gingerfold: Please let me know what you think and what I can expect in real life
He didn’t last 12 months before failing.
I understand that it’s bad out there, if we look at it this way there isn’t a lot money in anything now building, trucking, groundwork, all businesses are struggling.
I’ve read bout stoby and it doesn’t surprise me they are going down from what I see the next could be wincanton, xpo, maritime etc big companies need big revenue they drove the rates way down by undercutting similar companies working their trucks for pennies cuz they had thousands of them.
I’m one man band I work for myself pay myself and clean my truck the way I look at it so maybe just maybe I can afford to have a truck maintain it make same Maney just like as I am employed and be happy with what I do or is this too much to ask for.
For now I don’t have driver’s fleet of trucks offices and yards to pay for.
Back in the day everything was more profitable simple reason less competition now even employed u have to fight for what’s right for you were just numbers anywhere we are.
To summarise this whole essey, do all of you gents kind enought to take part in this conversation think it’s not worth while and wouldn’t do it or think of stopping trading.
Is this the advice you would give don’t bother cause it’s hard or impossible to make some money and make a living??
I do traction only @ £1.50 a mile, spend 50% of the week running light, no TM to pay, no rent for yard to pay, no trailer hire charges ,i also get paid weekly and the company i sub for rang me to come and work for them, truck gets maintained by a main dealer, yes i make a decent living but i.ve also put up with a lot of ■■■■ in the 20yrs as an owner driver
I’ll also be putting in for my ops licence. You will find a lot won’t talk to you until you do kwn. Do it chief, out of interest, I notice you said 3 units, and your running the numbers, how are you financing it? Buying a £6k unit?new rental? Insurance lump sum or monthly etc etc
Mattwoodtransport:
I’ll also be putting in for my ops licence. You will find a lot won’t talk to you until you do kwn. Do it chief, out of interest, I notice you said 3 units, and your running the numbers, how are you financing it? Buying a £6k unit?new rental? Insurance lump sum or monthly etc etc
Will be applying for 3 but I will run one at first mate don’t want to go all crazy when starting if all goes well maybe rest of them will follow it’s better to plan ahead instead of making changes later besides come new year and the amount of money you need for each unit goes up so better do it right away and yes the first unit and trailer will be fairly cheap looking don’t want a massive bill to cover while starting no hire purchase or leasing too expensive
gingerfold: Please let me know what you think and what I can expect in real life
You asked in your original post. Several posters have replied and apparently you don’t like what they say. Being good with numbers is one thing, being good at road transport is something else entirely. To put it at it’s most basic the job is on the bones of its arse, and I go back to 1968 when I first started work, so I’ve experienced good times and bad. Nowadays it is bad. No doubt you will be aware of the current Stobart saga; I can name another dozen major companies that are in a similar predicament. At the other end of the scale smaller companies are struggling like never before. All of these are factoring their invoices the minute they get PoDs back from drivers, just to keep cash flow coming in daily to meet weekly wages and fuel bills.
There was a new start up on TN about 12 months ago. He was “good at figures” and had spread sheets for anything and everything. I never bothered to post any replies on his thread because from what I read I knew that he hadn’t a prayer of surviving. He didn’t last 12 months before failing.
I’m terrible at numbers, my entire financial strategy was wage plus fuel should be 50% of costs. Unlike the chap gingerfold mentioned with his spreadsheets, whose posts I could only just follow. I was quite good at operations though and went from a van to a mixed fleet of 20 vehicles, various trailers and 25 staff. I put it down to hard work, luck and moving into specialist work.
At one time haulage was the second most likely to fail business sector and I wouldn’t he surprised to find nothing has changed. People come into the business, find the money isnt stacking up and in desperation run at sub par rates and the circle continues. You need to find the rate at which you can make a decent living and then find someone to pay it. I can tell you what my rate was before I retired but without context, the sector I was in, the set up of the business, it doesnt tell you a thing.
I cant say dont do it because I did, and it was a good company, but the truth is you are highly unlikely to do anything more than make an average wage with a lot more hassle.
Mattwoodtransport:
I’ll also be putting in for my ops licence. You will find a lot won’t talk to you until you do kwn. Do it chief, out of interest, I notice you said 3 units, and your running the numbers, how are you financing it? Buying a £6k unit?new rental? Insurance lump sum or monthly etc etc
Will be applying for 3 but I will run one at first mate don’t want to go all crazy when starting if all goes well maybe rest of them will follow it’s better to plan ahead instead of making changes later besides come new year and the amount of money you need for each unit goes up so better do it right away and yes the first unit and trailer will be fairly cheap looking don’t want a massive bill to cover while starting no hire purchase or leasing too expensive
Some harsh but sadly true insights into your planned haulage venture…
Work - unfortunately no one with work available will speak to you seriously without your new operator’s licence in your hand.
Truck - unfortunately you will have no ability to get any finance or leasing on a truck or trailer as a startup with zero history so needs to be cash.
Running - unfortunately you will struggle to get a fuel card will need a cash buffer to fuel your wagon for a bit
Question - how much ready cash do you have available to invest in starting your business?
Reason for asking - if you don’t have at least £25k you won’t be running anything apart from a bath unfortunately.
Mattwoodtransport:
I’ll also be putting in for my ops licence. You will find a lot won’t talk to you until you do kwn. Do it chief, out of interest, I notice you said 3 units, and your running the numbers, how are you financing it? Buying a £6k unit?new rental? Insurance lump sum or monthly etc etc
Will be applying for 3 but I will run one at first mate don’t want to go all crazy when starting if all goes well maybe rest of them will follow it’s better to plan ahead instead of making changes later besides come new year and the amount of money you need for each unit goes up so better do it right away and yes the first unit and trailer will be fairly cheap looking don’t want a massive bill to cover while starting no hire purchase or leasing too expensive
Some harsh but sadly true insights into your planned haulage venture…
Work - unfortunately no one with work available will speak to you seriously without your new operator’s licence in your hand.
Truck - unfortunately you will have no ability to get any finance or leasing on a truck or trailer as a startup with zero history so needs to be cash.
Running - unfortunately you will struggle to get a fuel card will need a cash buffer to fuel your wagon for a bit
Question - how much ready cash do you have available to invest in starting your business?
Reason for asking - if you don’t have at least £25k you won’t be running anything apart from a bath unfortunately.
Best of luck Drive…and I mean that…
Scannyfanny
Thanks for the insider
I am aware of all the things you have mentioned if I didn’t have cash in hand would not even dream of starting this venture will be hard at first just have to make smart choices o licence application filed so now all I have to do is start making phone calls and see who will talk to me.
A lot say don’t do it, not worth it etc. but did they even try or had a company?(few maybe) Reasons would be they don’t want any more competitor starting, some got rental s650 and run £1.40 says no money in it, some are just owner driver not have the business mind. If you have goals, no one will stop you to get it done. Go for it. I’m also awaiting my o licence, under consideration.
Some say no one will talk to you without licence, it’s a big myth. I have many offers already (not just maritime or bwd). £1.55 traction, over £2 for ad-hoc work…Fuel card, I already received 2 cards 7 days payment term. Finance for truck, many rejected, but found 2 company to offer finance and secured one with holding deposit now until o licence arrive.
At my last company we have other subbies parked and one of them started in 2016 now have around 15unit only traction work.
Another thing is the business has potential to increase, what increase would drivers get being employed?? Whole life drive for someone make their dream come true, but think too risky to start something on their own…pffff.
Also, for the people who says “I was lucky” the luck didnt find you, you work so hard and found your own luck…
Andrey1:
A lot say don’t do it, not worth it etc. but did they even try or had a company?(few maybe) Reasons would be they don’t want any more competitor starting, some got rental s650 and run £1.40 says no money in it, some are just owner driver not have the business mind. If you have goals, no one will stop you to get it done. Go for it. I’m also awaiting my o licence, under consideration.
Some say no one will talk to you without licence, it’s a big myth. I have many offers already (not just maritime or bwd). £1.55 traction, over £2 for ad-hoc work…Fuel card, I already received 2 cards 7 days payment term. Finance for truck, many rejected, but found 2 company to offer finance and secured one with holding deposit now until o licence arrive.
At my last company we have other subbies parked and one of them started in 2016 now have around 15unit only traction work.
Another thing is the business has potential to increase, what increase would drivers get being employed?? Whole life drive for someone make their dream come true, but think too risky to start something on their own…pffff.
Also, for the people who says “I was lucky” the luck didnt find you, you work so hard and found your own luck…
Since I included luck, I’ll answer that.
Luck is not having an engine out of warranty blow up half a million Miles before it should.
Luck is not having a previously stable customer suddenly develop financial problems leaving you with unpaid invoices.
Yes hard work plays a huge part, I can barely remember my late 20s and early 30s. But you cant ignore good or bad luck.
You say most people on here havent done it, well I have. I did it for 28 years, built up a firm, retired early, owed no one anything when I finished and made a far better than average profit margin whilst paying the highest wages in my little sector. So if i were you, i would take notice of what I say as I start in this strange business.
iguana:
I’m assuming the offered £1.40/mile is the laden miles?
Can’t see how that could work profit wise at all personally.
I think you didnt get my point. Someone rent s650 or other higher spec unit for about £500/600 a week rental. Doing easy container work, the type who only drive and open back door, around £1.40 ,eat out every day/night.Obviously he/she wont see any profit in their business and says the industry ■■■■■ no money in it.
Then, another one pays around £300 week for finance/maintenance for their unit. Sub for 1.50-1.60 cook/bring their own food, finds ind est.for night outs. Not putting kelsa bars everywhere etc… He/She will see profit coming in. Two different type of people and business mind. Hope it’s clear.
I see theres enthusiasm in the ones starting and a bit of tiredness it those who retired or been in the industry for years and seen the good days.
Bottom line is from what i see its possible to make a living out of this and the profits depend on how you manage the budget and your business.
Everyone agrees its hard work and its your choice if you sell your self cheap.
I see there’s not much help from other hauliers as someone once said its a dog eats dog type of industry.
Thanks all for the replys really appreciate it.
Im a stubborn guy and will have to find out on my own.
albion:
I cant say dont do it because I did, and it was a good company, but the truth is you are highly unlikely to do anything more than make an average wage with a lot more hassle.
I dont think it is tiredness, its experience.
Bad form to quote oneself, but I’ll repeat, I wont say dont do it, but be aware that you are unlikely to do more than make a wage.
The same applies to me when I started. The job has always been hard. I can go back to my Dad and his tipper in the late 60s and they weren’t the good old days for sure, in fact they were probably the same, some atrocious rates and a lot of competition. Only difference is that my Dad wouldn’t be spendingbsll day Sunday fixing the truck now because they are too complicated and/or need software.
The advice again, dont get overly bogged down in numbers. I never did, I literally worked on how the business felt overall and in the day to day, wages +fuel should come to around roughly 50% of your charge for you to stay viable. If they are less, then that is good. To this day I wouldn’t have a clue how to do a spreadsheet.
Good with numbers i meant i can use a calculator, good numbers don’t really apply to real life its that gut feeling and the understanding of the job i think.
Your advice on fuel and wages being 50%
Makes more sence to me than the miles rate.
When it comes to truck maitenance i like to get my hands dirty so will try to save couple of quid by doing what i can myself.
I need clear advice from people like you and im listening to it, its not like i just want to hear that yeah its nice and easy lots of money in this etc
All those comments are appreciated and definitely make valuable info for me.
All of you gents have more experience and thats why i asked try to understand i was always a driver self employed or employee so my employer never informed me about the sort of money he was making or how much he charged per mile loaded empty when what where so excuse me for not understanding. I’ve applyed for the licence myself cuz no one seems to be kind enough to help without makeing money.
So trying to cut cost from day one and i will continue to do that.
All i wanted to know maybe what jobs are ok or not how are jobs priced miles or per load is it one way both ways. What’s better getting a curtain or aiming for traction only, simple stuff its not like im asking for your costumers contact number. And now guys look at those posts and tell me what you see.
KWN86:
All i wanted to know maybe what jobs are ok or not how are jobs priced miles or per load is it one way both ways. What’s better getting a curtain or aiming for traction only, simple stuff its not like im asking for your costumers contact number. And now guys look at those posts and tell me what you see.
We were a specialist explosives haulier, a sector for which there are huge barriers to entry, especially as a new start. I cant give advice on what is the best work because I only know my own.
In my world I priced round trip on mileage. Specialised kit means that unless I was doing more bang, the truck and the drivers were better back at base and loading to head out. As you are going to be getting what you can, ie general, I expect your rate will be one way only and you will have to find a back load to make the job pay. PPM, around 2.50 all miles, but there were a lot of things I got for free as I operated from a customers site for one of the bases. So in effect I chipped the rate to cover the fact I wasnt paying out for a yard and an office etc.
Traction or curtain, the best one is the one that returns the best profit. It varies so much, but my preference was always to run my own trailers. I havent seen a traction only rate that i thought was good, though as i say, it isnt something i know a lot about.
You need to have work direct from a customer, anything else and you are lining a clearing houses’ pockets.
hi madam, hope you are well, well you have confirmed what I always thought as in the specialised industry you operated in.
the advice you have given is spot on and luck is a big part of it as you said …
Boating going well, not been out recently, but head down to the marina 3 days a week. Seem to get good people on narrow boats, friendly, helpful, mo side to them. Highly recommend getting one or hiring one for a holiday.
One thing i will add is that you can do all the mileage calculations you want and come up with a ppm you want to charge, the thing is in general haualge you will find its the customer that sets the rate ,not you
