Please only offer an answer if you definitely know about the following for sure! Thank you.
A 3.5 ton + Trailer, large or small…
As I understand as soon as you add a trailer, even if it’s empty you have the potential to exceed 3.5 ton and therefore you must operate a tacho when it’s attached.
You are out of scope without a trailer but still need to keep records and you must record on a tacho when in scope and with the trailer attached?
A restricted operators licence and a CPC holder + operating centre would be required?
Drivers CPC?
This is all for reward ie in the line with a commercial business operating within and beyond 50km
A definitive answer would be helpful, sometimes there are many conflicting answers and it can become more confusing.
I don’t know, but your question reminded me of a very similar one that I wanted to ask:
I passed one of these mega-caravans today - artic-style being pulled by a pickup on a 5th wheel in the load bay. Are these covered by B+E, or do they need C1E? Also, how do the brakes work, as I presume they’re not on the usual overrun style?
All correct except for the restricted o licence ,a normal one is needed ,there is no requirement for restricted licences on 3.5 t plus trailer .and no dcpc is not needed .delivering own goods no olicence ,carrying other parties goods as in hire and reward then olicence required.
Dan Punchard:
All correct except for the restricted o licence ,a normal one is needed ,there is no requirement for restricted licences on 3.5 t plus trailer .and no dcpc is not needed .delivering own goods no olicence ,carrying other parties goods as in hire and reward then olicence required.
If the trailer is over 1020kg unladen a restricted o-licence is still needed for own account use. Although there is an exemption from all o-licence requirements if the tow vehicle qualifies as dual purpose.
global:
Please only offer an answer if you definitely know about the following for sure! Thank you.
A 3.5 ton + Trailer, large or small…
As I understand as soon as you add a trailer, even if it’s empty you have the potential to exceed 3.5 ton and therefore you must operate a tacho when it’s attached.
You are out of scope without a trailer but still need to keep records and you must record on a tacho when in scope and with the trailer attached?
Obviously yes for the latter. My interpretation is that you do not need to if you start a fresh week and then do not use the vehicle in scope. Most people seem to use a paper diary based system to record other work. If you are outside of o-licencing and doing no other in scope driving other than very occasional towing then I think you would be unlikely to run into serious trouble provided card/chart is in when towing.
A restricted operators licence and a CPC holder + operating centre would be required?
No provided the trailer is less than 1020kg unladen - might be flexibility to remove bits of trailer within reason. CPC holders are not required for restricted licences only hire and reward.
Drivers CPC?
No drivers CPC does not affect B category driving
This is all for reward ie in the line with a commercial business operating within and beyond 50km
A definitive answer would be helpful, sometimes there are many conflicting answers and it can become more confusing.
global:
2. You are out of scope without a trailer but still need to keep records
Easiest way is to use the digi tacho in OUT OF SCOPE or write that on an analogue as it saves keeping separate types of records and at a roadside check it makes the process quicker
scaniason:
I don’t know, but your question reminded me of a very similar one that I wanted to ask:
I passed one of these mega-caravans today - artic-style being pulled by a pickup on a 5th wheel in the load bay. Are these covered by B+E, or do they need C1E? Also, how do the brakes work, as I presume they’re not on the usual overrun style?
Gary
I am pretty certain they are B+E although have never bothered checking with having C+E. They have air brakes with the same two line system as trucks. American ones are usually electric but I believe they have to be swapped to air as not compliant for use here although suspect they are perfectly safe in the scheme of things.
As I understand as soon as you add a trailer, even if it’s empty you have the potential to exceed 3.5 ton and therefore you must operate a tacho when it’s attached.
scaniason:
I don’t know, but your question reminded me of a very similar one that I wanted to ask:
I passed one of these mega-caravans today - artic-style being pulled by a pickup on a 5th wheel in the load bay. Are these covered by B+E, or do they need C1E? Also, how do the brakes work, as I presume they’re not on the usual overrun style?
Gary
I am pretty certain they are B+E although have never bothered checking with having C+E. They have air brakes with the same two line system as trucks. American ones are usually electric but I believe they have to be swapped to air as not compliant for use here although suspect they are perfectly safe in the scheme of things.
If the vehicle is cat B but the trailer is over 3500kg MAM then its now C1+E due to the EU directive which came into force on 19/01/2013 … the problem is that DVLA have not informed all those who passed B+E after 1996 and do not have a C1+E
As I understand as soon as you add a trailer, even if it’s empty you have the potential to exceed 3.5 ton and therefore you must operate a tacho when it’s attached.
Bit irrelevant to the case being discussed but there is now one recent exception to the O licence rule in regards to combined MAM weights and that is where the vehicle has a GTW listed which does not exceed 3.5 tonnes - I think that is only for the UK as its a DVSA thing
scaniason:
I don’t know, but your question reminded me of a very similar one that I wanted to ask:
I passed one of these mega-caravans today - artic-style being pulled by a pickup on a 5th wheel in the load bay. Are these covered by B+E, or do they need C1E? Also, how do the brakes work, as I presume they’re not on the usual overrun style?
Gary
I am pretty certain they are B+E although have never bothered checking with having C+E. They have air brakes with the same two line system as trucks. American ones are usually electric but I believe they have to be swapped to air as not compliant for use here although suspect they are perfectly safe in the scheme of things.
If the vehicle is cat B but the trailer is over 3500kg MAM then its now C1+E due to the EU directive which came into force on 19/01/2013 … the problem is that DVLA have not informed all those who passed B+E after 1996 and do not have a C1+E
I did have a feeling there was an issue with pre/post 1997 licences. Thanks for clarifying.
As I understand as soon as you add a trailer, even if it’s empty you have the potential to exceed 3.5 ton and therefore you must operate a tacho when it’s attached.
global.
This is the disadvantage with, I’m presuming a 3.5ton van. With something like a dual-purpose pick up it may only have a GVW of around 2.5t so there is room to add a trailer without taking the whole combination over 3.5t.
