Transport operators+ Hgv drivers ignorance legal requirement

I tell you what mr ross, I should think you are very lucky to have a job driving at present, I do have some simplify with your dealings with esl, but after reading the appeals you have made I personally would of just got on with my life, and put things down to an experience not to go through again.

the use of poa is laid down in e.u law, we might not like it but its there, and to be honest there ain’t a lot the british legal system can do about it.

to a lot of us its a valuable tool to some its a complete waste of time, to which party each person falls into is their decision, but like most legislation that comes out of Brussels it can be used and abused in equal measure, I personally use it very little but as a tramper still manage to keep my hours down with the correct use of the break/rest mode.

I personally don’t agree with your statement that most drivers knowingly or unknowingly break the law, as we are probably the most monitored occupation in the country, but hey its a free country and you can think what you like just don’t try to tar everyone with your brush :open_mouth: :open_mouth: :sunglasses: :sunglasses: :sunglasses:

The spirit and intention of the working time regulations 2005 was to impliment standards that would create a work life ballance.
It would require that hgv drivers work a reasonable amount of duty time,say about 60 hours max an a average of about 48.5 hours
Implementation would have required more hgv drivers and the current drivers working less duty time.
Wages would increase whilst working time or duty time would have to decrease.
Compliance would be very troublesome indeed for operators.

Thats where P O A steps in and the willing HGV diver who throws away his well deserved rights.

The law suggests that 48 hours average over set reference periods, and allows the use of P O A to reduce overall working time.

The Problem is that the interpretation by operators and drivers of periods of availabilty is wrong and most likely illegal.

I think that whilst working any employer or agent it is always best to comply with the requirments of laws that govern the workplace/workforce.

Looking at the working time regulations I interpret parts to imply that the maximum working time or duty time implies a maximum of 60 hours in any 1 week.Yet many drivers are recording up to and over 80 hours a week.

Most drivers I have spoken to have said they are glad to be retiring soon from the job and would not suggest the same job to family
If you get the publics point of view on H G V drivers and there working practice,most think that drivers cant fiddle as they have a tachograph that stops them.
All I would like is for H G V drivers and operators to start recording there correct work data.
Carry on as normal but only record your driving breaks, 45 mins at 4.5 hours.
Stop leaving the tachograph on P O A mode or rest mode when tipping/loading or any other duties.
waiting time and on call time at the workstation is other work.
The workstation is the Cab and the yard and also customer site.
To be honest there will be very little P O A unless your a tramper.
Im sure if operators and drivers got together they could accept that the transport sector is not complying with the spirit or intentions of the regulations and we could move on from there.
It just seems a shame to see so many accidents involving H G V drivers and to pretend that working time has nothing to do with the cause.

“the use of poa is laid down in e.u law, we might not like it but its there, and to be honest there ain’t a lot the british legal system can do about it”
Its not the legal system that has to do anything.
Its for operators and drivers to comply with the requirments of the regulations.
If operators or driver get that wrong it is the British legal system that will correct that.

If you lock a prisoner in a dingy cell with only a chair and a table, they will fall asleep, it makes the time pass quicker. When you sit a driver in a plastic chair with 3 others who are all trying to tell the greatest story ever told, the sensible driver will close his eyes, but he is not sleeping, he is just sick of the monotonous droning. After making a driver wait in this room for up to 6 hours, he is suddenly supposed to be able to wake up like a machine and work for a further 4 hours without a proper meal or refreshment. On top of that the cab phone is ringing constantly chasing the drivers progress even though he is stood still on the M25 because someone jumped off a bridge, maybe another driver who had endured the 6 hour waiting room punishment. Refreshment is more than food and drink, it is something you can do to relax, chill out, have a shower or go for a stroll, none of which you can do in an RDC

It is the monotonous droning that makes drivers unsafe.

Waiting at a R D C is on call and standy so is legally considered WORKING TIME.
unless you can go for a stroll

So if you cant go for a healthy stroll its not a P O A.
of course you can remain in the cab if you think thats better for you.

http://www.thelorrylawyer.com/for-managers/transport/drivers-hours-and-drivers/driver-fatigue/

Please see above link to understand fatigue and its link to long hours at work like hanging arround like you have no place better to be.

A breach of working time is a criminal offence.
by 2020 digital tachos will be wifi and vosa will not need to stop vehicles to enforce.

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I’ve fixed the link, but putting a tick in the ‘disable BBCode box’ does exactly that… it disables the BBCode and so stops the link from working. dd.