newmercman:
The 60 Series was a John Deere design, now stop calling me saviem 
Quite right, how could a famous blogger, camionard, and author, be confused with an elderly, short, bucholic, and very worn out agricole!!!
Evening Gentlemen,
Detroit 60 series, I can add little to Mark, and Anoraks contributions, and I promise to return to the threads core…but the Detroit 60 series has some significance to me personally, so please may I just add a few memories.
Detroit and John Deere had signed a collaboration from 1985, that Deeres designs could be sold by Detroit Diesel Allison. Detroit`s share of the “loose” engine market , (to be fitted by non GM Group manufacturers, in 1986 over 90% of the class 8 market), with their 92 series two stroke Vs, had dropped from around 33% , to less than 5% of the overall market for class 8 tractors by 1986. Persistant unreliabilityof the 92 series, coupled with poor fuel economy, as in the V6, and V8, 71s had robbed Detroit of credibility.
By 1987 the “Saviour”, in the form of the new Detroit Deere Corporation should have been manufacturing both the 11.1 litre, (250/350hp), and the 12.7litre (350/475hp), both designed for a pre overhaul life in excess of 500000miles. The design actually predicted a real time life in excess of 650000miles. Commanality of parts was paramount, with the 12.7litre only differing in less than 10 parts from the 11.1.
The new company simply did not happen, it was quickly realised that the existing agreement was sufficient to give Detroit the competitive advantage of Deeres fuel efficient, and powerfull designs, and the engines would be built at Detroit`s Redford, Michegan plant, without the need for the 50% joint company!
Personal significance…now of course it is my utter admiration, based upon personal agricultural experience of John Deeres 6cylinder designs, the longevity of the engines, their economy and performance, simplicity of design and service operation,…oh and their aural bark, you never tire of a Deere`s exhaust note!!! But lorries?? Having sold our Contract Hire business in the 90s , and as I was figuring out what to do in the future, so in the meantime I indulged my interest in US iron, and began importing /exporting a fair number of US vehicles. Volumes built up, and I realised that there was a small market for new products, but only if they were available Homologated for European use. So having some knowledge of one European countries homologation system, I was able to register a type approval for one US lorry fitted with a Detroit 60 series! In the event I only imported a couple of examples, (both are still in use), before I turned sharp left…and went Farming.
Apologies for going well off thread, but in view of the “clap trap” being posted about the Detroit V`s, and their suitability for everything…well I thought it worth putting some actual history down.
But back to the thread,Ergo, and Marathon, I had no part in Pats 1978 Eurotest, but did in the 79 one. But I remember Pat and I discussing vehicles one night, and he told me just how good , as a potential vehicle to operate the Mk 2 Marathon actually was. If I remember correctly, the Marathon was up against a Seddon 400, Big Cam, a MAN, F12 Volvo, and was it a Magirus ? overall fuel useage, and journey times were compatable across all motors, but the Big Cam, was ahead. Cab wise, well the Ergo must have been 15odd years older than the rest, but Pat said that as a driving enviroment it was ok, and quiet and comfortable. But what made me prick my ears up, was Pats suspicion that Volvo had “tailered” the test F12, to maximise its potential result…and he was not happy about that at all!!
Certainly those French operators that I visited who ran Marathon TL12s liked them, and as I recall the grill treatment with the horizontal bars looked not bad at all on the tall cab!! Trev H has confirmed that the Marathon was not a bad vehicle to live with, and from my experience of the AEC Marshall, well I liked that cab very much. Gingerfold has confirmed production figures, all in all not a bad vehicle genre then, is it!!
Ergomatics, well its confirmed, they are something to be proud about!!
Im away for a wee Bollinger...for I can remember when the redoubtable Cliff Hardwick came into the sales office at Hartshorne s clutching a Marathon launch brochure, and saying what a wonderful vehicle it was,…as I left the office to make him a cup of tea, I shouted, “designed by Cadburys…with nuts in mind”. Never in my wildest dreams would I have thought that all these years later I would be defending that self same vehicle…life is funny, is it not?
Cheeerio for now.
Possibly when it was first introduced before it’s teething issues were ironed out,as is often the case in many types of successful engines,including the Rolls Merlin which helped to save Western Europe from defeat.But the military doesn’t usually keep wasting money on unreliable products for over 30 years together with the resulting implications which that would have on the risks of tactical defeat and the same applies in regard to emergency vehicle builders.Although having said that if you’d have said the ■■■■■■■ 903 then you’d probaby be right. 
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