Yorkshire Tramper:
Reading that report, it is contradictory to the video representation which I fully suspected after watching it. Then I suppose the printed statement from Boston University would read along those lines even if it were not the case, I am sure they would like to portray it this way. Who knows what the actual truth is
I fully agree with notions of “healthy” skepticism in science, but there are two major differences here:
people making videos they post independently on Youtube are not getting any scrutiny before they press that “upload” button, certainly not the intensely detailed scrutiny that any peer-reviewed publication gets from other people who are themselves working in the same field,
and…
Boston University itself, and their dedicated group, have a huge responsibility to ensure their representatives are not going to damage the University’s reputation by publishing science will not withstand the scrutiny I’ve described, so there will already have been intense internal scrutiny before getting to the pre-publication stage.
I know from personal experience that your academic colleagues will attack your research like pit bulls long before it gets to the outside world, because everyone has a vested interest in making sure your research is up to scratch, because reputational damage will affect them too.
jakethesnake:
Probably not but as far as I am concerned you don’t seem to really understand or know anything about Dr Campbell by what you write. You mentioned about his negative videos but you can’t remember them.
It’s obvious you know very little about him but for some reason you have taken a dislike to him for reasons I can only suspect. I could give you a lot more info but I’m sure I would be wasting my time so let’s just leave it now before I get stroppy.
You’re seeing things that only exist in your own mind, I don’t need to “understand” some random Youtuber, just because he’s a “retired nurse teacher and A & E nurse” (his words, not mine). I have no personal opinion on him other than he’s just yet-another-attention-seeker on the internet, with too much time on his hands, there are countless thousands of people out there like him.
Sorry if it damages your hero-worship, but you ought to know that people actively working in Covid research don’t have the time of day for these kind of people any more than I do. I mentioned “Dr Campbell” to my former lab buddy, who is now Head of Biotechnology at a research institute here in the north-east, he just laughed and said “Funny, I don’t remember seeing him around the table at our last meeting with the Secretary of State for Health”. That’s the kind of covid-related conversations he’s more used to.
You can get as stroppy as you like, but it won’t change that fact that:
a) You’re making the kind of mistake that would have a first-year undergraduate’s course work receiving a failing grade;
b) you have shown you don’t have the personal ability to correctly analyze source literature;
c) so you’re relying on someone else to give you their personal version of it without the scrutiny of any peers; and, worst of all,
d) choosing to believe “some guy on the internet” rather than looking at all the available data and forming a conclusion that is in concert with all the available data.
In short: you’re doing exactly what the anti-vax-conspiracy-brigade do, it’s just that you’re choosing different internet sources to come up with the wrong ideas.
Yorkshire Tramper:
Reading that report, it is contradictory to the video representation which I fully suspected after watching it. Then I suppose the printed statement from Boston University would read along those lines even if it were not the case, I am sure they would like to portray it this way. Who knows what the actual truth is
I fully agree with notions of “healthy” skepticism in science, but there are two major differences here:
people making videos they post independently on Youtube are not getting any scrutiny before they press that “upload” button, certainly not the intensely detailed scrutiny that any peer-reviewed publication gets from other people who are themselves working in the same field,
and…
Boston University itself, and their dedicated group, have a huge responsibility to ensure their representatives are not going to damage the University’s reputation by publishing science will not withstand the scrutiny I’ve described, so there will already have been intense internal scrutiny before getting to the pre-publication stage.
I know from personal experience that your academic colleagues will attack your research like pit bulls long before it gets to the outside world, because everyone has a vested interest in making sure your research is up to scratch, because reputational damage will affect them too.
Sounds a credible reply to me. I fully agree with what you are saying and you obviously have expertise in this field to make a more educated judgement than your average joe. It is still something to be questioned though regardless of credability otherwise we would simply accept what is being told to us without question. I suppose a bit like a shadow cabinet holding the leading government to account.
^^^^^^^^
His retort/reply/put down to Jakey telling him his experience in the field, and his qualifications including his doctorate was pure class …best one on here ever.
In short: you’re doing exactly what the anti-vax-conspiracy-brigade do, it’s just that you’re choosing different internet sources to come up with the wrong ideas.
What a load of rubbish. The conspiracy brigade don’t simply accept the b.s. explanations that those in authority* perpetuate. They can analyse the official data and come up with a more plausible understanding.
Take the hospital admissions for covid since it started, absolutely no dip identifiable from the vaccine rollout, just seasonal winter peaks.
jakethesnake:
Probably not but as far as I am concerned you don’t seem to really understand or know anything about Dr Campbell by what you write. You mentioned about his negative videos but you can’t remember them.
It’s obvious you know very little about him but for some reason you have taken a dislike to him for reasons I can only suspect. I could give you a lot more info but I’m sure I would be wasting my time so let’s just leave it now before I get stroppy.
You’re seeing things that only exist in your own mind, I don’t need to “understand” some random Youtuber, just because he’s a “retired nurse teacher and A & E nurse” (his words, not mine). I have no personal opinion on him other than he’s just yet-another-attention-seeker on the internet, with too much time on his hands, there are countless thousands of people out there like him.
Sorry if it damages your hero-worship, but you ought to know that people actively working in Covid research don’t have the time of day for these kind of people any more than I do. I mentioned “Dr Campbell” to my former lab buddy, who is now Head of Biotechnology at a research institute here in the north-east, he just laughed and said “Funny, I don’t remember seeing him around the table at our last meeting with the Secretary of State for Health”. That’s the kind of covid-related conversations he’s more used to.
You can get as stroppy as you like, but it won’t change that fact that:
a) You’re making the kind of mistake that would have a first-year undergraduate’s course work receiving a failing grade;
b) you have shown you don’t have the personal ability to correctly analyze source literature;
c) so you’re relying on someone else to give you their personal version of it without the scrutiny of any peers; and, worst of all,
d) choosing to believe “some guy on the internet” rather than looking at all the available data and forming a conclusion that is in concert with all the available data.
In short: you’re doing exactly what the anti-vax-conspiracy-brigade do, it’s just that you’re choosing different internet sources to come up with the wrong ideas.
Well you really are making big assumptions for people you have no idea about. Do you really think all my knowledge of covid comes from Dr Campbell.
Once again you put him down by calling him a “random u tuber” and an attention seeker which shows your complete lack of knowledge of the guy.
Also tell your mate next time he is round the table to remind everyone how badly the UK government have handled this pandemic and to try to get some facts correct for a change.
All you are doing by continuing this nonsense is confirming my suspicions about yourself so let’s agree to disagree please.
jakethesnake:
Well you really are making big assumptions for people you have no idea about. Do you really think all my knowledge of covid comes from Dr Campbell.
Once again you put him down by calling him a “random u tuber” and an attention seeker which shows your complete lack of knowledge of the guy.
Also tell your mate next time he is round the table to remind everyone how badly the UK government have handled this pandemic and to try to get some facts correct for a change.
All you are doing by continuing this nonsense is confirming my suspicions about yourself so let’s agree to disagree please.
I am not sure about the credability of Zac_A to be honest here jake, however I will say this, he certainly sounds to me like he is knowledgeable
in this field, these are big bold statements that he is making about his qualifications and if he isn’t who he says, he certainly has me fooled and I am also an academic (not in the medical field) and I can usually spot someone who is taking the mick. I will stick my neck on the block here and say that I believe that he is genuine.
Yorkshire Tramper:
Reading that report, it is contradictory to the video representation which I fully suspected after watching it. Then I suppose the printed statement from Boston University would read along those lines even if it were not the case, I am sure they would like to portray it this way. Who knows what the actual truth is
I fully agree with notions of “healthy” skepticism in science
And this is what was considerably lacking during the pre/post vaccine rollout; well renowned and respected Drs were shunned away if they showed ANY form of skepticism or concerns. Not once did mainstream media cover an open debate about the pros & cons of the vaccine, or if they did I guess I missed it and apologise for that.
People have died from covid. People have also died from vaccines. Surely skepticism should then be respected and open to everyone?
jakethesnake:
Well you really are making big assumptions for people you have no idea about. Do you really think all my knowledge of covid comes from Dr Campbell.
Once again you put him down by calling him a “random u tuber” and an attention seeker which shows your complete lack of knowledge of the guy.
Also tell your mate next time he is round the table to remind everyone how badly the UK government have handled this pandemic and to try to get some facts correct for a change.
All you are doing by continuing this nonsense is confirming my suspicions about yourself so let’s agree to disagree please.
I am not sure about the credability of Zac_A to be honest here jake, however I will say this, he certainly sounds to me like he is knowledgeable
in this field, these are big bold statements that he is making about his qualifications and if he isn’t who he says, he certainly has me fooled and I am also an academic (not in the medical field) and I can usually spot someone who is taking the mick. I will stick my neck on the block here and say that I believe that he is genuine.
I am not saying he isn’t genuine and tbh I don’t really care. I just don’t like his attitude towards Dr C who he obviously knows very little about. Maybe he should do a little more research before spouting crap.
I could say a lot more but tbh I cant really be *rsed these days.
In short: you’re doing exactly what the anti-vax-conspiracy-brigade do, it’s just that you’re choosing different internet sources to come up with the wrong ideas.
What a load of rubbish. The conspiracy brigade don’t simply accept the b.s. explanations that those in authority* perpetuate. They can analyse the official data and come up with a more plausible understanding.
Take the hospital admissions for covid since it started, absolutely no dip identifiable from the vaccine rollout, just seasonal winter peaks.
*It’s all about the money for them.
What?!
Why try to re-interpret the gradient of a curve as compared to an suggest norm to arrive at what is available in its original form? coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details … me=England
Admissions in Jan 2021 are about double those in Jan 2022.
Furthermore is cherry-picking one measure (hospital admissions) a good measure of a vaccine`s efficacy?
Edit to explain last point…even if the number of admissions stayed the same (although in fact it halved) if the outcome was shorter stays, and fewer deaths it would still be a good result.
jakethesnake:
Well you really are making big assumptions for people you have no idea about. Do you really think all my knowledge of covid comes from Dr Campbell.
Once again you put him down by calling him a “random u tuber” and an attention seeker which shows your complete lack of knowledge of the guy.
Also tell your mate next time he is round the table to remind everyone how badly the UK government have handled this pandemic and to try to get some facts correct for a change.
All you are doing by continuing this nonsense is confirming my suspicions about yourself so let’s agree to disagree please.
I am not sure about the credability of Zac_A to be honest here jake, however I will say this, he certainly sounds to me like he is knowledgeable
in this field, these are big bold statements that he is making about his qualifications and if he isn’t who he says, he certainly has me fooled and I am also an academic (not in the medical field) and I can usually spot someone who is taking the mick. I will stick my neck on the block here and say that I believe that he is genuine.
I am not saying he isn’t genuine and tbh I don’t really care. I just don’t like his attitude towards Dr C who he obviously knows very little about. Maybe he should do a little more research before spouting crap.
I could say a lot more but tbh I cant really be *rsed these days.
Now I have sort of calmed down I will explain why I am so aggrieved at zac’s comments. He did mention in one of this earlier posts that unless I knew him personally I couldn’t comment.(Just before or after I told him to leave it as it was) Can’t remember which.
Well, no I don’t know him personally but I know someone who does. He is a family member and works at the Royal Marsden in London. I won’t tell you his position but I will say he is more qualified than a doctor. This guy has known Dr Campbell for many years and had had a lot to do with him both with work and socially.
I have had a few discussions over the last couple of years by telephone regarding covid etc and of course John Campbells name has come up. I have been told, a nicer, more helpful guy you could not meet. He has helped a lots of people over the years apparently and I’m not talking through his work but during his own time and still does in retirement.
So maybe you can understand why I got upset when he was called a “random u tuber” and an “attention seeker”
I notice you are continuing to ignore my point that the source literature is there for all to see, but you keep coming back to your one reference point, which is someone else’s opinion. Thus confirming what I said previously: you do not have the personal ability to analyse source data to make an informed opinion. If you had you could have seen that these is clear value on the research from Boston University.
Yorkshire Tramper:
I am not sure about the credability of Zac_A to be honest here jake, however I will say this, he certainly sounds to me like he is knowledgeable
in this field, these are big bold statements that he is making about his qualifications and if he isn’t who he says, he certainly has me fooled and I am also an academic (not in the medical field) and I can usually spot someone who is taking the mick. I will stick my neck on the block here and say that I believe that he is genuine.
I’m not interested what Jake the snake thinks, but just so you know you’re not being hoodwinked, one of the moderators knows me ‘off-forum’ so if I wasn’t genuine, the forum would know.
Why try to re-interpret the gradient of a curve as compared to an suggest norm to arrive at what is available in its original form? coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details … me=England
Admissions in Jan 2021 are about double those in Jan 2022.
Furthermore is cherry-picking one measure (hospital admissions) a good measure of a vaccine`s efficacy?
Edit to explain last point…even if the number of admissions stayed the same (although in fact it halved) if the outcome was shorter stays, and fewer deaths it would still be a good result.
I give up! [emoji6]
Jan 2021 are about double those in Jan 2022" you accuse me of cherry picking April & May deaths, so I give you the entire hospital admissions since it started!
Maybe Jan 22 is half the month on Jan 21, but that doesn’t help if admissions are spread out in 2022 to give a continuous increasing ■■■■■■■■■■ number with no sign of it slowing due to the vaccine program.
Zac_A:
I notice you are continuing to ignore my point that the source literature is there for all to see, but you keep coming back to your one reference point, which is someone else’s opinion. Thus confirming what I said previously: you do not have the personal ability to analyse source data to make an informed opinion. If you had you could have seen that these is clear value on the research from Boston University.
No, I am not ignoring anything. I have never said the research at Boston University wasn’t valuable. Read back and tell me I am wrong please.
What has upset me is your aloof attitude to someone you really know nothing about. You talked of his negative videos but you can’t name them. I asked you to knock this on the head and agree to disagree but you kept it going.
I understand a lot of what has been said on you tube about covid is utter garbage and the way you have been talking you are including Dr Campbell which is totally unfair in my opinion and plenty others if you care to check.
Now, again let’s just leave it at that because I really can’t be bothered anymore.
Why try to re-interpret the gradient of a curve as compared to an suggest norm to arrive at what is available in its original form? coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details … me=England
Admissions in Jan 2021 are about double those in Jan 2022.
Furthermore is cherry-picking one measure (hospital admissions) a good measure of a vaccine`s efficacy?
Edit to explain last point…even if the number of admissions stayed the same (although in fact it halved) if the outcome was shorter stays, and fewer deaths it would still be a good result.
I give up! [emoji6]
Jan 2021 are about double those in Jan 2022" you accuse me of cherry picking April & May deaths, so I give you the entire hospital admissions since it started!
Maybe Jan 22 is half the month on Jan 21, but that doesn’t help if admissions are spread out in 2022 to give a continuous increasing ■■■■■■■■■■ number with no sign of it slowing due to the vaccine program.
I gave a link to ALL the data from the Gov dashboard.
Look at it. I didn`t put up a screen shot of just one graph.
Of course the ■■■■■■■■■■ figure is increasing. No one in the real world imagines that vaccines are a magic bullet.
The rate is noticeably lower after the vaccines introduction, in spite of the absence of lockdowns! More mixing but,fewer hospital admissions, and fewer deaths, after vaccine than before.
Zac_A:
I notice you are continuing to ignore my point that the source literature is there for all to see, but you keep coming back to your one reference point, which is someone else’s opinion. Thus confirming what I said previously: you do not have the personal ability to analyse source data to make an informed opinion. If you had you could have seen that these is clear value on the research from Boston University.
No, I am not ignoring anything. I have never said the research at Boston University wasn’t valuable. Read back and tell me I am wrong please.
What has upset me is your aloof attitude to someone you really know nothing about. You talked of his negative videos but you can’t name them. I asked you to knock this on the head and agree to disagree but you kept it going.
I understand a lot of what has been said on you tube about covid is utter garbage and the way you have been talking you are including Dr Campbell which is totally unfair in my opinion and plenty others if you care to check.
Now, again let’s just leave it at that because I really can’t be bothered anymore.
jakethesnake:
I have never said the research at Boston University wasn’t valuable. Read back and tell me I am wrong please.
jakethesnake:
Dr. Campbell was only making people aware of what these scientists had been doing and asking why they had been doing this as it was totally unnecessary.
There you go, you vicariously disparaging the research of BU via the words of your “hero”, despite the fact that you don’t have the ability to adequately analyse the data yourself.
…best one on here ever. 
