Take it to small claims court. I know of 2 ladies who werent paid when the tea room they worked at went belly up and thats what they did
Conor:
Socketset:
If you worked full time for this bloke and he was your only source of income you’ve broken IR35 - simples.Once again for the hard of hearing…
IR35 ONLY APPLIES TO PEOPLE OPERATING AS LIMITED COMPANIES.
If you’re not self employed operating as a Ltd Company then IR35 does not apply. IR35 legislation was brought in to reduce the amount of money HM Treasury were losing by contractors working effectively as “disguised employees” set up as Ltd Companies using the low income and dividend method of paying themselves to avoid tax and employer/employee NI which in many cases was costing the Treasury £10k or more per person per year. If you’re not a Ltd Company you cannot use this method of paying yourself which is why IR35 legislation doesn’t apply.
Hard of hearing? You mean sight. If, you are going to waffle get it right.
Conor:
Noremac:
Doing a tax return by the January after a tax year ends and paying appropriate tax is the OP’s private business and is a separate issue from being paid for work done in the first place.No it isn’t. The only money the government has to spend is tax payers money and borrowing our savings. Someone not paying their fair share of tax puts more of a burden on the rest of us. Someone who is not only not paying their tax but illegally claiming means tested benefits based on the income they declare is putting an even larger burden on.
Suffice to say that a lot of people working full time hours as “self employed”, not as a Ltd company and with a nod and a wink, no terms of business, not invoicing for their work are on the fiddle.
Why don’t you start a thread about that then in Bully’s?
I’ve just read the OP’s post again, and I don’t see anything mentioned about not registering as self-employed and not returning a tax return. As far as I can see the thread is about being paid or not and whether to work out the expected notice period or not.
In any case, if the OP started working on a self-employed basis just over a year ago, then most of the work is still in the current tax year and self-assessment returns would be due at the end of January 2024 for 2022-23.
Conor:
Socketset:
If you worked full time for this bloke and he was your only source of income you’ve broken IR35 - simples.Once again for the hard of hearing…
IR35 ONLY APPLIES TO PEOPLE OPERATING AS LIMITED COMPANIES.
If you’re not self employed operating as a Ltd Company then IR35 does not apply.
I’m set up as limited company,but you’ve lost me here,does IR35 only apply to limited companies or not…? I have a good accountant,so I just let him sort everything for me.Or is it just a typo error.
164480:
Conor:
Socketset:
If you worked full time for this bloke and he was your only source of income you’ve broken IR35 - simples.Once again for the hard of hearing…
IR35 ONLY APPLIES TO PEOPLE OPERATING AS LIMITED COMPANIES.
If you’re not self employed operating as a Ltd Company then IR35 does not apply.
I’m set up as limited company,but you’ve lost me here,does IR35 only apply to limited companies or not…? I have a good accountant,so I just let him sort everything for me.Or is it just a typo error.
Corrected:
If you are self employed, not operating as a Ltd Company then IR35 does not apply.
corij:
Take it to small claims court. I know of 2 ladies who werent paid when the tea room they worked at went belly up and thats what they did
A small claims court will require proof of why the money you’re claiming is owed and what the terms of payment were. That’ll be in the form of invoices and contracts - in the case of the ladies in the tea room they’ll have had contracts of employment. And you can’t retrospectively draft up a contract and turn up with an invoice you’ve knocked up that morning.
If there is nothing stating what money is owed, an invoice, and when money owed which has to be paid by, which would be in a contract or stated on the invoice, the defendant effectively has an unlimited time to pay, they can never default and so a small claims court is likely to dismiss the claim.
In the absence of any paperwork the only way you’d stand a chance of winning is if the person you took to court was stupid enough to admit that they owed you money.
From the Small Business Commissioner’s website:
A payment is late after an invoice has been issued and accepted, but payment has not been paid within the agreed payment terms. If there are no agreed payment terms a payment is late if an invoice has been issued and accepted but payment hasn’t been received within 30 days.
NOTE THE TERM “AN INVOICE HAS BEEN ISSUED.” If you’ve not invoiced them they don’t owe you anything,
164480:
I’m set up as limited company,but you’ve lost me here,does IR35 only apply to limited companies or not…? I have a good accountant,so I just let him sort everything for me.Or is it just a typo error.
IR35 applies to Ltd Companies and not sole traders, no it’s not a typo. Your accountant isn’t a good one if he suggested you set up as Ltd due to the fact that most companies, and especially employment agencies, will not take on Ltd drivers as once the company has a certain number of employees and/or reaches a certain turnover it opens them up to liability for your tax bill under IR35, something that they won’t have to worry about if you were a sole trader.
Conor:
164480:
I’m set up as limited company,but you’ve lost me here,does IR35 only apply to limited companies or not…? I have a good accountant,so I just let him sort everything for me.Or is it just a typo error.IR35 applies to Ltd Companies and not sole traders, no it’s not a typo. Your accountant isn’t a good one if he suggested you set up as Ltd due to the fact that most companies, and especially employment agencies, will not take on Ltd drivers as once the company has a certain number of employees and/or reaches a certain turnover it opens them up to liability for your tax bill under IR35, something that they won’t have to worry about if you were a sole trader.
It must have changed then,I remember before when I worked for a certain tipper company in East Yorkshire that you will more than likely know,they had a visit from HMRC,2 drivers self employed & me as limited co,the company had to pay tax & NI for the 2 self employed & said because I was limited I was fine.
164480:
Conor:
164480:
I’m set up as limited company,but you’ve lost me here,does IR35 only apply to limited companies or not…? I have a good accountant,so I just let him sort everything for me.Or is it just a typo error.IR35 applies to Ltd Companies and not sole traders, no it’s not a typo. Your accountant isn’t a good one if he suggested you set up as Ltd due to the fact that most companies, and especially employment agencies, will not take on Ltd drivers as once the company has a certain number of employees and/or reaches a certain turnover it opens them up to liability for your tax bill under IR35, something that they won’t have to worry about if you were a sole trader.
It must have changed then,I remember before when I worked for a certain tipper company in East Yorkshire that you will more than likely know,they had a visit from HMRC,2 drivers self employed & me as limited co,the company had to pay tax & NI for the 2 self employed & said because I was limited I was fine.
Take advice from your qualified accountant who will understand what you can and can’t do regarding this, plus they will have much more experience in this field rather than our resident night trunker who thinks he knows everything but time and time again is shown to actually know very little, and as far as I’m aware is not a qualified accountant.
stu675:
Acorn:
Hers a. Audio art thought for the OP, in the absence of a contract about when they’ll pay, the operator could agree to pay you at £5 a week and not be breaching any rules. They’re paying, just not quite as quick as you’d like.I think it would be breaking the rules if they changed the accepted terms of payment that had previously been adhered to.
It may be a change to what they’ve done in the past, but that is hard to justify at a claims court. Saying you’ll pay over a long term is not refusing to pay and not a breach of contract.
If OP does work the month’s notice then I’d get it in writing snd gir operator go do a BACS at the end of the last day to make if a clean closure
Again for the OP, the traffic commissioners go. It see bring a self employed driver to drive for an operator an acceptable situation by the operator, not by the driver. May want to treat this as an expensive learning moment
gov.uk/government/publicati … 20business.
It’s pretty clear in SD5 that as far as the TC is concerned, it’s very hard for a driver to be self-employed unless they are an owner-driver, and the operator attempting to take advantage of this situation may very well find their O-licence in jeopardy, and be liable for the driver’s tax & NI.
So the Personal Service Company arrangement and IR35 evolved in 2000 and has taken HMRC over 20 years to actually reform and enforce IR35 in the private sector, utter shambles.