theory test that covers all aspects of lorry driving. That would sort the wheat from the chaff. It would probably not be any less popular than DCPC but certainly be more useful.
So what will Mrs Bell do if everybody refuses to take the DCPC and opts to retire instead?
Drive one herself? I doubt she could tell the front end of a truck from the back. Mrs Bell has a reputation for ignoring any information that does not fit in with her mindset and it looks like she is not about to change that.
The best thing that could happen would be if Traffic Commissioners were people promoted from within, people who actually understood the industry, ex-drivers and the like. But of course, that would never happen because of this peculiarly British idea of the “class structure”.
shep532:
‘…Mrs Bell came on she basically said whoever that guy was should take his negative attitude and leave the industry. DCPC is here to stay…’
Said she whose ‘industry’ is a government/EU puppet agency (which, incidentally, takes her & their wage from the cash-cow transport industry to spout us the Brussels line).
How such people sleep at night bewilders me