Reference period

tachograph · 3 December 2013 00:52

internetfan:
Another question for those that know the subject very well:
Who is responsible for monitoring my hours making sure I do not go over 48 hrs per week on average during the reference period.?
Driver does not have access to the system, manager has.

A company has a legal obligation to monitor the drivers hours and to ensure that the driver complies with the RT(WT)R 2005.

A company also has a legal obligation to supply the driver with a copy of the drivers hours on request.

Having said that if a driver is working for more than one company, although the driver is legally obliged to supply all companies with his working time (on request), I don’t see how anyone but the driver can be held responsible if he fails to supply the time he’s worked for other companies.

internetfan · 3 December 2013 05:48

Thanks for your reply Tachograph

“A company has a legal obligation to monitor the drivers hours and to ensure that the driver complies with the RT(WT)R 2005.”

Would you by any chance be able to let me know where exactly such a statement could be found in all these regulations?
This is a very important piece of info you’ve just supplied.

Lets assume the driver has been working for one employer only during the current reference period.

“A company also has a legal obligation to supply the driver with a copy of the drivers hours on request.”

This above is also very important.

Thank you Tacho

rog · 3 December 2013 07:20

tachograph:

internetfan:
Another question for those that know the subject very well:
Who is responsible for monitoring my hours making sure I do not go over 48 hrs per week on average during the reference period.?
Driver does not have access to the system, manager has.

A company has a legal obligation to monitor the drivers hours and to ensure that the driver complies with the RT(WT)R 2005.

A company also has a legal obligation to supply the driver with a copy of the drivers hours on request.

Having said that if a driver is working for more than one company, although the driver is legally obliged to supply all companies with his working time (on request), I don’t see how anyone but the driver can be held responsible if he fails to supply the time he’s worked for other companies.

One company is designated as the main employer and the driver has the responsibility to inform the main employer of all hours done
Its written in the rules somewhere because that’s where I read it

tachograph · 3 December 2013 11:06

ROG:

tachograph:

internetfan:
Another question for those that know the subject very well:
Who is responsible for monitoring my hours making sure I do not go over 48 hrs per week on average during the reference period.?
Driver does not have access to the system, manager has.

A company has a legal obligation to monitor the drivers hours and to ensure that the driver complies with the RT(WT)R 2005.

A company also has a legal obligation to supply the driver with a copy of the drivers hours on request.

Having said that if a driver is working for more than one company, although the driver is legally obliged to supply all companies with his working time (on request), I don’t see how anyone but the driver can be held responsible if he fails to supply the time he’s worked for other companies.

One company is designated as the main employer and the driver has the responsibility to inform the main employer of all hours done
Its written in the rules somewhere because that’s where I read it

Could you please post a link to that information because it’s not in any regulations I’ve read.

rog · 3 December 2013 13:28

tachograph:
Could you please post a link to that information because it’s not in any regulations I’ve read.

The GOV site has changed format and the bit I read in the original is now not there so I assume it has been changed

I do remember the original stating that where the person works for more than one employer under the rules then the one they worked the most for was to be the main employer and that employer would oversee the average … but its gone!!

I can see why they did that because if a driver had two employers working on different reference periods then they could be ok with one but not with the other = daft !!

tachograph · 3 December 2013 14:04

Sorry I missed your post earlier

internetfan:
Thanks for your reply Tachograph

“A company has a legal obligation to monitor the drivers hours and to ensure that the driver complies with the RT(WT)R 2005.”

Would you by any chance be able to let me know where exactly such a statement could be found in all these regulations?
This is a very important piece of info you’ve just supplied.

Road Transport (Working Time)Regulations 2005 - Information and records â†“

An employer of a mobile worker shall

(a)request from each mobile worker details of any time worked by that worker for another employer;

(b)include time worked for another employer in the calculation of the mobile worker’s working time;

(c)keep records which are adequate to show whether the requirements of these Regulations are being complied with in the case of each mobile worker employed by him to whom they apply;

(d)retain such records for at least two years after the end of the period covered by those records;

(e)provide, at the request of a mobile worker, a copy of the record of hours worked by that worker;

(f)provide to an enforcement officer copies of such records relating to mobile workers as the officer may require;

(g)provide to a mobile worker or enforcement officer copies of such documentary evidence in the employer’s possession as may be requested by the worker or officer in relation to records provided to him in accordance with paragraph (e) or (f) above.

Road Transport (Working Time)Regulations 2005 - Working Time â†“

(8) An employer shall take all reasonable steps, in keeping with the need to protect the health and safety of the mobile worker,
to ensure that the limits specified above are complied with in the case of each mobile worker employed by him.

internetfan:
Lets assume the driver has been working for one employer only during the current reference period.

“A company also has a legal obligation to supply the driver with a copy of the drivers hours on request.”

This above is also very important.

Thank you Tacho

Section 11 paragraph (e) in the first link link and quote above â†“

provide, at the request of a mobile worker, a copy of the record of hours worked by that worker;

I have to add that whilst some people will interpret the regulations as meaning that the employer is solely responsible for seeing that a driver complies with the RT(WT)R, I don’t see how anyone can legally negate their own responsibility to remain legal (that’s if they care about staying within the RT(WT)R anyway ).

rorymotorbiker · 3 December 2013 19:22

bejesus I hope nobody in authority checks mine, over 60 hours a week for 2 years, I know the company don’t bother.

internetfan · 3 December 2013 20:19

@ Tachograph

Thank you for supplying those copy and paste materials.
At least I will be able to quote the correct paragraph and show the proof from official documents when challenged and challenged I will get.
Hope other drivers will take interest in the rules and regulations, so employers stop treating as like donkeys.

Thank you once again Tacho and others.
I might still have some questions regarding the rules and regulations but for now I know what I needed to know.

internetfan · 3 December 2013 20:32

rorymotorbiker:
bejesus I hope nobody in authority checks mine, over 60 hours a week for 2 years, I know the company don’t bother.

As far as I know VOSA expects every driver to collect a printout of their hours at the end of every reference period and keep them for 2 years.
If VOSA decided to control your company they would take interest in every driver’s hours and fine you and the company accordingly.
If you were involved in an accident authorities would be very interested in seeing your hours.
If one of unhappy drivers decided to report your company to VOSA and how they push drivers to work over their permitted hours, your company and you would be in troubles.
If you want to take a risk, do, I’m not planning to be one of the victims.
Someone might want to correct what I’ve written above.

tachograph · 3 December 2013 20:47

internetfan:

rorymotorbiker:
bejesus I hope nobody in authority checks mine, over 60 hours a week for 2 years, I know the company don’t bother.

As far as I know VOSA expects every driver to collect a printout of their hours at the end of every reference period and keep them for 2 years.

For the RT(WT)R 2005 a company is required to keep a drivers record of hours worked for two years, however a driver is not legally required to obtain or keep a written record of the working hours.

A company is legally required to give a driver a written record of hours worked if the driver requests it, but the driver isn’t legally required to request it.
To be honest I don’t know any drivers who have ever requested a written record of his/her working time, that doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen just that I’ve never heard of it.

Personally I think it’s a good idea for a driver to keep a record of hours worked, but it’s not legally required.