This is a you tube video of my atki and a few friends trucks
Get yer foot off that ■■■■ clutch pedal, driver! 
It’s about time we got another decent thread going on the site Nice Atki ex NCB which I doubt has done many miles lifetime on the job it was on so the Roller engine would have been OK,and the cheapest option of course! One thing that has caught my eye was the underslung rear springs on the rubbish Group axle!After they stopped using the old Kirkstall BDR axle I thought all the springs were overslung ?From memory all the Bewick tractors that didn’t have the BDR axle were overslung springs.However,this ex NCB Borderer must be the finest example of a near “as new” condition unit in the UK and is a credit to the owner,only a pity it didn’t have a ■■■■■■■ 220 and a decent axle,my opinion only others may think differently Bewick.
This is a shot of a new Borderer we got in late '73 and it has the Group axle with overslung springs as can by seen by the height of the spring hanger.Cheers Bewick.
Retired Old ■■■■:
Get yer foot off that ■■■■ clutch pedal, driver!
What do you mean? Drive with no clutch? As my foot is no where near the clutch when I have changed gear
Bewick:
It’s about time we got another decent thread going on the site
Cheap option? Really? If it was a 220 Rolls, then yes I would agree that they were the cheap option but 280 were far from cheap. The only group axle on this is on the front of the lurry. If you look at the view of the axle, anyone that knows their oats about the ‘rubbish group axles’ would know that the actuators are on the rear of the axle and not the front. The axle is a Kirkstall D85 under slung; same as the Venturer to take a 13t axle weight.
Some say that this axle was poor as well. If you have a bad driver that is always cooking the brakes it leads to oil seal failure in the hub reduction.
This truck is said to be one of the best preserved Atkinson - far from the shiniest but very original.
My current restoration project is an Atkinson. You will be pleased to know that it has front and rear Kirkstall Axles, Fuller box and 12l hummins. This is over slung and I hope to be able to sit in the seat.
Cheers Mr B
road-ranger:
Bewick:
It’s about time we got another decent thread going on the siteCheap option? Really? If it was a 220 Rolls, then yes I would agree that they were the cheap option but 280 were far from cheap. The only group axle on this is on the front of the lurry. If you look at the view of the axle, anyone that knows their oats about the ‘rubbish group axles’ would know that the actuators are on the rear of the axle and not the front. The axle is a Kirkstall D85 under slung; same as the Venturer to take a 13t axle weight.
Some say that this axle was poor as well. If you have a bad driver that is always cooking the brakes it leads to oil seal failure in the hub reduction.
This truck is said to be one of the best preserved Atkinson - far from the shiniest but very original.
My current restoration project is an Atkinson. You will be pleased to know that it has front and rear Kirkstall Axles, Fuller box and 12l hummins. This is over slung and I hope to be able to sit in the seat.
Cheers Mr B
Now then RR ! don’t “take a powder” your Atky is a credit to you and quite wrongly,but understandable,I assumed it was the very cheapest spec considering the minimal use it would have had in service with the NCB,however the underslung rear springs threw me completely,so here is a shot of one of the last Atky Borderers I bought which I believe would have been among the last built.I put it on the road in October '75 and it’s spec was ■■■■■■■ 220/Fuller RTO 610 and “overslung” D85 axle so why the difference between yours and ours ? Oh! I still didn’t rate the RR engine in whatever BHP it came in ! Very interesting though,any ideas RR ? Cheers Bewick.
The NCB vehicle iirc (correct me if I’m wrong Richard) has a 42t plate and heavier springs and so presumably that accounts for the different spec?
road-ranger:
Retired Old ■■■■:
Get yer foot off that ■■■■ clutch pedal, driver!What do you mean? Drive with no clutch? As my foot is no where near the clutch when I have changed gear
1min 21secs in.
You’ve been nobbled!
Agree with Bewick- it’s a fine looking motor.
Cheers Mr B
[/quote]
Now then RR ! don’t “take a powder” your Atky is a credit to you and quite wrongly,but understandable,I assumed it was the very cheapest spec considering the minimal use it would have had in service with the NCB,however the underslung rear springs threw me completely,so here is a shot of one of the last Atky Borderers I bought which I believe would have been among the last built.I put it on the road in October '75 and it’s spec was ■■■■■■■ 220/Fuller RTO 610 and “overslung” D85 axle so why the difference between yours and ours ? Oh! I still didn’t rate the RR engine in whatever BHP it came in ! Very interesting though,any ideas RR ? Cheers Bewick.
[/quote]
The reason for the Rolls was almost every wagon at the NCB Barnsley yard was a Roller. They had a few Atkis on general haulage with Rolls and two more 32t Atkis with 220 on the mines rescue. The 8leg Fodens that were used to generate the electric to power the big winder were Rolls powered with two big Rolls engines in the back of them. This is why the truck is a 280 rolls. I was put off the truck at the start with it having this engine but as I have aged I have come to realise the significance of this one off truck having a rare engine in a Atki. I only know of one other with a 280 and this is a 32t.
Like Fryske says she is a heavy weight and the over slung springs were just not up to the job. You may correct me now but if you go into a left hand bend fully grossed with the over slung you wondered if it would get round?
All the truck is beefed up and from the video you can see it has Dunlop Maxaret. I will take a walk around video one day to show all the differences.
Cheers Mr B
LONESOME GEORGE That is a very nice motor one very rare machine, 
-
any more vid or photos of it would be great .
The Front axle 
you say it has a seddon/atkinson group axle nnnnnnooooowwwwwww then if i remember
the last few Atkinson borderer tractor units that came to Waughs had the group front axle 
but on the other thread
no no they only come with capt kirk front axles was the reply from the BIG A clan 
-
so a live Atkinson with a group front axle this would prove the no axle thomasssss :wink: :wink: The only trouble with this super motor is its got the wrong engine in it should have 8-cylinders with 2 out the back -
but some BL truck builder had 39 give or take 1 stuck in some Guys i think Dennis knows who got them. -
8LXBV8BRIAN:
LONESOME GEORGE That is a very nice motor one very rare machine,
any more vid or photos of it would be great .
The Front axle
the last few Atkinson borderer tractor units that came to Waughs had the group front axle
no no they only come with capt kirk front axles was the reply from the BIG A clan
so a live Atkinson with a group front axle this would prove the no axle thomasssss :wink: :wink: The only trouble with this super motor is its got the wrong engine in it should have 8-cylinders with 2 out the back
but some BL truck builder had 39 give or take 1 stuck in some Guys i think Dennis knows who got them.
Will I can provide proof with photos if needed. I am not sure how any Atkis had this axle but this one has never had a new one.
You say I need a 8pot? I am not so sure about that. They needed the extra two cylinders to pull the weigh of the extra big block. Hehe, I am far from a gardener man but when I drove a 8 pot with a 9 speed fuller same as in the NCB truck I could not get a gear. Got to be lightning fast to change gears.
This has the makings of a great thread now we’ve got “Wor Hinney” Bri on the “case”,I am looking forward to the all around Vid of this rare Atky,as now we have established it had a 280 RR 
and an odd axle set up) will I be right in assuming 
that it had the Fuller 9509 box which was the same box that ONL482M had fitted behind it’s 220 ■■■■■■■ and not forgetting the “overslung” D85 axle !.As an aside seeing that the NCB unit was a “P” reg motor and the SED/ATK had been launched at this time I wonder why the NCB didn’t go for the same spec in the new model? maybe it was a special order 12 months previous ! Then again why didn’t Foden get the order considering all the 8 wheel Foden tippers the NCB ran.But I reckon Atkinsons built it out of all the old components they had left over from the Borderer production run and they did the NCB a “Special” price at the time and of course the unit would spend 99% of it’s time parked up in any case!Oh! and has it got the ZF power steering ? that yellow lump at the bottom end of the steering column looks curious ?If it hadn’t got P/steering it would have been no good sending it to Waugh Road Services ! They couldn’t turn the ■■■■■■■ wheel at less than 30 MPH !! Cheers Dennis.
Morning all, road-ranger, that is a lovely lorry, and so much the better for being original. Nice video as well, took me right back, especially as the door opens, that cab “welcomed you”, and I always found it quite spacious in the driving area…particularly coming from a few years driving Mr Fodens excellent products!
I remember the reaction of some of my French colleagues when I showed them an interior picture of that superb instrument cluster…made their eyes go round…a view that one could never tire of…bit like a road going Spitfire!
That D85, 13 ton axle with its diff lock was quite a reasonable axle, but really not designed for constant high speed running, (another similarity to the dear old Foden axle), really a heavy duty job. I am struggling to remember, but the Borderer, (■■■■■■■■■ that I supplied to Harry Whitehouse, of Dudley Earthmoving, for his low loader, went out with a Group axle, but he had so much trouble with it, that she was taken back by Ryland, (who had taken over Old Hill Motors), and the axle was swopped for a D85 13 ton. Harrys fleet had changed from D800 Fords, (and the D100 that I took off him against the Borderer), to 6x4 Searchers, (Gardners), with balloon tyres on the bogies, and scow end bodies. Someone will have a picture, (fryske)?
Im afraid that I have to disagree with Dennis, but I think that the excellent people at Shrewsbury finally got the Rolls product “right”, but sadly on the way there, (like so many manufacturers in the UK), the product was “proved”, at the operators expense. But in my experience Rolls were generous with their warranty terms. By the time that the product was available in Europe, it was sound, and was well accepted, and performed well. After all, it was the standard engine that ERF, and Leyland used for the French market…with only one being succesfull.
How do you get on with the Maxaret? The man who did so much development on that system, was the original design engineer for the Guy Wulfrunian air/disc brakes and suspension!
Lovely lorry, thanks for sharing, (and the others on the video)…
Im off to load up my Scarab, she is off to new pastures…and the LB76 goes tomorrow…so I am “sans Camions” now.
Cheerio for now.
This is the first brand new wagon I drove in 1960, It had a 4LW Gardner 5 speed overdrive David Brown gear box with a single speed Eaton axle, It was hard work driving it with 10 ton on its back, But the pay was good, It was a bottom gear job over Shap running from Manchester to Rutherglen, The brakes were Hydrovac over fluid and not very good at all, It also had problems with the rear brake drum breaking in half, I had many white knuckle days with it, But as I said the pay was good so I put up with it, The next new one I got was a Dodge with the tilt cab in 1966, It was a RR, Compared to the old Atki, Happy long gone days, Regards Larry.
Maybe RR/Perkins did eventually get their product sorted out but the engine I was mainly familiar with was the RR Eagle 220 and it was one noisey horrible bag of ■■■■■■■■ inherited a two year old Seddon 32/4 RR220 in a takeover and this motor was diabolical which is why you didn’t see many road hauliers running RR220’s in the 70’s.It was only the likes of the big Oil Co’s and the large super markets that could afford to run them. Saviem is quite right when he says that RR “developed” their engines in service and even though they had a generous warranty scheme a haulier wanted his motors running to maximum trouble free operation which the ■■■■■■■ and Gardner did provide with their respective reliable products! It didn’t matter how good the warranty provision was if you had a motor in the workshop,which shouldn’t in fact be there it would cause the traffic offices all kinds of trouble coping with the difficulties of un-planned and un-wanted down time caused by unreliable engines.Phew,enough,cheers Dennis.
Bewick:
This has the makings of a great thread now we’ve got “Wor Hinney” Bri on the “case”,I am looking forward to the all around Vid of this rare Atky,as now we have established it had a 280 RR
No power steering on any of the Atki’s at Waugh’s until the “N” reg’s arrived, or even a suspension seat. Regards Kev.
Bewick:
This has the makings of a great thread now we’ve got “Wor Hinney” Bri on the “case”,I am looking forward to the all around Vid of this rare Atky,as now we have established it had a 280 RR
No power steering on any of the Atki’s at Waugh’s until the “N” reg’s arrived, or even a suspension seat. Regards Kev.
Saviem:
Morning all, road-ranger, that is a lovely lorry, and so much the better for being original. Nice video as well, took me right back, especially as the door opens, that cab “welcomed you”, and I always found it quite spacious in the driving area…particularly coming from a few years driving Mr Fodens excellent products!I remember the reaction of some of my French colleagues when I showed them an interior picture of that superb instrument cluster…made their eyes go round…a view that one could never tire of…bit like a road going Spitfire!
That D85, 13 ton axle with its diff lock was quite a reasonable axle, but really not designed for constant high speed running, (another similarity to the dear old Foden axle), really a heavy duty job. I am struggling to remember, but the Borderer, (■■■■■■■■■ that I supplied to Harry Whitehouse, of Dudley Earthmoving, for his low loader, went out with a Group axle, but he had so much trouble with it, that she was taken back by Ryland, (who had taken over Old Hill Motors), and the axle was swopped for a D85 13 ton. Harrys fleet had changed from D800 Fords, (and the D100 that I took off him against the Borderer), to 6x4 Searchers, (Gardners), with balloon tyres on the bogies, and scow end bodies. Someone will have a picture, (fryske)?
Im afraid that I have to disagree with Dennis, but I think that the excellent people at Shrewsbury finally got the Rolls product “right”, but sadly on the way there, (like so many manufacturers in the UK), the product was “proved”, at the operators expense. But in my experience Rolls were generous with their warranty terms. By the time that the product was available in Europe, it was sound, and was well accepted, and performed well. After all, it was the standard engine that ERF, and Leyland used for the French market…with only one being succesfull.
How do you get on with the Maxaret? The man who did so much development on that system, was the original design engineer for the Guy Wulfrunian air/disc brakes and suspension!
Lovely lorry, thanks for sharing, (and the others on the video)…
Im off to load up my Scarab, she is off to new pastures…and the LB76 goes tomorrow…so I am “sans Camions” now.
Cheerio for now.
Courtesy of “Bison 2”
flic.kr/p/9T1U1i
kevmac47:
Bewick:
This has the makings of a great thread now we’ve got “Wor Hinney” Bri on the “case”,I am looking forward to the all around Vid of this rare Atky,as now we have established it had a 280 RRNo power steering on any of the Atki’s at Waugh’s until the “N” reg’s arrived, or even a suspension seat. Regards Kev.
PTY 349M Bertie (cup of rosie lee mate) Baker got this motor new Kev it was the first 14ltr 250/225 ■■■■■■■ 8-speed David brown gearbox group rear axle.
This was the 1st to have power steering and wellcome to the new devil the 8-speed david brown 
to go hand in hand with the S/A rear axle 
.