,anyway it’s now in hand but just thought I’d post it to help anyone who like me thought they were ok with packages of less than 1000L of diesel accompanied by a in date 2 kg dry powder . 
Thanks Dan,
Like you I thought it was OK, actually finding a good source of info to check these things is difficult to say the least. My boss has had some information from the RHA which i know was wrong so it was nice to be able to point him in this direction.
Hopefully he’ll find a course which qualifies for dcpc so we can tick two boxes and get something useful out of it.
We are doing a course tomorrow via zoom with thanks to a well known moderator not wanting to breach the tnuk advertising rules other routes are available 
The other thing I’ve learnt is empty & clean are 2 different meanings ,definitely something to look out for .
Punchy Dan:
The other thing I’ve learnt is empty & clean are 2 different meanings ,definitely something to look out for .
You will have to chuck your gas cooker and kettle in the skip too. I read it on Facebook
Wheel Nut:
Punchy Dan:
The other thing I’ve learnt is empty & clean are 2 different meanings ,definitely something to look out for .You will have to chuck your gas cooker and kettle in the skip too. I read it on Facebook
Not a chance when the gas fails I’ll get a log burner on the back
8wheels:
Thanks Dan,Like you I thought it was OK, actually finding a good source of info to check these things is difficult to say the least. My boss has had some information from the RHA which i know was wrong so it was nice to be able to point him in this direction.
Hopefully he’ll find a course which qualifies for dcpc so we can tick two boxes and get something useful out of it.
Hi 8wheels,
I’ve been telling anybody who’ll listen this exact thing since I joined the forum back in 2007.
I answered a post from your good self just here as you were my first enquirer on TN, and the question of ADR ‘awareness’ is point #7 in that post:
Although correct at the time of writing, a few of the details in that post are a little out of date now, but that was 13 years ago.
Folks can also see that I mention ADR ‘awareness’ in reply to just about every post asking about the various exemptions that ADR has to offer.
Yes it’s been a long battle!
It doesn’t help when those in charge seek their own advice from professional bodies and get advice which says otherwise. I’ve taken their advice and made it my defence if ever were to be called upon which it has not, as thankfully such movements are not common.
Using the example of a stop and prohibition has had greater effect as it clearly demonstrates the problems that we could run into.
Maybe it’ll get sorted who knows 
Punchy Dan:
0
Saw this yesterday it’s first time I’ve heard of it so for yrs now I’ve broken the law
What’s ADR awareness? Also what’s correct procedure?
So let’s say you have, twin tanks 1200L, and a 250L on the trailer, + gas canister’s for cooking. Or does this price law is Arsenal.
biggriffin:
Or does this price law is Arsenal.
A tad early to be drinking isn’t it my friend?
the maoster:
biggriffin:
Or does this price law is Arsenal.A tad early to be drinking isn’t it my friend?
Sorry to inform The Other fridge drive, that’s auto spelling gone wrong, should read “does this prove that law is a++e”
How are we sir haven’t seen you about your business of late…
biggriffin:
How are we sir haven’t seen you about your business of late…
Tickety and indeed boo my friend, not seen you out and about either. Shuntering next week so if you’re in I may just invest 20p into a machine for you.
As Dave has gone back in time to 2007. I recall a post that said you could connect a gas stove to 7 x 47kg propane cylinders as it was still under the 333kgs threshold
Providing you didn’t use it whilst loading or unloading was in process. 
My first Euro ADR truck had two 11kg propane cylinders on a bracket for the cab heater, one in use, and a full spare,
Bitumen tankers had a propane bottle and a gas torch to free the pipework, valves and vents.
the maoster:
biggriffin:
How are we sir haven’t seen you about your business of late…Tickety and indeed boo my friend, not seen you out and about either. Shuntering next week so if you’re in I may just invest 20p into a machine for you.
If I get sent there I will take you up on your generous offer, Think were doing about 3 loads a week from yours, was there 2/3 weeks ago.
biggriffin:
So let’s say you have, twin tanks 1200L, and a 250L on the trailer, + gas canister’s for cooking. Or does this price law is Arsenal.
Do you mean fuel tanks for the trucks engine, plus one for the fridge? If so they aren’t counted as its part of the vehicle and for use within the vehicle. Your gas canister doesn’t count either.
From memory, you can carry diesel seperately if its for equipment on the vehicle (upto a certain point). Eg: jerry cans of diesel for a portable generator without needing the ADR awareness thing.
From what Dave has said in the past, its basically down to your boss to sort out if you need ADR, so crack on…unless they ask you to drive a petrol tanker. 
(Scary thing is, I drive ADR pallets every night and I still can’t remember a lot of it ).
3 of us have done the course today via zoom it’s well worth doing if your don’t want full Adr but sometimes move things that come under exemption.Thanks to Dave 
8wheels:
Yes it’s been a long battle!
Indeed!!
8wheels:
It doesn’t help when those in charge seek their own advice from professional bodies and get advice which says otherwise.
Now here’s where I’m having trouble believing your boss.
Has he actually showed you this “advice” in writing? (which I’m guessing he hasn’t) because I’m really struggling to believe that any properly qualified advisor (a qualified DGSA who holds a current DGSA certificate) would give such advice.
I’m happy to help your boss with some free advice, so my opening shot is this:
ADR is an agreement that regulates the international transport of dangerous goods by Road, to which the UK is a member as are 50 other countries.
CDG 2009 (as amended) Regs. 3, 4 and 5 (which come from the UK government, regardless of Brexit or whether your boss agrees ) say that ADR has force of law for UK domestic dangerous goods transport.
ADR 1.3.1 requires ‘awareness’ training for drivers who don’t need an ADR card, as well as other workers (including your boss. 
)
ADR 1.3.2 specifies what needs to be covered by the awareness training
ADR 1.3.3 requires the awareness training to be documented and retained by the employer, but allows for you to be given a copy if you ask for it.
It’s now your boss’ turn to explain (with helpful references that he’ll get from his ‘advisor’ ) how I might be wrong in what I’ve said.
8wheels:
I’ve taken their advice and made it my defence if ever were to be called upon which it has not, as thankfully such movements are not common.Using the example of a stop and prohibition has had greater effect as it clearly demonstrates the problems that we could run into.
Maybe it’ll get sorted who knows
I’m glad that Dan found and posted that pic in his OP, because maybe now folks will realise that what I said in 2007 about ADR awareness training is true.
The good thing about this is that it is the responsibility of the vehicle owner to get this sorted, proven by the fact that the offence was dealt with by way of a prohibition.
IMHO it’s a slam-dunk prohibition that had CDG Reg.5 and ADR 1.3.1 written on it.
You won’t need a defence quite simply because you’re an employed driver, so it’s not your problem, because ADR says this about carrier responsibility…
ADR 1.4.2.2.1(a) Ascertain that the dangerous goods to be carried are authorized for carriage in accordance with ADR; (So that would include being in accordance with ADR 1.3.1 )
The only serious thing in all of this for the driver is that whilst the boss is dealing with getting the prohibition lifted, the driver might be late back home causing him to miss Emmerdale. </TIC mode>
biggriffin:
What’s ADR awareness?
Hi biggriffin,
ADR awareness is a legal minimum training requirement for people who have some sort of responsibility in connection with the carriage of dangerous goods by road.
Most people know that if a driver carries an ADR ‘regulated’ load, then he/she needs to be in possession of an ADR Card and the company must have, or have access to, a properly qualified DGSA.
When a company carries dangerous goods by one of the many ADR exemptions, then a lot of the normal ADR requirements either don’t apply at all, or only apply partially. That company probably doesn’t need a DGSA, and their staff and drivers will only need a non-accredited ADR ‘awareness’ training course rather than anything more formal.
ADR awareness training should be targeted at the company’s particular activities and the roles and responsibilities of the individual staff members to ensure that what they learn is relevant to what they do for their boss, but this includes the boss too… otherwise, how will he/she know how to be the boss?
biggriffin:
Also what’s correct procedure?
Sorry mate, but I’ve absolutely no idea what you’re asking here.
biggriffin:
So let’s say you have, twin tanks 1200L, and a 250L on the trailer, …
ADR has an exemption AND limit for up to 1,500 L (total) of fuel to be carried on the vehicle for the propulsion of the vehicle and the operation of equipment fitted to the vehicle. If you want/need to carry some of your allowed total of fuel on the trailer, a trailer can have a fuel tank of 500L or less.
biggriffin:
- gas canister’s for cooking.
A different exemption applies to a driver’s personal possessions, so your gas cannisters for cooking are OK, as is the gas in your ■■■/cooker lighter and all the lithium batteries in things like your mobile phone, sat-nav and laptop.
As a rough guideline, ADR is more focused on the actual load being carried.
Punchy Dan:
We are doing a course tomorrow via zoom with thanks to a well known moderator
Hi Dan,
I’ve been told that you’ve had safe delivery of the necessary ADR ‘awareness’ certificates, so it looks like the job is jobbed.
You can now carry on perfectly legally!!
dieseldave:
biggriffin:
What’s ADR awareness?Hi biggriffin,
ADR awareness is a legal minimum training requirement for people who have some sort of responsibility in connection with the carriage of dangerous goods by road.
Most people know that if a driver carries an ADR ‘regulated’ load, then he/she needs to be in possession of an ADR Card and the company must have, or have access to, a properly qualified DGSA.
When a company carries dangerous goods by one of the many ADR exemptions, then a lot of the normal ADR requirements either don’t apply at all, or only apply partially. That company probably doesn’t need a DGSA, and their staff and drivers will only need a non-accredited ADR ‘awareness’ training course rather than anything more formal.
ADR awareness training should be targeted at the company’s particular activities and the roles and responsibilities of the individual staff members to ensure that what they learn is relevant to what they do for their boss, but this includes the boss too… otherwise, how will he/she know how to be the boss?
biggriffin:
Also what’s correct procedure?Sorry mate, but I’ve absolutely no idea what you’re asking here.
biggriffin:
So let’s say you have, twin tanks 1200L, and a 250L on the trailer, …ADR has an exemption AND limit for up to 1,500 L (total) of fuel to be carried on the vehicle for the propulsion of the vehicle and the operation of equipment fitted to the vehicle. If you want/need to carry some of your allowed total of fuel on the trailer, a trailer can have a fuel tank of 500L or less.
biggriffin:
- gas canister’s for cooking.
A different exemption applies to a driver’s personal possessions, so your gas cannisters for cooking are OK, as is the gas in your ■■■/cooker lighter and all the lithium batteries in things like your mobile phone, sat-nav and laptop.
Thank you, I’m now better informed, than I was at the beginning of this thread. Everyday is a school day.
