…Peter,we have a couple of newbies in our depot,who have just passed their Class 1 tests,and simply have no idea how to reverse an artic,and i don’t mean a few shunts,just no clue on positioning or anything 
i helped one guy out the other day,and the other one has had to have intensive training.how they passed their Class 1 is a mystery,so in your opinion,is the test to easy?
The reverse on the CE test is a set piece which is exactly the same set up every time
Real life reversing is not
The principals involved are the same in all so it is down to whether the newbie has been taught those principals or simply been taught to pass the set piece
Having just passed my class 1 i can give some insight.
All the school taught me was how to do the manoeuvre for the test.
They didn’t teach me to reverse, just how to do this one manoeuvre.
Also, they use use props to do it instead of actually teaching you how to reverse.
A piece of tape on the bulkhead to watch out for. Drive along the line till you see the pole. Etc etc.
It in no way prepares you for the real world.
There are other aspects of the test that have the same issue.
You pass ya test and then go and learn to drive on the job.
I’m 18 days driving into my new job and still learning how to reverse.
Peter,we have a couple of newbies in our depot,who have just passed their Class 1 tests,and simply have no idea how to reverse an artic,and i don’t mean a few shunts,just no clue on positioning or anything
i helped one guy out the other day,and the other one has had to have intensive training.how they passed their Class 1 is a mystery,so in your opinion,is the test to easy?
As always, my honest opinion. We have imposed on us, an antiquated system of driver testing. This involves a purely negative regime of marking with no prospects of gaining any positive marks. I believe this is inherently wrong for starters - but it’s what we work with every day.
The reverse is often cited as something that isn’t taught properly, just the exercise, magic marks etc etc. And I’ve been listening to this for well over 40 years and nothing changes. And neither will it, unless the trainee really wants to learn to reverse and spend the money involved.
I have been conflicted for most of my career. I believe I’m in the cab to teach someone to drive a truck (including the reverse). The candidate, however, wants the quickest and cheapest route to a licence (in most cases). So we deliver the highest quality training possible within a timeframe often set by the market. The outcomes are consistently good, so we’re excellent at getting folks their licence.
I cannot pretend that everyone who has passed a test is not going to fight with reversing. This is an art that requires a lot of experience and practice. However, our candidates know more than simply the exercise as this is our method of training. But it wont train someone to reverse under all circumstances as this is the experience/practice thing.
I would love for everyone to have a course double the length of the current training. I have already extended our CE training course so it exceeds the industry standard. But, with the best will in the world, it’s asking a lot for a new pass to be able to reverse competently in all circumstances.
Clearly there are huge flaws in the DVSA system which knock on to equally huge flaws in training. I’ve done my best to ensure that folks are going to pass their test and have above average knowledge and competence.
For as long as we have this crazy driving test in place, the situation wont get better. The test, IMO, should be replaced by continual assessment by a qualified, registered instructor who should be able to sign off modules as competence is achieved. And, in my dream world, the reversing exercise would be scrubbed in favour of some more realistic, random reverses. But that’s not going to happen in my lifetime.
If anyone has got any serious, viable suggestions as to how to improve what we offer please let me know. And if there is something I can put in place, I will.
Pete 
When I was instructing CE artic I never used magic marker points for the test reverse and always found an industrial estate with an empty premises where a real life reverse could be done a few times
My method was frowned upon by the old hands but proved to be a lot more useful to the trainees
PS - letting both trainees (2 to 1) have a play together on the reversing area with me some distance away have a coffee break worked wonders as well
PS - letting both trainees (2 to 1) have a play together on the reversing area with me some distance away have a coffee break worked wonders as well
I’m sure the insurance company would approve lol!
Pete
Peter Smythe:
PS - letting both trainees (2 to 1) have a play together on the reversing area with me some distance away have a coffee break worked wonders as well
I’m sure the insurance company would approve lol!
Pete
Never a problem with it but it was on an airfield
As I said in my original response, our trainees do more reversing than just the exercise. It’s built in to our method of training and, without doubt, aids the success in the exercise.
Having a site the size we have, we dont need to go to industrial estates to find suitable practice places. It’s all on site.
For anyone who’s interested, we have another Open Day on Saturday 12th September. Because of the care we’re taking to keep everyone safe during the pandemic, we ask that folks call and make an appointment. This will avoid the site being swamped and will help us maintain Covid protocols.
Just call 01623 555661 during normal office hours and arrange your time. Get to have a go at reversing an artic. Nothing serious - just a bit of fun. Meet some of the team and ask as many questions as you like. You’ll get to see the site and I strongly recommend folks do this before booking.
There are huge differences in standards so well worth doing the legwork.
Take care all, Pete
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thanks for the replies everyone seems like newbies will struggle for a long time with reversing then,unless they are prepared to pay for extra training.our yard is a bit of a nightmare,and at busy periods someone struggling to get on a bay brings the yard to a halt,and the shunter has steam coming out of his ears another problem is,stopping for a break at Motorway Services,where often it requires a reverse in between other vehicles,with other lorries waiting to get by.the lad i helped out,says he just stops for a break in lay-by’s!
I think you’ve summed it up, sadly. Our trainees are capable of parking between a couple of vehicles - given room to line up first. And I’m very well aware that this isn’t always the case. Then add in the pressure of other vehicles waiting etc and it will undoubtedly go wrong.
As I said earlier, I would love to teach more reversing. I would also like to spend longer on the road. But I am reconciled to the fact that folks are really interested in gaining their licence. And, unfortunately, not much more.
But if anyone would like to prove me wrong, please contact me.
Pete
I believe it’s the costs involved that people want shorter training. I took 20hrs with PSTT and while for cat C it was more than enough, it turned out that for CE it wasn’t. It was either not enough time for me or I’m not meant to drive artics…
Good to hear from you.
It was either not enough time for me or I’m not meant to drive artics…
… or bad luck on the day. And there’s no remedy for that. From your records, it’s clear you are meant to drive artics!
Pete
I can sympathise with the parking at MSA’s.
I still need 2 empty spaces together at most places. I avoid the ones where i know this to be an issue.
Done 18 days actual driving so far, so not worried, it will come in time.
I found the test reverse hard (class C only, passed with pete first time) but found real life better when you have a large wagon or trailer next to you, seemed easier than just aiming at bay markings, but everyone’s different. Looking forward to doing CE as well as a little scared [emoji6]
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I learnt very little from the test reverse because it isn’t something you need to do very often in that form.
I spent two days driving with an old hand that had worked as a shunted for two years in a very tight yard. Learnt more about going backwards then than in the whole if my Cat C and CE training.
The above isn’t in any way a dig at the trainers. They can only work with the syllabus they are given and throw a few extra bits in where time permits.
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Peter Smythe:
I cannot pretend that everyone who has passed a test is not going to fight with reversing. This is an art that requires a lot of experience and practice. However, our candidates know more than simply the exercise as this is our method of training. But it wont train someone to reverse under all circumstances as this is the experience/practice thing.
Pete
I don’t think there is any difference between any of the vehicle tests in this approach. We all see the daily struggles people who do not have the aptitude for reverse parking in cars. And motorcycle riders come to their nemesis, sooner rather than later. The status quo, as in most walks of life in the uk, seems to follow the ethos of rights versus responsibilities, while deeming driving as everyone’s right.
To raise the responsibility level in some areas over others does make sense, and does work out in practice, hence the higher requirements for different driving classes.
If employers are finding their recruits are not to their particular standards, either they should top up their recruits training to their personal requirements or lobby the government, MP etc to have better standards in place. In the university system, employers will help design the courses to produce the required recruits.
Personally, I believe the person’s aptitude at ‘art’ or skill should be testable, recognised and rewarded, and are done so in some companies. But like so many things in life, it’s a nice to have, but usually deemed unnecessary in financial terms, so it does not fundamentally make difference over time.
#newbie #firstpost #careerchange
Fair point to be honest . As a new pass class 2 on my reversing manoeuvre I was taught to watch for the poles , marks on the ground when to stop etc , it 100% helps you pass and makes it easier to not mess up but also not a real world scenario either . As Peter said it’s been like that way for many years doubt that will change now although it should in my opinion.
For my Class 1 I had a different instructor each day and each had their own way of doing it. 
I agree with others, you’re simply taught to pass the test-specific manoeuvre which has little bearing on real life.
As has been said by many others before, in respect of just about every field of endeavour: you learn to pass the exam(s) then you begin to learn how to do the job.