Saviem's fan club (Part 1)

[saviem]

Evening all,

Gentlemen, you know the most enduring feature of running through"LA La Belle France", in the `60s was finding real food, (not, oh never. that awful muck served by the UKs roadside “hostelries”), Fried…anything that could get in a frying pan…stewed…whatever was well dead!..and cold…it always was…no wonder we are a “beucolic nation”!..I am amazed that anyone could recall any “Transport Café” as being above the basic…they were universally awfull!!!

Then there were the clean beds…no, not as many as you could pack into a room…real Hotel style…and always clean…

Many can joke about the Toilette, et Douche…but I defy you to name any in the UK that offered even a little toward what we in France enjoyed as normal…you simply cannot…and just what you missed…When you fired up the old girl, where you clean…replete…(and not with flatulent gaseus)…and ready for the day ahead…I doubt it!!!

You know the thing that amazes me… read any of the threads on this most excellent forum…and the places that you find revered…as a example…“the Bakehouse”…no self respecting French driver would have fed at such an establishment, let alone spent a night there…it was a “doss hole”…Pasteries cooling next to the latrines…for goodness sake…it was terrible…yet frequented by droves of drunken UK drivers…yet only a few klicks away were the almost Cordon Bleu delights of better establishments…I blame the Tilt Traffic…no taste!!!

As a driver, you could live as a Gourmond…or as a drunkard…the choice was yours…

To the lorries…

cattle man stan, that picture that Michel so kindly posted was taken from the position of the photographer with his back to the RN7, and showing Borels “new” fleet of Berliet TRK10s, with the Relax Cab , above the quite delightful Berlet M620Z 9500c 180hp 6cyl diesel, with the M (magic), MAN combustion system. But the big advantage to Borel, (as many other tank operators), was the running weight of under 6 tonnes, with a gross weight of 35 tonnes!

What a sweet engine that little Berliet was, funny how 10 litres seems to be a cap, on light, and easy driveability, as opposed to the “thumpers” of 12 litres and above . The “little” Berliet had a good transmission via ZF 6, or 8 speed, and was one of the first French vehicles with a 10 tonne rear axle as opposed to te normal 13 tonne version.

Borel were saving over a tonne of deadweight as opposed to the fleets original TLM10s with their conventional bonneted layout…but I as their drivers preferred the original configuration…but we were not paid by the tonnes carried…

But Borels drivers were well compensated, but they had to be good, no one under 25, then you had to pass a driving test…(and that was not as easy as you may think), then, whil`st you were on local work, you had to learn all the documentation…(fergie, how did we learn)?..not like Borels men…every detail, domestic, and trans Europe…but then you had to adhere to their safety code…and any overspeeding, or “adaption”, of driving hours meant…EXIT!

A very professional outfit Borel Freres, and one that I found tough, but fair to deal with, and a super professional road haulier, where the driver, was the KEY person, regaded as, true professionals!

Cherio for now.

[saviem]

Sammeyopposite, just a quick note…

Those loads a re nothing…I remember a guy, with a “newish” V8 tr 356, complaining that she would not pull…so being “new in the job”, (ans as green as grass), I shot of with my Service Manager" to evaluate the complaint!

On arrival, there sat the 356, with a spectacular paint job, but rather “flat…but only on the bottom” tyres…1200s!

So off we set…and you more than most will appreciate just how a “big lump” feels when you take control…grief…she could hardly rev…let alone pull…a eluctant visit to the weigh station at Stella est Alorrini…and she maxed out at their bridge limit of 178000kgs…

So then “your man” moaned about fuel consumption…as my predecessor said…“welcome to Italy…they are all nuts”…

And he was right!

Cheerio for now.

[michel]

Berliet TRK 10 from Borel with a Joker fruit juice pub on the semi-trailer.

[fergie47]

sammyopisite:
A couple of well loaded FIAT,s off interweb

cheers Johnnie

Well loaded John ? …they’re half empty, look at all that wasted space above that steel…you wouldn’t have made a very good T.M. in Italy, at least, not in the '70’s…

[fergie47]

Another Borel wagon, loading fuel…

[fergie47]

Saviem:
Evening all,

Gentlemen, you know the most enduring feature of running through"LA La Belle France", in the `60s was finding real food, (not, oh never. that awful muck served by the UKs roadside “hostelries”), Fried…anything that could get in a frying pan…stewed…whatever was well dead!..and cold…it always was…no wonder we are a “beucolic nation”!..I am amazed that anyone could recall any “Transport Café” as being above the basic…they were universally awfull!!!
Then there were the clean beds…no, not as many as you could pack into a room…real Hotel style…and always clean…

Cherio for now.

And still the same to-day John…there’s a big restaurant about 20 minuets from us, we took Mappo there a few weeks ago
(he hasn’t been to France for almost 20 years) just to remind him of the difference between a UK transport Caff…and a routiers restaurant…no competition.
I don’t know if the cafes and food have improved or not in the UK in the last few years, I’m sure there are good ones, as there are a few bad ones in France, although they wouldn’t hold their les Routiers ticket for very long…
Got an amusing incident about a meal in France, when I get time I’ll post it up…

[fergie47]

When I look back to the late '60’s early '70’s in Frace, this picture is the epitome of a standard French wagon, …it looks good, and if it is, it normally is good, and these were, nothing special, just a solid reliable workhorse, …

[fergie47]

Quiz time… You turn up for work Monday morning and the boss hands you the keys and says “here’s your new wagon”

That, gentlemen, is not a pretty motor…

Do you…

1)… Faint
2)…Cry
3)…Ask for your P45
4)…Except the keys and look for a sack to put over your head.
5)…Look for a long piece of rope and a big tree
6)…Thank him profusely, then bin it in a ditch.
7)…Thank him and happily drive off in it…but drop in at spec-savers.

[fergie47]

Early start this morning, 3.00 am…anyone else watch the moon eclipse, then. it turned orange/red ? We’ve got a 6in Newtonian scope, and with no light pollution at all, we had a spectacular view. Once the moon went dark the Milky Way opened up, it was also spectacular, and the Andromeda galaxy a mere 2200 light years away…looking at the stars and planets puts things in perspective sometimes…

Don’t have an attachment on the scope for a camera, just taken through the eye piece, one with single lens, and one with a double, not very good, but gives an idea…

[zb_anorak]

In response to the above: 7. It is not a bad looking machine. Imagine all the space in the cab, a nice flat floor and the comfort of sitting in the middle of the wheelbase. I can think of worse things to do during the day, than drive around the country of fine food and wine, in that.

PS They managed to fit a lot of cab and bonnet into what looks like a short-ish wheelbase. Did French trailers of that vintage have a shorter pin position than the later ones?

[robert1952]

Picture of an ERF NGC European here, registration number 7601RR91. French, of course. Another picture shows it with a flat-bed trailer. Shot in the dark here, but does anyone recognise that quietly stated blue & red zig-zag down the side of the cab? An owner driver perhaps - or maybe a company. Robert

[jsutherland]

There are many old Massey Fergusons still going strong in India. This is one of many I saw. They are very resourceful at keeping them going.
Johnny

[fergie47]

jsutherland:
There are many old Massey Fergusons still going strong in India. This is one of many I saw. They are very resourceful at keeping them going.
Johnny

John. Were you working or on holiday out there ? …they seem to a nation able to fix any and everything…seen a few programme about India, the railways for one, and the Guy Martin doc,where he went to a “lorry building depot”… all fascinating stuff…An American, riding around the world on a BMW, broke a wheel in India, using the old one they cast a new one for him, he completed the journey and its still on the bike years later…make and mend, and sod H&SS is the order of the day, and it works…

[jsutherland]

Hi Fergie,
it was business. But… at the weekends I was free and the Indian colleagues helped me to plan them to see the real India. I loved it. There are a lot of Massey Fergusons there. I don’t think there are any weight checks. So load it up… The lorry size was the restriction, although they are also very resourceful at extending the size
Regards
Johnny

[jsutherland]

Sod H&S… Spot on. They don’t really seem to care. I saw some pretty hair raising sights.
Regards
Johnny

[fergie47]

Friend of Saviems…

[saviem]

Fergie47:
Quiz time… You turn up for work Monday morning and the boss hands you the keys and says “here’s your new wagon”

That, gentlemen, is not a pretty motor…

Do you…

1)… Faint
2)…Cry
3)…Ask for your P45
4)…Except the keys and look for a sack to put over your head.
5)…Look for a long piece of rope and a big tree
6)…Thank him profusely, then bin it in a ditch.
7)…Thank him and happily drive off in it…but drop in at spec-savers.

Evening all,

Bit of a sad old week for me this week. Lost my pal in the village to Spinal Cancer, he fought through it so hard, was pronounced clear, having had a complete blood change, then it came back, so quickly, and tomorrow is his funeral. Why is it that the really decent people seem to suffer, and the rogues carry on regardless?

When Graham first came out of hospital, all clear, he visited us and regailed us with storys of his illness. Graham was an accomplished Aircraft Engineer, starting as a young apprentice at Boulton and Paul in Wolverhampton, and was latterly Liberherrs uk aeronautical representative in the UK for its activities. Graham said that the illness “made him loose his marbles”, so much so that in his early days in hospital, (being an intenesly private man), he took himself off to the toilet…still attached to two drips…After some considerable time, he had not returned, so a concerned nurse knocked, then opened the toilet door, to find Graham…surrounded by neat piles of the dismantled drip components, all in perfect sequence, all neatly arranged…Asked , “what are you doing”?, he replied…“its a rush job, these are needed at Westland Helicopters tonight, please let me get on with it”!..that was Graham, RIP my friend.

Now Fergie, that picture of perhaps the last Bernard , and your questions…

She really was not as ugly as you may think, because there were uglier Bernards, the V8 Mack powered F 700, a sort of ugly Scammell Crusader look alike, whose truly Anglo Saxon Motor Panels “shed” sat over a stonking 260 hp END864 motor, then even uglier were the very last Pourtout cabs on the very last Bernard, (although that marque had but almost disappeared by then), Macks, with their angular cab and bonnet sides…and any true Bernard lover will tell you that the odd looking EFT35, Bernard Mack cabovers with the same cab as the Unic heavies, built by Fernand Geneve, (the coachbuilder best known for their work with Unic, and their achievement of making the Fiat619 type cab “tilt” when sitting over a Unic power plant ) was never really a true Bernard!

But your lorry Fergie, she is a 1964 Bernard TD211, 35 tonne tractor, with a 3.8 metre wheelbase. Powered by a Mack Thermodyne END711 11.6 litre 6 cylinder of 214 hp… with a 10 speed Mack gearbox. But what of the point of your question, the cab?..(remember this is 1964…ERF, Foden, and Atkinson…Garden(er) “wood and grp sheds”)

Spacious…, two seats trimmed in black leather, sound proofed rubber flooring, a 2.3metre long, by 600mm wide interior sprung couchette, pas, (with an elegant four spoke white steering wheel, the air handbrake on a column to your immediate right, the control dials and warning lights easily seen right through the wheel rim. Plenty of glass, front, side, rear, and in the base of the right hand passenger door. Full headlining, and door trim, three interior lights,the passenger seat had twin (upholstered ) arm rests.

The lorry was both tall, and substantial looking, with its cab design drawing heavily on the influences of Phillipe Charbonneaux…designed to be a 60s view of the traditional long nosed classic Bernards…but its 4 headlight face, with discreet “Bulldog” insignia singly failed to ignite the traditional, (and traditionalist), Bernard fleet user…sales fell, and fell…until Bernard, and then Mack were no more a major player in heavy tractors…(the odd looking R serie Mack front, with a Royanne Built Pelpel sleeper cab was also a flop in the market, despite being a true blue US Mack B61)

But Anorak is right, she was a comfortable, and pokey motor to drive…(even when they had a" bit of age" in them)!And they would take a 1 metre pin trailer easily

But then again for really odd lookers there can have been none more so than the Pourtout “mono cab” tractors, with both single driving cab and the 185hp Gardner licence built Bernard MF636 6 cylinder engine way out front of the front axle!!!

And thanks for the pictures of my friend Antoine Loheacs various incarnations of his “Ton Tons”. Now they really were a true indication of engineering excellence…even the last ones with their Renault running gear, light, economic, cost effective, easy to drive and repair, all from the head of one man!

Cheerio for now.

[jazzandy]

Thanks for bringing the Routiers ‘legend’ into reality. I learnt very quickly to avoid any establishment sporting herds of British trucks in the parking. You could bank on the standards being lower and the constant embarrassment of the ‘British abroad’. The false sense of superiority and the refusal to even make an attempt at speaking the language or trying the specialities of the region.

The professional Brits, and there were many, got on with the job and had nothing to do with doss houses like the ‘Bakehouse’.

[robert1952]

Jazzandy:
Thanks for bringing the Routiers ‘legend’ into reality. I learnt very quickly to avoid any establishment sporting herds of British trucks in the parking. You could bank on the standards being lower and the constant embarrassment of the ‘British abroad’. The false sense of superiority and the refusal to even make an attempt at speaking the language or trying the specialities of the region.

The professional Brits, and there were many, got on with the job and had nothing to do with doss houses like the ‘Bakehouse’.

I used to avoid the Bordeaux ‘cabbage patch’ and Victors in Spain for exactly the same reason . Robert

[jazzandy]

La belle France!

Doubs Valley north of Besancon