So taking the period 50’s/60’s/to the mid 70’s which one of these British marques would be acknowledged to have been the BEST overall ! Now I’m not looking for “craics” from the “wise guys” saying "Oh! I think Volvo F ■■ or Scania 112 etc etc were the best !! Only views on the above mentioned BRITISH makes ! So over to you Lads, I’ll keep my opinion to myself as I’m biased ! 
Cheers Bewick.
Before my time but it’s between the first 2 without doubt. 
Driven most models of the marques listed; deffo never been an Atkinson fan and most certainly ERF for me every time!
Steve
It would have to be ERF for me. Atkinson was well-engineered kit (and as you don’t mention Seddon-Atkinson, I assume you mean Atkinsons pre the merger), but for the long-haul driver it was too basic. Leyland was superb in the '50s but had lost its edge by the '70s. Foden was more specialised and its gearboxes were an acquired taste. ERF had continued to innovate, evolve and develop during this period and although I’d hesitate to declare '50s and '60s ERFs a favourite I’d certainly claim ERFs as a producer of quality premium tractors by the mid-70s. Given a choice of Atki/ERF/Foden/Leyland premium tractors, as a long-haul driver, in the mid-70s I’d go for ERF every time. Robert
Its hard to believe that they did not even survive as a specialist builder but ERF would be my choice…
Leyland Motors were in a different class to the others. They designed and made the whole vehicle, and were at the leading edge of automotive research. Of course they lost their way, as did all of them, but many of the good things they did are still in service to this day. The factory still assembles DAFs, AFAIK the design office still does the small and medium lorries, the test house still works for a variety of customers and Torotrak is still in business.
Foden made all of its own stuff too, but it was not as on-the-ball as Leyland. Readers of the Foden thread will recall that the Fleetmaster was seen as a step forward- for having all the main bits bought-in, reducing Foden to the status of mere assemblers, like the other two.
Totally biased, but it has to be AEC (Eventually Leyland) for me. The Mk V was a huge step forward from its pre-decessor then the Ergo topped the lot. Only the bigger cabs of the Scandinavian Dutch and French imports improved a drivers place of work. Specialised coach builders could give you the comfort and space to compete, but it came at a price that chased fleet owners away. Jim.
leyland marathon m/e spec everytime 
You’re trying to compare apples to oranges and pears because I don’t believe that you can compare a vertically integrated manufacturer with an assembler who has to source its drive-line components.
Anyway, I’ll chuck in my two pen’orth. ERF and Atkinson were purely assemblers for all of their existences and of those two Atkinson would be my choice. I have driven ERFs and truthfully I didn’t like them, I thought them to be uncomfortable and “clumsy”, but that is purely down to driver preference. For the most part the drive-line could not be faulted but any “innovation” at ERF was questionable in my opinion. Foden for most of its existence made a high proportion of its components in-house and the vast number of Fodens we had at Ranks were very well regarded. I was brought up on the Leylands and AECs (and Seddons powered by these engines) of the 1950s and 1960s. My mentor and his father, both of them time served engineers, moved from Leyland to AEC because they believed AEC’s engineering and design to be the better of the two. So for me it is AEC up to the early 1970s, then probably Atkinson for the next 5 years, then by about 1980 it was getting to the end of the road for anything made in the UK.
gingerfold:
You’re trying to compare apples to oranges and pears because I don’t believe that you can compare a vertically integrated manufacturer with an assembler who has to source its drive-line components.Anyway, I’ll chuck in my two pen’orth. ERF and Atkinson were purely assemblers for all of their existences and of those two Atkinson would be my choice. I have driven ERFs and truthfully I didn’t like them, I thought them to be uncomfortable and “clumsy”, but that is purely down to driver preference. For the most part the drive-line could not be faulted but any “innovation” at ERF was questionable in my opinion. Foden for most of its existence made a high proportion of its components in-house and the vast number of Fodens we had at Ranks were very well regarded. I was brought up on the Leylands and AECs (and Seddons powered by these engines) of the 1950s and 1960s. My mentor and his father, both of them time served engineers, moved from Leyland to AEC because they believed AEC’s engineering and design to be the better of the two. So for me it is AEC up to the early 1970s, then probably Atkinson for the next 5 years, then by about 1980 it was getting to the end of the road for anything made in the UK.
I completely agree with you that it is difficult or impossible to compare vertically integrated manufacture with assemblage in this context. 
As for my reference to innovation, I was think more of things like the introduction of spring-brakes. There is a bit in Dai Jones’s book, ERF The Inside Story where these kinds of innovations are listed as ‘firsts’. I’ve reproduced it below. Robert
I’m afraid that with the possible exception of spring brakes I can dis-prove most of those other claimed “firsts” for ERF. And of the other few remaining so called “firsts” they were only alternative suppliers to similar components already available from other manufacturers. I know that we all have our own favourite makes and models and as an author yourself Robert you will know how easy it is to get carried away with one’s own enthusiasm for the subject, and all authors are guilty of that at some time. However, the compiler of that list of “firsts” had not done his research thoroughly and claiming “firsts” in the automotive industry is one notorious minefield.
My challenge when posting this thread was purely to gauge the opinion of which of the four manufactures was the best motor from a Drivers point of view and not the various merits of Assemblers -v- Vertically integrated builders. However, no matter as it is interesting to read opinion that delves deeper into the various aspects and differences of the marques although as far as I am concerned the “assemblers” held their own against the likes of Leyland/AEC and Foden. So I’ll “come clean” and say that the Atkinson was my favourite followed closely by the ERF and I only got into ERF’s when I couldn’t, at one point, get my hands on an Atky chassis and I can say from experience that both marques gave us years of equally reliable operation. Cheers Bewick.
Fair comment Dennis and looking at it from your stated drivers’ point of view then my experience of ERF was with LV cabbed (Gardner LXB 180) and A Series (■■■■■■■ 220). I didn’t particularly like either from a comfort perspective, but obviously the ■■■■■■■ job had a lot more go in it. As I stated earlier the drive-line of an ERF (or Atki) cannot be faulted. I then didn’t drive an ERF again for almost 20 years until I went to Turners and occasionally I had an ERF to drive, which by then were E Series with a selection of Gardner 6LXDT, or ■■■■■■■ E14, or ■■■■■■■ E10. There were also a couple of ■■■■■■■ E8 artics, and they were the exception of the rule to ERF / ■■■■■■■ reliability. Purely from a driver’s perspective, and I said so at the time, that I didn’t think that ERF had improved driver comfort very much in almost 20 years.
Whatever the other shortcomings of the Leyland / AEC/ Albion Ergomatic cab, for me the actual driving position, forward vision, and ease of access to controls, switches etc. was the best I experienced.
My first artic in 74 was a AEC Mandator J reg, it had a bosch pump and pulled really well,excellent allround vison and I enjoyed driving it,
however it was not trouble free.The company I worked for had all different makes so once had to do a trip in a ERF A series 220 ■■■■■■■
9 speed fuller and I didn’t rate it at all.
Feb 75 saw lucky me with a new Volvo F88 290, a few months later while parked some knob dragged his trailer across the front corner
of the cab, while the repair was being carried out I was given The Big Pig.
L reg Atkinson 220 ■■■■■■■ 10 speed fuller (sorry Dennis no idea which rear axle) and I was quite surprised by how good it was, power
steering would have made it even better but this lorry was nigh on trouble free which is more than can be said for the 88.
So to answer the question, as a driver to drive it’s the AEC, but taking reliability into account it has to be the Atki.
I’ve not mentioned the Foden because I’ve had nothing at all to do with them, not even sat in one.
Cheers Norman.
Dog tired:
My first artic in 74 was a AEC Mandator J reg, it had a bosch pump and pulled really well,excellent allround vison and I enjoyed driving it,
however it was not trouble free.The company I worked for had all different makes so once had to do a trip in a ERF A series 220 ■■■■■■■
9 speed fuller and I didn’t rate it at all.
Feb 75 saw lucky me with a new Volvo F88 290, a few months later while parked some knob dragged his trailer across the front corner
of the cab, while the repair was being carried out I was given The Big Pig.
L reg Atkinson 220 ■■■■■■■ 10 speed fuller (sorry Dennis no idea which rear axle) and I was quite surprised by how good it was, power
steering would have made it even better but this lorry was nigh on trouble free which is more than can be said for the 88.
So to answer the question, as a driver to drive it’s the AEC, but taking reliability into account it has to be the Atki.
I’ve not mentioned the Foden because I’ve had nothing at all to do with them, not even sat in one.
Cheers Norman.
99:9 % sure it would have been a Kirkstall D85 “Dt” ! I suppose a driver’s interest stopped at the engine and gear box Cheers Dennis.
gingerfold:
I’m afraid that with the possible exception of spring brakes I can dis-prove most of those other claimed “firsts” for ERF. And of the other few remaining so called “firsts” they were only alternative suppliers to similar components already available from other manufacturers. I know that we all have our own favourite makes and models and as an author yourself Robert you will know how easy it is to get carried away with one’s own enthusiasm for the subject, and all authors are guilty of that at some time. However, the compiler of that list of “firsts” had not done his research thoroughly and claiming “firsts” in the automotive industry is one notorious minefield.
Fair comment, Graham! I have not attempted to verify any of those claims made by Dai Jones. Robert
A lot depended on where you lived , up in the Peak District Foden was king . with so many hills and long climbs the 12 speed box was the best option . I’ve driven Atkinson and Erf with david brown 6 speed boxes and with a 150 or 180 Gardner they were painful . Plus which Elsworth works wasn’t too far away . It wasn’t until the advent of ■■■■■■■ engines and fuller boxes that Atkinson and Erf began to cope with the terrain . Leyland in any guise never made much in the way of sales , only second hand . Dave
From drivers point of view, 70s Leyland, powerful warm n quieter compared to the big three. With DB 6 in em Foden 12sp every time. ■■■■■■■ /Fuller Akky, Erf but Octopus still better drive. If I was paying I wouldn’t have gone near the Leyland
rigsby:
A lot depended on where you lived , up in the Peak District Foden was king . with so many hills and long climbs the 12 speed box was the best option . I’ve driven Atkinson and Erf with david brown 6 speed boxes and with a 150 or 180 Gardner they were painful . Plus which Elsworth works wasn’t too far away . It wasn’t until the advent of ■■■■■■■ engines and fuller boxes that Atkinson and Erf began to cope with the terrain . Leyland in any guise never made much in the way of sales , only second hand . Dave
Absolutely with you there! The choice of gearboxes made a very significant difference to performance and productivity. Fuller 'boxes transformed the British truck industry IMHO simply because you could find an appropriate gear for every hazard, hill and eventuality (with a bit of judicious double de-clutching or leaving out the clutch altogether). The likes of other constant-mesh 'boxes such as Spicer, David Brown, ZF, and Foden were nowhere near as flexible. There is one weakness in my argument, however, and that is that I very strongly suspect that the Thornicroft-derived constant-mesh AEC 6-speed 'box would have satisfied me!. God grant me one drive of such a vehicle before my HGV licence runs out at the end of the year! Robert
I hope that you get your wish Robert.
With the Thorneycroft / AEC gearbox in both the AV505 models and AV760 models the setting up of the gear change linkage correctly was vital to get quick, slick changes. Setting the linkage only took minutes to do but the difference between correct and slightly out was remarkable. Another foible with the D197 overdrive 'box in Mercurys and Marshals was that after a long time in number 6 on a Motorway it was often difficult to actually get it out of number 6 and you had to knock the gear stick really hard to drop to number 5.