On another forum it has been quoted that if you do not hold the Dcpc by Sept 2014, you will not have your licence suspended. Now i, and many others have been told the opposite. Any trainers who actually know can shed any light on this please?
You won’t loose it but you won’t be able to drive for a living but its just changed slightly you used to be able to do test runs as a mechanic but that’s been scraped
The dcpc and the licence are two entirely seperate issues
If you have others telling you different then ask them what happens to a LGV driver who not only drives for a living but also drives a private horsebox where no dcpc is required … that will get them thinking
I’m not a trainer but my understanding is that if a driver does not hold the DCPC card by a certain date in Sept 2014 then, although retaining the licence to drive, the driver is not entitled to drive an LGV on a road for hire or reward or in connection with any trade or business…effectively you have the licence but you can’t drive a lorry (possibly privately is ok) until you’ve got the DCPC 
A mate in the scaffolding trade has been told by his firm that they don’t need DCPC as they only carry their own gear . Is it only for the hire and reward sector? 
dilbert:
A mate in the scaffolding trade has been told by his firm that they don’t need DCPC as they only carry their own gear . Is it only for the hire and reward sector?
That mate has been incorrectly informed - the dcpc is for commercial LGV driving - your mate is driving commercially
there is however an exemption which may fit depending on what it is he does …
is carrying material or equipment to be used by the driver in the course of his or her work, provided that driving the vehicle is not the driver’s principal activity
If your mate loads up, drives to the job, erects the scaffolding, then drives back to yard - perhaps twice a day - then they would be exempt dcpc
AFAIK If a driver required by law does drive without a dCPC then he will get a fixed penalty fine, I think the company does too. If a foreign driver drives in the UK without it he gets a considerably less fine.
dilbert:
A mate in the scaffolding trade has been told by his firm that they don’t need DCPC as they only carry their own gear . Is it only for the hire and reward sector?
Hi dilbert,
The terms “hire and reward” and “own account” relate to the type of operators’ licence that the company holds, they have no connection with the wording of the DCPC Regulations.
The most useful get-outs from the DCPC Regulations are for driving:
Official vehicles.
A vehicle, which is being used by, or is under the control of any of the following –
- The armed forces;
- A police force;
- A fire and rescue authority;
- A local authority in the discharge of any function conferred on or exercisable by that authority under an order made under section 5 of the Civil Contingencies Act 2004(3) or regulations made under section 20 of that Act
====================================================================================
Other vehicles.
-
A vehicle, which is undergoing road tests for technical development, repair or maintenance purposes, or that is a new or rebuilt vehicle which has not yet been put into service;
-
A vehicle, which is being used in a state of emergency or is assigned to a rescue mission;
-
A vehicle, which is being used in the course of a driving lesson or driving test for the purpose of enabling that person to obtain a driving licence or a CPC;
-
A vehicle, which is being used for the non-commercial carriage of passengers or goods for personal use;
-
A vehicle, which is carrying material or equipment to be used by that person in the course of his work, provided that driving that vehicle is not his principal activity.
Other than the vehicles mentioned above, the DCPC Regulations use the words “relevant vehicle” to mean:
“relevant vehicle” means a vehicle for which is required a driving licence of category C, C+E, D or D+E
Angus25:
You won’t loose it but you won’t be able to drive for a living but its just changed slightly you used to be able to do test runs as a mechanic but that’s been scraped
You can still road test vehicles without a Driver CPC, but you can’t collect or deliver them, or take them to or from an annual test
I’m presuming that in my position as somebody who no longer lives in the UK that after September 2014 I’ll no longer be able to drive in the EU as I wont have completed any of thise CPC malark but should I return in lets say 2017 and complete 35 hours of worthwhile education at that later date, I’ll then be able to resume driving again in the UK/Europe despite a gap of 3 years between implementation of the DCPC and when I actually did it myself?
GasGas:
Angus25:
You won’t loose it but you won’t be able to drive for a living but its just changed slightly you used to be able to do test runs as a mechanic but that’s been scrapedYou can still road test vehicles without a Driver CPC, but you can’t collect or deliver them, or take them to or from an annual test
I think they’re making it up as they go along and nothing is really gospel until tested in court. I think any reasonable person would say taking a vehicle to MOT could be described as maintenance purposes. It seems clear really from the exemptions that periodic training is clearly only aimed at people whose occupation would be described as lorry/bus/coach driver. Pretty much anyone else, even though they may get behind the wheel of a vehicle over 3.5t during either occasionally or at some point during the course of their working day, is exempt.
I wouldn’t be surprised if they don’t back-pedal on that when the time annual tests take start extending when firms just start constantly sending regular drivers for whom it will often be a new experience where everything will have to constantly be explained.
As far as VOSA go it’s just more of the same with DCPC as o-licencing, if in doubt, say they need it.
I’m just repeating what stage coach have said if you just have a bus licence no test drives after this year and HGV holders next year
What about hgv’s that are classed as plant?
Kerbdog:
AFAIK If a driver required by law does drive without a dCPC then he will get a fixed penalty fine, I think the company does too. If a foreign driver drives in the UK without it he gets a considerably less fine.
If at all… 
Henrys cat:
What about hgv’s that are classed as plant?
If they are registerd as plant see no problem in driving them
Kerbdog:
AFAIK If a driver required by law does drive without a dCPC then he will get a fixed penalty fine, I think the company does too. If a foreign driver drives in the UK without it he gets a considerably less fine.
£30 FPN for not carrying a DQC but up to £1000 for driver and operator if not done the required training
robinhood_1984:
I’m presuming that in my position as somebody who no longer lives in the UK that after September 2014 I’ll no longer be able to drive in the EU as I wont have completed any of thise CPC malark but should I return in lets say 2017 and complete 35 hours of worthwhile education at that later date, I’ll then be able to resume driving again in the UK/Europe despite a gap of 3 years between implementation of the DCPC and when I actually did it myself?
Correct
Doing all 35 hours in 2017 will give you 5 years worth of dcpc til 2022
I think they’re making it up as they go along and nothing is really gospel until tested in court. I think any reasonable person would say taking a vehicle to MOT could be described as maintenance purposes. It seems clear really from the exemptions that periodic training is clearly only aimed at people whose occupation would be described as lorry/bus/coach driver. Pretty much anyone else, even though they may get behind the wheel of a vehicle over 3.5t during either occasionally or at some point during the course of their working day, is exempt.
I wouldn’t be surprised if they don’t back-pedal on that when the time annual tests take start extending when firms just start constantly sending regular drivers for whom it will often be a new experience where everything will have to constantly be explained.
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Sorry, that’s absolutely wrong.
The law is quite clear, unless the use falls into a specific exemption a DPC is required. A court cannot and will not rewrite the law.
Farmers have been told they will need DCPC training even if they only drive an LGV to to take livestock to market once a year.
Mechanics have been told they will need an DCPC to collect and return vehicles for servicing.
GasGas:
I think they’re making it up as they go along and nothing is really gospel until tested in court. I think any reasonable person would say taking a vehicle to MOT could be described as maintenance purposes. It seems clear really from the exemptions that periodic training is clearly only aimed at people whose occupation would be described as lorry/bus/coach driver. Pretty much anyone else, even though they may get behind the wheel of a vehicle over 3.5t during either occasionally or at some point during the course of their working day, is exempt.I wouldn’t be surprised if they don’t back-pedal on that when the time annual tests take start extending when firms just start constantly sending regular drivers for whom it will often be a new experience where everything will have to constantly be explained.
.
Sorry, that’s absolutely wrong.
The law is quite clear, unless the use falls into a specific exemption a DPC is required. A court cannot and will not rewrite the law.
Farmers have been told they will need DCPC training even if they only drive an LGV to to take livestock to market once a year.
Mechanics have been told they will need an DCPC to collect and return vehicles for servicing.
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No, only a court can interpret the law not VOSA, they are merely stating their interpretation, which is basically just scare tactics. It’s clear that scaffolders and tree surgeons are exempt. It would therefore follow that a farmer transporting his telehandler now and again would also be but should he take livestock to slaughter every month or so they’re trying to say the exemption wouldn’t apply as livestock is not specifically mentioned. As long as there’s a decent lawyer fighting the corner there doesn’t need to be a specific exemption as the exemptions aren’t framed as a specific exhaustive list so it would be down to the court’s interpretation.
The difference in the scenarios you’ve outlined about is that the telehandler would come under the ‘tools and materials for use in the course of his work’ exemption whereas the transport of farm livestock is the own-account carriage of goods. He will need a driver cpc for the latter (as will all who are carrying goods), but not the former.
There’s a similar distinction for a farmer or gangmaster using a PCV to transport for example, pickers to a field: he will need a driver cpc because he is carrying passengers, rather than tools or materials for his own use in his main line of work.
Think of it this way: driving an LGV or PCV will mean that you have to have a Driver CPC unless you can show that one of the exemptions actually applies to the use to which you are putting the vehicle. A soldier does not need a Driver CPC to drive an army lorry in the course of his duties, but he does need one if he decides to earn a few bob driving for a civi haulier while he is on leave.
I hope this is clear.The line from VOSA is that a DCPC is required for everything that is not specifically exempt. Their list of exemptions is very precise and tightly worded. I honestly don’t think there is much ‘wriggle room’ and fighting a test case will prove much more expensive than paying a fine, so I expect that VOSA will escape challenge in court on most, if not all, of this.
A solicitor is going to want to see at least £1000 on the table before he would take defending a case like this on, and that would just be a start, whereas I suspect VOSA will have near unlimited funds for prosecutions.
It’s probably cheaper and easier to get the card than it is to try to argue the toss.
If it really is that important to you you could try contacting your MP and point out the anomalies in the law and regulations as they stand…ask was this really the intention of Parliament, and can he seek an amendment to the legislation.